Death Of London

[MrPin]

1 minute ago, The Generation Game said:

Anecdotally, it appears that all 10m are relocating to the IoW. 

Hampshire's piles!

[Frank Hovis]

This was incidental to a story about snow but, wow.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-55992385

Compared to a typical day pre-Covid:

[Bus Stop Boxer]

4 minutes ago, Frank Hovis said:

This was incidental to a story about snow but, wow.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-55992385

Compared to a typical day pre-Covid:

[Frank Hovis]

1 minute ago, Bus Stop Boxer said:

 

Yes, I enjoyed working in the City.

This Standard piece is bullish, it would be because it relies upon advertising revenue from property developers, but I would say that even limited work from home will mean that 30% less office space is required.  

And that's massive.

https://www.standard.co.uk/business/as-working-from-home-is-embraced-will-there-still-be-demand-for-london-office-space-a4459006.html

[goldbug9999]

The London economy is like wile e coyote that has run off the edge of the cliff but not yet looked down.

[Harley]

On 25/01/2021 at 09:15, Darude said:

Destroying the Square Mile is the best thing any UK politician could do right now, it's a parasite sucking the life years out of the average Joe via asset price inflation. Unfortunately Sadiq Khan is a Blairite who would sooner give a banker a happy ending than string him up from a lamppost.

The centre of London, including the Square Mile, is apparently an area covered by the Corporation of London which is almost an independent state (like the Vatican) beholden to no-one, except those controlling it, and certainly not to the London mayor (they have their own!).

Edited February 9, 2021 by Harley

[Austin Allegro]

6 minutes ago, Harley said:

The centre of London, including the Square Mile, is apparently an area covered by the Corporation of London which is almost an independent state (like the Vatican) beholden to no-one, except those controlling it, and certainly not to the London mayor (they have their own!).

My limited experience of the Corp of London is that it's a properly run council that gets things done. Basically like most councils were before the left conquered them in the 70s/80s.

[steppensheep]

London genuinely looking quite pleasant here. Filmed in "the autumn". Gets a bit busier in the second half, especially greenwich park and the (possibly Borough) Market/ food hall.

 

https://youtube.com/watch?v=FWP41MXLMGY

[The Generation Game]

On 09/02/2021 at 13:54, Frank Hovis said:

 

Yes, I enjoyed working in the City.

This Standard piece is bullish, it would be because it relies upon advertising revenue from property developers, but I would say that even limited work from home will mean that 30% less office space is required.  

And that's massive.

https://www.standard.co.uk/business/as-working-from-home-is-embraced-will-there-still-be-demand-for-london-office-space-a4459006.html

My employer had one of its London leases expiring this summer. They've moved next door on a new lease. 

So our London operations at least are not moving to WFH. 

[Wight Flight]

On 09/02/2021 at 10:58, The Generation Game said:

Anecdotally, it appears that all 10m are relocating to the IoW. 

That would be funny, except the homelessness stories I am hearing are heartbreak.

It really is a case of the wealthy displacing the working 'poor'.

The end of March is going to be very harsh.

[Errol]

More total delusion or nonsense from Johnson.

Pretty much every business in London has already moved to a minimum of 50% of working from home moving forward. The old world isn't coming back. Working patterns have been irreversibly changed. For Johnson to pretend otherwise is just insane.

Train companies and businesses in London should prepare for what will be 50% fewer people in any given week. This is already baked in. He can 'dismiss' it all he likes, but that just makes him look insane.

 

Workers will be flocking back to their offices 'in a few short months', predicts Boris Johnson, as he dismisses the idea of a permanent shift towards working from home

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9305835/Workers-flocking-offices-short-months-predicts-Boris-Johnson.html

Edited February 27, 2021 by Errol

[goldbug9999]

1 hour ago, Errol said:

More total delusion or nonsense from Johnson.

Pretty much every business in London has already moved to a minimum of 50% of working from home moving forward. The old world isn't coming back. Working patterns have been irreversibly changed. For Johnson to pretend otherwise is just insane.

