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spygirl

OMG!!! Save the NHS!!!!!!

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14 minutes ago, spygirl said:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-40715955

More than 80,000 NHS posts vacant, says report

NHS employs well north of 1m people. Thats not even a 1% vacancy.

 

Quite. I just checked and my employer, which is ridiculously profitable and, on the whole quite well run, has a 2% vacancy rate based on a more or less stable headcount over the last 3 years.

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Well, at 1m employees it is 8%...  

But, regardless, this is the sort of bad reporting I hate.  It is just throwing big numbers at the audience, and people have a problem putting big numbers into context.  It would be more helpful if the journo had indicated what sort of vacancy rate you'd expect in an organisation of that size, then perhaps put in comparisons with other private and public orgs.  Also, what is the staff turnover (going to different areas, rather than out of NHS), how long is each post left vacant, etc etc.   It would also be useful to put absolute numbers in context -- are there more or less NHS staff than there were, say 5, 10, 20 years ago?

There is also the matter of agency staff...  Are the vacancies all being covered by agency staff, that have just left post to join the agency?   This is a real problem with the NHS that absolutely shouldn't exist at all for an employer of that size. 

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1 minute ago, dgul said:

Well, at 1m employees it is 8%...  

But, regardless, this is the sort of bad reporting I hate.  It is just throwing big numbers at the audience, and people have a problem putting big numbers into context.  It would be more helpful if the journo had indicated what sort of vacancy rate you'd expect in an organisation of that size, then perhaps put in comparisons with other private and public orgs.  Also, what is the staff turnover (going to different areas, rather than out of NHS), how long is each post left vacant, etc etc.   It would also be useful to put absolute numbers in context -- are there more or less NHS staff than there were, say 5, 10, 20 years ago?

There is also the matter of agency staff...  Are the vacancies all being covered by agency staff, that have just left post to join the agency?   This is a real problem with the NHS that absolutely shouldn't exist at all for an employer of that size. 

Whoops. But over 1/4.

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Current top poster:

'As a nurse and Midwife working for over 30 years I can fully understand why people are leaving. There has been no pay increases, more demand and higher expectations from the public and then they get rid of nursing bursaries. What on earth do the Government expect? You can get more working in Lidl than some health care workers get and there is no night duty! '

Did you see what she did?

' The parking at hospitals costs just about as much as the wages. You'd have to be mad to get a job in NHS, police or any public service as UK gov just treat public employees like carp. '

 

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33 minutes ago, TheBlueCat said:

Quite. I just checked and my employer, which is ridiculously profitable and, on the whole quite well run, has a 2% vacancy rate based on a more or less stable headcount over the last 3 years.

WE have a 0% vacancy rate. BUT if the right candidate walked through the door we would take them on tomorrow.

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This isn't even a story. And it is factually extraordinarily dishonest.

 

They have taken the number of jobs advertised on the NHS website over three months to come up with the number.

In fact, the highest figure they could come up with was 30,000 jobs being advertised in March 2017. So at a snapshot in time, under 3% of jobs were being churned. I would think this is quite normal for a large organisation employing a huge number of child bearing age women.

I would also expect the NHS has to advertise any vacancy, even a shoe-in promotion, so how many of these positions actually exist.

The deception is adding the vacancies from different months together to make up the required number to grab a headline. Why didn't they go the whole hog and say that over 12 months, 240,000 jobs were advertised and therefore 'vacant' last year.

They are also probably guilty of double counting. If a job was advertised in February and March, by their methodology that would be 2 vacancies.

This is a new low standard, even for the So-Called BBC


 


 


 

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27 minutes ago, spygirl said:

Current top poster:

'As a nurse and Midwife working for over 30 years I can fully understand why people are leaving. There has been no pay increases, more demand and higher expectations from the public and then they get rid of nursing bursaries. What on earth do the Government expect? You can get more working in Lidl than some health care workers get and there is no night duty! '

Did you see what she did?

' The parking at hospitals costs just about as much as the wages. You'd have to be mad to get a job in NHS, police or any public service as UK gov just treat public employees like carp. '

 

A story in my local paper only today:

Lidl jobs in Cornwall earning up to £70,000 a year

So I think she has picked the wrong comparator there!

Midwives get a fairly poor deal though; once they're qualified that's basically it, there isn't any advancement and most end up leaving ealy.  There are always loads of training places available for just this reason: it's a job that doesn't go anywhere.  

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1 hour ago, man o' the year said:

WE have a 0% vacancy rate. BUT if the right candidate walked through the door we would take them on tomorrow.

I suspect we have rather more employees than you in that case. I've worked for small places in the past where that was absolutely the case but, once you get past a hundred or so people in most industries you're always going to have vacancies (we have thousands of staff for example).

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54 minutes ago, Frank Hovis said:

A story in my local paper only today:

Lidl jobs in Cornwall earning up to £70,000 a year

So I think she has picked the wrong comparator there!

