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spunko

15M in UK with long-term health condition

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Just heard an advert on the radio that made the claim that '15M people in the UK are living with a long-term health condition'. Smelling bollocks, I took it upon myself to research, it's actually wrong - it's not 15M in the UK, it's 15M in England.

https://www.kingsfund.org.uk/projects/time-think-differently/trends-disease-and-disability-long-term-conditions-multi-morbidity

"A long-term health condition [is] any condition lasting six months or longer, such as asthma, arthritis, cancer, obesity, diabetes, chronic pain or heart disease"

What. The. Fuck.

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20 minutes ago, spunko said:

Just heard an advert on the radio that made the claim that '15M people in the UK are living with a long-term health condition'. Smelling bollocks, I took it upon myself to research, it's actually wrong - it's not 15M in the UK, it's 15M in England.

https://www.kingsfund.org.uk/projects/time-think-differently/trends-disease-and-disability-long-term-conditions-multi-morbidity

"A long-term health condition [is] any condition lasting six months or longer, such as asthma, arthritis, cancer, obesity, diabetes, chronic pain or heart disease"

What. The. Fuck.

It'll include old people in the total. 

 

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Presumably it includes raised blood pressure which I expect includes quite a few posters on the Brexit thread.

Basically if you lower the threshold for conditions such as blood pressure or blood sugar conditions as the medical profession has done you end up with more people with long term medical conditions.

If you are over 65 you are almost certainly going to have arthritis somewhere. It just goes with the territory. If you acquired a sport injury earlier in life then you may get it much younger.

Edited by Virgil Caine

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I wonder how many are self declared autists or adhd.

Only last night it came up in conversation with my mother, she used to be a dinner lady at a primary school in one of the more deprived council estates in Coventry.

When she started there were no kids with any conditions bar the occasional food allergy, as soon as one kid was diagnosed with adhd and the other kids parents found out you got extra dosh from the social because of it, the rates shot up and half the school had a diagnoses for it.

My mum was convinced the kids were instructed to play up as the general behaviour at the school went down the pan with kids screaming and throwing tantrums far more often.

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42 minutes ago, spunko said:

Just heard an advert on the radio that made the claim that '15M people in the UK are living with a long-term health condition'. Smelling bollocks, I took it upon myself to research, it's actually wrong - it's not 15M in the UK, it's 15M in England.

https://www.kingsfund.org.uk/projects/time-think-differently/trends-disease-and-disability-long-term-conditions-multi-morbidity

"A long-term health condition [is] any condition lasting six months or longer, such as asthma, arthritis, cancer, obesity, diabetes, chronic pain or heart disease"

What. The. Fuck.

Yeah. All of Scotland, Wales and NI are on the sick....

Its total bollocks.

You only have to compare the figures for th UK agianst other Western European countries and see that 75% are BS.

 

 

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11 minutes ago, Virgil Caine said:

Presumably it includes raised blood pressure which I expect includes quite a few posters on the Brexit thread.

Basically if you lower the threshold for conditions such as blood pressure or blood sugar conditions as the medical profession has done you end up with more people with long term medical conditions.

That appears to be the highest prevalence one from the QOF registers:

image.png.4ebf171a08ebbcf0a02cd1823a557618.png

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I think it's about keeping Big Pharma going. I am healthy as fuck apart from mild asthma which means nothing really But I'm in those figures and some pharma company has a permanent revenue stream from my prophylactic steroid puffer every day.  

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7 minutes ago, JoeDavola said:

I'm honestly surprised it isn't a higher percentage.

I was on the train yesterday and the 4 other people in the small carriage I was in were all morbidly obese. Everyone's getting fatter and sicker.

Avergae adult BMI is now 27, which is in the overweight range, wont be too long before the average is 30 (obese). Half the Adult population classified as having a long term illness when really they just dont take care of themselves.

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I think that this is deliberate.

The creeping expansion of what it means to be disabled is now going so that it will include the majority of people who will then be state-dependent from welfare whether in or out of work.

This ties people into the government and prevents any serious opposition to the establishment norms because it will hit individuals directly.

The absolutely perfect population for a government would be to have them all dependent upon state aid and all working for the same hourly wage.  That way they are going to be totally compliant and you can then control their behaviour by applying sanctions for anything deemed non-compliant.  This also serves to prevent the accumulation of private wealth so that the government can enforce whatever state pension age they choose and you will work up to it, or actively seek work up to it, as you will have no choice.

You then have an entirely subservient population who will behave as they are told and spreadsheet Phil Hammond's dream will have come true: you are all controlled and your behaviour is predictable.

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12 minutes ago, JoeDavola said:

I'm honestly surprised it isn't a higher percentage.