Train companies and businesses in London should prepare for what will be 50% fewer people in any given week. This is already baked in. He can 'dismiss' it all he likes, but that just makes him look insane.

 

Workers will be flocking back to their offices 'in a few short months', predicts Boris Johnson, as he dismisses the idea of a permanent shift towards working from home

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9305835/Workers-flocking-offices-short-months-predicts-Boris-Johnson.html

Noone is going to voluntarily subject themselves to the purgatory of commuting into London now that its apparent that in 90% of cases its completely pointless.  I mean if it had been a month or two or even three, employers would have an argument that it was storing up problem or not sustainable in some way, but after nearly a year ? -  pretty much proves you can do it indefinitely if your still operating.

I think even 50% return is wildly optimistic, could be as little as 10-20% and some proportion of those might be only one or two days a week. 

Edited February 27, 2021 by goldbug9999

[sarahbell]

1 hour ago, Errol said:

More total delusion or nonsense from Johnson.

Pretty much every business in London has already moved to a minimum of 50% of working from home moving forward. The old world isn't coming back. Working patterns have been irreversibly changed. For Johnson to pretend otherwise is just insane.

Train companies and businesses in London should prepare for what will be 50% fewer people in any given week. This is already baked in. He can 'dismiss' it all he likes, but that just makes him look insane.

 

Workers will be flocking back to their offices 'in a few short months', predicts Boris Johnson, as he dismisses the idea of a permanent shift towards working from home

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9305835/Workers-flocking-offices-short-months-predicts-Boris-Johnson.html

What a cunt.

People should be working from home for so many reasons.

[leggers]

21 minutes ago, goldbug9999 said:

Noone is going to voluntarily subject themselves to the purgatory of commuting into London now that its apparent that in 90% of cases its completely pointless.  I mean if had been a month or two or even three, employers would have an argument that it was storing up problem or not sustainable in some way, but after a year ? -  pretty much proves you can do it indefinitely if your still operating.

The frequency of the "when we are able to return to the office" (or client's office) emails that were weekly at the start of all this pretty much died out, after I think, they ran out different ways to recycle the "don't get too used to this" type message.

Over the last month or so getting back to the office has had a few mentions, as well things like "for some reason some clients just want to see bums on seats in the office".

The yearly figures are out and are up on last year, so, you know, what's the problem?

The problem is whatever the figures are, they need to be bigger, more, better! Someone will be formulating the "we're more productive when in the office" argument as I write this.

At my place, going back to the office won't be voluntary, it will happen though. Some people will decide it shows "dedication to the company", or some such and the pressure will no doubt mount into an "expectation that you're in the office" etc etc.

That's probably the point when I think I'll actually stop talking about getting a new job, and actually do something about it!

[goldbug9999]

4 minutes ago, leggers said:

At my place, going back to the office won't be voluntary, it will happen though. Some people will decide it shows "dedication to the company", or some such and the pressure will no doubt mount into an "expectation that you're in the office" etc etc.

That's probably the point when I think I'll actually stop talking about getting a new job, and actually do something about it!

In my industry (software dev) consultancies are selling it to clients as a cost saving bonus - no need for offices with computers and networking etc etc, clients seem to be lapping it up. The phrase "remote first" is getting bandied about.

I did think that clients might turn around and say - well we will just outsource it to India or wherever but they seem to like the idea of people being geographically close.

Edited February 27, 2021 by goldbug9999

[leggers]

5 minutes ago, goldbug9999 said:

The phrase "remote first" is getting bandied about.

Like it. Will probably be using that one!

[King Penda]

2 hours ago, Errol said:

More total delusion or nonsense from Johnson.

Pretty much every business in London has already moved to a minimum of 50% of working from home moving forward. The old world isn't coming back. Working patterns have been irreversibly changed. For Johnson to pretend otherwise is just insane.

