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Covid and civil liberties


MrXxxx
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Not sure how wide spread geographically Dosbods is but thought it would be useful/interesting to have a thread reporting how different national governments are restricting civil liberties under the Covid19 excuse. Please report accurately/succinctly and avoid opinions; there are other threads for this/venting your frustration/anger.

Simply type your country at the beginning and give a summary so:

UNITED KINGDOM

1. All shops closed apart from supermarkets/pharmacies/fast food takeaway (deliver only).

2. No gatherings of more than 2 people unless family; police have power to break up/disperse. This includes religious observance.

3. No movement outside of home except for food shopping, 1x short period of exercise per day, medical appointment/emergency or caring for infirm.

4. Working from home except for essental occupations I.e emergency services, utilities, food supply etc.

5. Breach of any of the above means police can initially fine (£30 to 1000), forcefully return you home, or detain/arrest/imprison you.

Edited by MrXxxx
typos
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France: very similar to UK.

Extra restrictions are:

  • Physical activity is either walking or running (no cycling) and within 1km of your home and limited to 1 hour.
  • Every time you go out - for whatever reason - you have to print out a form explaining why you're going out, and date and time it.
  • No "going out for a drive" in your car.
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Portugal Algarve
Most shops shut (supermarkets, chemists, petrol stations are OK)
No groups, no sporting events, etc.
Essential travel only (cops stopping traffic, drones etc)
https://www.safecommunitiesportugal.com/major-incident-coronavirus-2019

Sweden (taken from the article) : "the Swedish government maintains that citizens can be trusted to exercise responsibility for the greater good"
https://www.mail.com/int/scitech/health/9826510-to-cafe-sweden-outlier-virus-restrictions.html#.1258-stage-hero1-1
Pubs & cafes are still open but you must leave the bar area once served.
Some schools closed
Work from home if practical
Age 70+ advised to self-isolate.

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This is going to give the Half Man Half Biscuit lads years of source material.

Next album title?

"Covid 1.9   [ erratum: possible decimal point error ]"

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On 29/03/2020 at 10:30, MrPin said:

Why not post a picture of your naughty neighbour, like in Fahrenheit 451.

I saw a couple walking just now, holding hands. Should I report them? 

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On 29/03/2020 at 09:49, MrXxxx said:

Not sure how wide spread geographically Dosbods is but thought it would be useful/interesting to have a thread reporting how different national governments are restricting civil liberties under the Covid19 excuse. Please report accurately/succinctly and avoid opinions; there are other threads for this/venting your frustration/anger.

Simply type your country at the beginning and give a summary so:

UNITED KINGDOM

1. All shops closed apart from supermarkets/pharmacies/fast food takeaway (deliver only).

2. No gatherings of more than 2 people unless family; police have power to break up/disperse. This includes religious observance.

3. No movement outside of home except for food shopping, 1x short period of exercise per day, medical appointment/emergency or caring for infirm.

4. Working from home except for essental occupations I.e emergency services, utilities, food supply etc.

5. Breach of any of the above means police can initially fine (£30 to 1000), forcefully return you home, or detain/arrest/imprison you.

 

On 29/03/2020 at 10:10, Wight Flight said:

You need to correct point 4.

It doesn't need to be an essential occupation. It just needs to be something you can't do from home.

2 and 3 need an adjustment also.

You can gather as many people as you like in private, it's public gatherings that are specifically mentioned. So for example that picture of a party the police broke up was in fact unlawful, it was in private and so the police had no business stopping it (they could have waited outside and then nicked people for unnecessary travel).

There is no mention of duration or amount of exercise,  Government advice was 1 session but that isn't mentioned in the powers. You might be able to claim 10 sessions a day was un-necessary but I think you would have difficulty to argue 2-3 was.

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On 29/03/2020 at 11:41, DeepLurker said:

France: very similar to UK.

Extra restrictions are:

  • Physical activity is either walking or running (no cycling) and within 1km of your home and limited to 1 hour.
  • Every time you go out - for whatever reason - you have to print out a form explaining why you're going out, and date and time it.
  • No "going out for a drive" in your car.

France is in a state of medical emergency which means that the govt. can take certain measures without any oversight. It has also suspended the 35 hour week and has allowed businesses to impose holidays on workers. The President can already rule by decree if he wants so that is a much bigger power than any UK prime minister has.

The "no cycling" doesn't appear in any law issued by the govt but was advice from the French Cycling Federation. That said the police have been ticketing everyone including cyclists with gay abandon.

Prefects and mayors can tighten up on the national laws. Some towns have imposed curfews (couvre-feu).