Midwives get a fairly poor deal though; once they're qualified that's basically it, there isn't any advancement and most end up leaving ealy.  There are always loads of training places available for just this reason: it's a job that doesn't go anywhere.  

It goes up vaginas.o.O

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1 hour ago, Frank Hovis said:

A story in my local paper only today:

Lidl jobs in Cornwall earning up to £70,000 a year

So I think she has picked the wrong comparator there!

Midwives get a fairly poor deal though; once they're qualified that's basically it, there isn't any advancement and most end up leaving ealy.  There are always loads of training places available for just this reason: it's a job that doesn't go anywhere.  

'An assistant store manager vacancy is currently up for grabs in Wadebridge and offers a starting salary of £24,360, with the potential to earn up to £35,000.'

My Nurse mate gets that + a better pension.
And she clears her 38h/weeks with 3 12 hours sfi and 2 nights a month.
 
And Lidl work you *very* hard.

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32 minutes ago, spygirl said:

'An assistant store manager vacancy is currently up for grabs in Wadebridge and offers a starting salary of £24,360, with the potential to earn up to £35,000.'

My Nurse mate gets that + a better pension.
And she clears her 38h/weeks with 3 12 hours sfi and 2 nights a month.
 
And Lidl work you *very* hard.

Grad scheme for lidl/aldi always features in the top ten grad posts. 

What they don't tell you is that whilst it's perfectly easy to get a starting salary of 40k and easily earn 70k within 5 years they work you into the fucking ground. The burnout rate is enormous - about 40%.

Works as they end up with the best people that handle stress well, but you really have to be the right personality to work either in the commercial team in HQ, in supply chain or even as a store manager. 

I doubt very very much that a health care provider (as noble as a career as its is with its own stresses no doubt) could even consider the same level of stress working at lidl in a middle manager role. 

Re: midwives aswel; you don't go anywhere because really it's a set of skills you learn quick and then use every day.

Nothing really changes so you can't really expect your salary to go up as you stay in the same role. It's an example of the way working in the public sector used to be (you'd accept a low salary because by and large civil service was seen as vocational with a smidgen of altruism)

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Quote

Current top poster:

'As a nurse and Midwife working for over 30 years I can fully understand why people are leaving. There has been no pay increases, more demand and higher expectations from the public and then they get rid of nursing bursaries. What on earth do the Government expect? You can get more working in Lidl than some health care workers get and there is no night duty! '

 

I dislike this argument that's going around about NHS jobs.  The average pay rises in the NHS is about 3-4% (afaict).  The 1% is to do with the way the pay ranges are worked.  When I was in the private sector 10ish years ago no-one cared that I was on 0% pay rise.  Which I pointed out to local government staff who said they were on 0% as well.  Oh, except for the 5% spline curve rise.  I couldn't get it through to them that a 0% pay rise actually meant that there was no more money in the pay packet.

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Don't forget, they have made many posts in the NHS now a degree requirement.

Many posts where people used to get on the job training in the past - most of those senior managers would have started off out like this - now have to go get a degree before they get a trainee job in the NHS or, worse, they have to do the degree part-time whilst doing on the job nursing.

When I was in hospital last year I spoke with plenty of aux nursing staff who told me that, simply, they could not afford to do a degree in order to begin training as a nurse, radiology staff, etc, etc.

 

It would be interesting to know where lots of these vacancies are - I suspect that large numbers of people are simply refusing to apply for jobs in certain areas. London is probably one. Some of thw town such as Bradford might be others. I know it is the case in the Welsh Valleys.

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8 minutes ago, The Masked Tulip said:

Don't forget, they have made many posts in the NHS now a degree requirement.

Many posts where people used to get on the job training in the past - most of those senior managers would have started off out like this - now have to go get a degree before they get a trainee job in the NHS or, worse, they have to do the degree part-time whilst doing on the job nursing.

When I was in hospital last year I spoke with plenty of aux nursing staff who told me that, simply, they could not afford to do a degree in order to begin training as a nurse, radiology staff, etc, etc.

 

It would be interesting to know where lots of these vacancies are - I suspect that large numbers of people are simply refusing to apply for jobs in certain areas. London is probably one. Some of thw town such as Bradford might be others. I know it is the case in the Welsh Valleys.

In the public sector there is no longer any differentiation between London and the rest of the country in terms of salary. Housing will stop anyone applying for London now unless they really need the experience that the job will offer. Even then, they will be gone in a couple of years 

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Just now, One percent said:

In the public sector there is no longer any differentiation between London and the rest of the country in terms of salary. Housing will stop anyone applying for London now unless they really need the experience that the job will offer. Even then, they will be gone in a couple of years 

I was thinking more of flight.

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3 minutes ago, The Masked Tulip said:

I was thinking more of flight.

And that. 

Years ago, money was good in London which is why I've ended up here. Now though, it is still crazily expensive but without the commensurate wages. 

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