I was on the train yesterday and the 4 other people in the small carriage I was in were all morbidly obese. Everyone's getting fatter and sicker.

I really don't understand how people get obese and not realise. Or perhaps they do realise and don't care. Are there any DOSBODers happy to put their head above the parapet and admit to being significantly overweight who can answer this question, I just find it so strange.

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1 minute ago, spunko said:

I really don't understand how people get obese and not realise. Or perhaps they do realise and don't care. Are there any DOSBODers happy to put their head above the parapet and admit to being significantly overweight who can answer this question, I just find it so strange.

They do realize.

They don't care. Or rather they value their food more than their long term health and short term comfort (as I imagine carrying around all that fat can't be comfortable).

It offends me to be honest as someone who was born with a disability and had to undergo major surgery to get my mobility back, that many people who are blessed with healthy bodies choose to abuse them to that extent.

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3 minutes ago, Frank Hovis said:

...

The creeping expansion of what it means to be disabled is now going so that it will include the majority of people who will then be state-dependent from welfare whether in or out of work.

..

I know that you weren't deliberately conflating the two -- but this is long-term illness, not disability.  That's a different list.

Sure, there'll be some overlap, but the numbers of 'people who are state dependent because of health issues' will be even larger.

[disabled is about 20% of the population. Long term illness is about 25% (pop of England is about 60 million).  So what is disabled + long-term-illness?]

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1 minute ago, JoeDavola said:

They do realize.

They don't care. Or rather they value their food more than their long term health and short term comfort (as I imagine carrying around all that fat can't be comfortable).

 

I suppose so - but how do you get to that point? I love eating, a few times I've been close to being overweight so I've cut right back and re-assessed my diet or lifestyle. Why don't they care - this is the crux of my confusion. I can totally understand how you abandon all hope when you're 40 stone but to get to that point takes time.

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1 minute ago, spunko said:

I really don't understand how people get obese and not realise. Or perhaps they do realise and don't care. Are there any DOSBODers happy to put their head above the parapet and admit to being significantly overweight who can answer this question, I just find it so strange.

I did this in six years of a high pay high stress job and lost is in a similar timescale after leaving it.

 

A typical week would be:

  • early start Monday, evening train to hotel in London
  • early start Tuesday; evening train home
  • Wednesday normal day in office
  • Thursday very early start to get to airport to fly to Zurich for working day then late flight back
  • Friday normal day in office
  • Saturday a few hours working from home

Now if you start picking out the free hours in that combined with the disruption and fatigue from that kind of travel, early starts and work pressure then a sensible exercise schedule just doesn't fit.  It doesn't take much excess input over output to put on just over a pound a month which is a stone a year.  Even though you know it's happening what changes can you make?  I've never been a big eater but I do like a beer and that's 150 calories a pint; and when you're under relentless presure at work you need a few drinks to get to sleep.

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10 minutes ago, spunko said:

I really don't understand how people get obese and not realise. Or perhaps they do realise and don't care. Are there any DOSBODers happy to put their head above the parapet and admit to being significantly overweight who can answer this question, I just find it so strange.

They use food as a cheap drug and feel they have very little to lose. Hence why obesity is largely a problem with the underclass and the working class. Wealthy people value their health more because they value their lives more.

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9 minutes ago, Frank Hovis said:

I did this in six years of a high pay high stress job and lost is in a similar timescale after leaving it.

 

A typical week would be:

  • early start Monday, evening train to hotel in London
  • early start Tuesday; evening train home
  • Wednesday normal day in office
  • Thursday very early start to get to airport to fly to Zurich for working day then late flight back
  • Friday normal day in office
  • Saturday a few hours working from home

Now if you start picking out the free hours in that combined with the disruption and fatigue from that kind of travel, early starts and work pressure then a sensible exercise schedule just doesn't fit.  It doesn't take much excess input over output to put on just over a pound a month which is a stone a year.  Even though you know it's happening what changes can you make?  I've never been a big eater but I do like a beer and that's 150 calories a pint; and when you're under relentless presure at work you need a few drinks to get to sleep.

Yes.

What I will say in fat folk's defence is that society is set up to encourage you to eat really badly.

Most food and ready meals cafe's and supermakets and even restaurats are things that will make you fat and sick.

Add to that the culture of such food being a 'treat' or reward of some sort. You never hear of people referring to an evening walk for an hour or a leisurly cycle as a treat, it's always eating and drinking.

So in a culture where most of the food that is easily available is garbage, you have to have the will and the time to make all your own food if you want to give yourself the best shot. And most people don't want to do that.

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5 minutes ago, JoeDavola said:

Yes.