Edited by Dave Bloke
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UK.gov are set to release an opt-in "contact tracing" app which can detect nearby cases (really - how does this work unless the general population have been tested and the results tied to their mobile?) https://news.sky.com/story/coronavirus-govt-set-to-release-contact-tracking-app-which-detects-nearby-virus-carriers-11966243

Plan B: UK.gov now have the go-ahead to use (anonymised?) mobile location data to track the spread of the virus (if its anonymous how can it track? As above - relies on population being tested & tied to mobile) https://www.theregister.co.uk/2020/03/29/ico_anonymised_location_data_coronavirus/

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On 29/03/2020 at 09:49, MrXxxx said:

Not sure how wide spread geographically Dosbods is but thought it would be useful/interesting to have a thread reporting how different national governments are restricting civil liberties under the Covid19 excuse. Please report accurately/succinctly and avoid opinions; there are other threads for this/venting your frustration/anger.

Simply type your country at the beginning and give a summary so:

UNITED KINGDOM

1. All shops closed apart from supermarkets/pharmacies/fast food takeaway (deliver only).

2. No gatherings of more than 2 people unless family; police have power to break up/disperse. This includes religious observance.

3. No movement outside of home except for food shopping, 1x short period of exercise per day, medical appointment/emergency or caring for infirm.

4. Working from home except for essental occupations I.e emergency services, utilities, food supply etc.

5. Breach of any of the above means police can initially fine (£30 to 1000), forcefully return you home, or detain/arrest/imprison you.

We have none, it is all an illusion 

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7 hours ago, gilf said:

 

2 and 3 need an adjustment also.

You can gather as many people as you like in private, it's public gatherings that are specifically mentioned. So for example that picture of a party the police broke up was in fact unlawful, it was in private and so the police had no business stopping it (they could have waited outside and then nicked people for unnecessary travel).

There is no mention of duration or amount of exercise,  Government advice was 1 session but that isn't mentioned in the powers. You might be able to claim 10 sessions a day was un-necessary but I think you would have difficulty to argue 2-3 was.

Quite, today I did 12 sets of tree branch pull ups at 6am, a two mile walk at work at lunch, and a rucksack weighted walk this evening. A bit of a rest day tomorrow though.. 

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Wight Flight
On 29/03/2020 at 10:10, Wight Flight said:

You need to correct point 4.

It doesn't need to be an essential occupation. It just needs to be something you can't do from home.

Sorry to quote myself but do you think 'Sorry officer but I can't spend all day posting on Dosbods and watching porn at home' would be a reasonable excuse?

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The European Commission (Brussels) has announced that it is choosing a telecoms operator in each Member State to ‘gather citizens data anonymously through the tracking of mobile phones during the pandemic’.
Source* https://www.portugalresident.com/brussels-to-choose-telecoms-operator-in-portugal-to-spy-on-people-in-lockdown/
*Source is an unknown website that looks legit, dated 01/04/20 - I'm hoping it's a spoof but not convinced.

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Alonso Quijano
On 31/03/2020 at 10:47, Bear Hug said:

I saw a couple walking just now, holding hands. Should I report them? 

Somebody already has!

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18 minutes ago, Andersen said:

The European Commission (Brussels) has announced that it is choosing a telecoms operator in each Member State to ‘gather citizens data anonymously through the tracking of mobile phones during the pandemic’.
Source* https://www.portugalresident.com/brussels-to-choose-telecoms-operator-in-portugal-to-spy-on-people-in-lockdown/
*Source is an unknown website that looks legit, dated 01/04/20 - I'm hoping it's a spoof but not convinced.

Right shall leave phone at home when I go out for my walks now. They can shove their data up their arses.

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1 hour ago, Andersen said:

The European Commission (Brussels) has announced that it is choosing a telecoms operator in each Member State to ‘gather citizens data anonymously through the tracking of mobile phones during the pandemic’.
Source* https://www.portugalresident.com/brussels-to-choose-telecoms-operator-in-portugal-to-spy-on-people-in-lockdown/
*Source is an unknown website that looks legit, dated 01/04/20 - I'm hoping it's a spoof but not convinced.

I do wonder about Thierry Breton though. A couple of weeks ago he advised people to use "wifi" for teleworking to reduce the load on the Internet. Although maybe he thought that wifi would throttle domestic bandwidth.

I have to use 4G to telework because our landline connection is so poor at times.

Edited by Dave Bloke
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The only people I see in person are my parents once a week.

Well now they've put a stop to that, because they're afraid their neighbors might tell the police if they see my brother and I calling over once a week.

Paranoia off the scale if you ask me.

They somehow think that it's safer if they come over to my place, and we go for a walk in public together, the 3 of us. In my opinion 3 people walking together in public for 30 mins will draw more attention than two people going into a house once a week, but what do I know.

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2 minutes ago, JoeDavola said:

neighbors might tell the police if they see my brother and I calling over once a week.

Don't wear a balaclava or fatigues, shouting about King Billy.

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