Train companies and businesses in London should prepare for what will be 50% fewer people in any given week. This is already baked in. He can 'dismiss' it all he likes, but that just makes him look insane.

 

Workers will be flocking back to their offices 'in a few short months', predicts Boris Johnson, as he dismisses the idea of a permanent shift towards working from home

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9305835/Workers-flocking-offices-short-months-predicts-Boris-Johnson.html

Be taxing them more to discourage this can’t see how it would be policed mind you 

[Errol]

3 hours ago, stokiescum said:

Be taxing them more to discourage this can’t see how it would be policed mind you 

Wouldn't discourage it at all. Even if you taxed London commuters thousands of pounds more that would just replace the previous cost of the season ticket.

They would still chose to WFH due to the time and nasty commute saved.

[spygirl]

On 22/02/2021 at 21:20, The Generation Game said:

My employer had one of its London leases expiring this summer. They've moved next door on a new lease. 

So our London operations at least are not moving to WFH. 

On a new, cheaper lease.

Offices are nothing soecual these days.

No need for an entire floor to host the company mainframe.

Just some desks, enet ports, standard power - whoosh you're off.

Orgs tend to smaller so HQ tend to have a few 100 people.

Switch to a new place over a weekend.

Put your stuff in a box. Get it banned to tge newplace. Start on Monday.

[ccc]

Many large companies are actively planning to have their office space used for "collaboration" type necessity. 

Workshops. Face to face. All that type of stuff.

The general day to day stuff can be done from home. 

Will be leading to 80+% drop in office demand imo. 

[Chewing Grass]

Just now, ccc said:

Many large companies are actively planning to have their office space used for "collaboration" type necessity. 

Workshops. Face to face. All that type of stuff.

The general day to day stuff can be done from home. 

Will be leading to 80+% drop in office demand imo. 

Its probably the only way they can keep costs down, if they don't they will become uncompetitive, for a business having big offices will be like carrying a lead weight.

[stop_the_craziness]

59 minutes ago, Chewing Grass said:

Its probably the only way they can keep costs down, if they don't they will become uncompetitive, for a business having big offices will be like carrying a lead weight.

Like retail trying to compete with Amazon etc, eventually the field is just too uneven to continue.

[Wight Flight]

1 hour ago, Chewing Grass said:

Its probably the only way they can keep costs down, if they don't they will become uncompetitive, for a business having big offices will be like carrying a lead weight.

For now.

Be fascinating to see how they are doing in 5 years with no newly trained up staff.

I don't think this is as good an idea as people are trying to convince themselves it is.

My accountant has already confessed that everything is taking much longer than it used to with all his staff working from home.

[MrLibertyRedux]

1 hour ago, Chewing Grass said:

Its probably the only way they can keep costs down, if they don't they will become uncompetitive, for a business having big offices will be like carrying a lead weight.

In my last place we only had office space for about a third of staff at head office and a number of satellite sites. Every desk was a docking station and monitor/s. Apart from operational teams like finance and the rest, no one had a desk. Everyone spec'd with decent ultra books, phones and tablets with decent data allowances.

Helped by the type of business it was but we were streets ahead of most. I had a couple of software developers who used to come into the office a couple of times a month or for meetings with vendors and clients. Not every role can do that, but one of them had been commuting 3 hours a day, it did wonders for his marriage and saved him a packet.

As @Frank Hovis has mentioned, working from home isn't suitable for everyone, especially managerial roles as you can miss a lot, but if someones job works well for that sort of setup, such as @JoeDavola has mentioned, it makes perfect sense.

When we moved to that sort of operating model everyone was for it. Just the time and cost of the commute made it a no brainer. We had a number of staff who based themselves in the office as they prefered the seperation or didn't have space for a proper working environment at home, which was easy to accomodate.

We even had a stab at trying to make the office less like a cubicle farm.

 

[Chewing Grass]

Place I'm working at, has planned for 50% desks and shut the satellite office.