What I will say in fat folk's defence is that society is set up to encourage you to eat really badly.

Most food and ready meals cafe's and supermakets and even restaurats are things that will make you fat and sick.

Add to that the culture of such food being a 'treat' or reward of some sort. You never hear of people referring to an evening walk for an hour or a leisurly cycle as a treat, it's always eating and drinking.

So in a culture where most of the food that is easily available is garbage, you have to have the will and the time to make all your own food if you want to give yourself the best shot. And most people don't want to do that.

I agree in the majority of cases it is food (I worked with two huge people who would both have packs of cakes on their desk in case they felt hungry during the day, one has retired on health grounds and I think the other may now be off on long term sick as I haven't seen him for months) but you do tend to make that presumption of over-eating.  When I was fat in that job people would be surprised that I ate less than average on meals out prompting the polite question "are you on a diet" because the obvious presumption for someone being fat is that they eat too much.  I have always had a relatively small stomach, and lost every student eating competition I ever tried, and remember one particular woman at the Swiss client who was tiny and usually skipped lunch but on meals out she would demolish massive portions, easily double what I ate for example, as she seemed to have a camel type stomach and metabolism and probbaly ate very little the next day so didn't put on weight.

Whilst I didn't diet I generally ate less than the average throughout, primarily because of my lack of interest in food rather than any effort to do so, but add in the beer calories and the lack of exercise (usually one country walk on a Sunday but that was it) and I was on a slow yet relentless weight gain. 

The best thing I could have had at that time was something like a Fitbit and a weekly exercise target.  When you're constantly fatigued and not monitoring the exercise that you're taking then you're probably taking absolutely sod all.  Whereas now I'm monitoring it I'm up for my fourth 10,000 step day on the trot and this is whilst working, it's not going to motivate everyone in the same way but as a numbers man those daily ticks are great :)

 

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21 minutes ago, JoeDavola said:

Yes.

What I will say in fat folk's defence is that society is set up to encourage you to eat really badly.

Most food and ready meals cafe's and supermakets and even restaurats are things that will make you fat and sick.

Add to that the culture of such food being a 'treat' or reward of some sort. You never hear of people referring to an evening walk for an hour or a leisurly cycle as a treat, it's always eating and drinking.

So in a culture where most of the food that is easily available is garbage, you have to have the will and the time to make all your own food if you want to give yourself the best shot. And most people don't want to do that.

Yup.

I'd add that the food guidelines don't (IMO) help as they don't fully understand the impact of hunger/satiation on people's eating habits -- I'd say that many people who follow the guidelines end up being permanently ravenous, whereas if they'd eat a higher fat diet they'd find it much easier not to snack.

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1 hour ago, JoeDavola said:

They do realize.

They don't care. Or rather they value their food more than their long term health and short term comfort (as I imagine carrying around all that fat can't be comfortable).

It offends me to be honest as someone who was born with a disability and had to undergo major surgery to get my mobility back, that many people who are blessed with healthy bodies choose to abuse them to that extent.

I think for many it's an addiction,  a lot like smoking.

Except with smoking you can go cold turkey.  With over eating it's like quitting fags..  except you need to smoke a certain number to survive.

When I was in my 20s I didn't even think about my weight..   now in my late 30s I find it much harder.     I always used to control my physical condition by varying my physical activity.   The problem I've had is since getting older is I've found it harder to maintain the same motivation to be physically active,  plus work / home pressures don't help.

How do all you fellow quartogenarians out there stay in shape ?  Or does middleage spread get everyone in the end ?

 

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2 hours ago, Frank Hovis said:

I did this in six years of a high pay high stress job and lost is in a similar timescale after leaving it.

 

A typical week would be:

  • early start Monday, evening train to hotel in London
  • early start Tuesday; evening train home
  • Wednesday normal day in office
  • Thursday very early start to get to airport to fly to Zurich for working day then late flight back
  • Friday normal day in office
  • Saturday a few hours working from home

Now if you start picking out the free hours in that combined with the disruption and fatigue from that kind of travel, early starts and work pressure then a sensible exercise schedule just doesn't fit.  It doesn't take much excess input over output to put on just over a pound a month which is a stone a year.  Even though you know it's happening what changes can you make?  I've never been a big eater but I do like a beer and that's 150 calories a pint; and when you're under relentless presure at work you need a few drinks to get to sleep.

If you found the time to have a few beers then there would have instead been time to exercise. Which would have led to better sleep and stress management.. 

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Just now, Stuey said:

If you found the time to have a few beers then there would have instead been time to exercise. Which would have led to better sleep and stress management.. 

In theory.

There are jobs and there are jobs.

Routine 9 - 5 out of the same office every day - no excuse really.

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