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The coronavirus swindling of taxpayers


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Obviously when the governbankment guarantees loans by 100% to help the economy, it isn't really to help us it's socialising bank losses again. Despite the fact that this wasn't supposed to happen agai

They know it's happening, we know it's happening They know we can't stop it, we know we can't stop it. At least it used to be a secret.  Now everyone knows and nobody cares. The 100bn p

Our local free paper has started to arrive again.Front page of four is all about how the local housing association (themselves parasites) have secured £1million of extra benefits for tenants.One got £

They know it's happening, we know it's happening

They know we can't stop it, we know we can't stop it.

At least it used to be a secret.  Now everyone knows and nobody cares.

The 100bn printed today was just one of those little rolling ticker items on the BBC news channel during the Daily press conference.   Like ONE HUNDRED THOUSAND MILLION POUNDS being created out of thin air is just one of today's footnotes with the same importance as Dominic Raab blithering on about Game of Thrones on a radio show.

 

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4 hours ago, Democorruptcy said:

Obviously when the governbankment guarantees loans by 100% to help the economy, it isn't really to help us it's socialising bank losses again. Despite the fact that this wasn't supposed to happen again after 2008. Bankers keep the profit on the winnings bets but taxpayers pay for the losers.

The other swindle of taxpayers re coronavirus is that it's enabling bosses at large firms to keep on troughing. Instead of firms saving some cash for a rainy day CEO's have been raking in millions for years. Now all of a sudden these firms needs cheap financing and rate relief etc. The differential between taking cheap governbankment finance and paying market rates is what will keep executive pay flowing. Meanwhile it also gives bosses an excuse to sack workers and re-employ them on worse terms.

Here's one example Tesco have just upped their CEO's pay to £6.2m at the same time as taking a £585m business rates holiday. Why is he having a pay rise when they cannot afford to pay their rates?

Anyone would think that the governbankment are looking after their mates during the downturn. Why are you not surprised?! 

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5 hours ago, stop_the_craziness said:

They know it's happening, we know it's happening

They know we can't stop it, we know we can't stop it.

At least it used to be a secret.  Now everyone knows and nobody cares.

The 100bn printed today was just one of those little rolling ticker items on the BBC news channel during the Daily press conference.   Like ONE HUNDRED THOUSAND MILLION POUNDS being created out of thin air is just one of today's footnotes with the same importance as Dominic Raab blithering on about Game of Thrones on a radio show.

 

The sad reality is most of the population are in favour of money printing because they're either:-

-Too thick to know any different

-Debt pushers or debt junkies (or often both) who want more of the same

-Wealthy holders of assets.

Edited by Royston
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I keep saying it in the hope that it will help some people:

If your long term investment is in cash it is not an investment because for the government devaluing the currency is the gift that keeps giving.

You should only be holding substantial amounts of cash if you have a specific need for that cash in the short or medium term (house deposit, retirement in a few years and big spend planned).

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11 minutes ago, Frank Hovis said:

I keep saying it in the hope that it will help some people:

If your long term investment is in cash it is not an investment because for the government devaluing the currency is the gift that keeps giving.

You should only be holding substantial amounts of cash if you have a specific need for that cash in the short or medium term (house deposit, retirement in a few years and big spend planned).

Unfortunately most people don't have a pot to piss in other than a house, car, phone (all on borrowed money) and a miserably small pension - the idea of holding any sizeable quantity of cash is laughable - if they had any cash then they would spunk it up against the wall before they have time to read your post.

The readers on here are probably not "most people" and I would like to think that our fellow DOSBODers are reasonably rational, but there are one or two that I have my doubts about - you know who you are....:)

 

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8 hours ago, stop_the_craziness said:

They know it's happening, we know it's happening

They know we can't stop it, we know we can't stop it.

At least it used to be a secret.  Now everyone knows and nobody cares.

The 100bn printed today was just one of those little rolling ticker items on the BBC news channel during the Daily press conference.   Like ONE HUNDRED THOUSAND MILLION POUNDS being created out of thin air is just one of today's footnotes with the same importance as Dominic Raab blithering on about Game of Thrones on a radio show.

 

Most people don’t care about anything except tv, eating sugar and doing what the media tells them. It’s dog eat dog out there folks. Take a leaf out of DB’s books and look after your family. That’s what primates do. Pay as little tax as you can and don’t consume if you want to help the ship sink quicker. There’s no fighting it.

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Fat cat pay cuts proved temporary.

Quote

 

Bosses of FTSE 100 firms have been accused of 'virtue signalling' by reinstating their full salaries as millions face the dole.

The chief executives of firms including Burberry, food manufacturer Bakkavor, and builder Persimmon have reverted to full pay after cutting their wages.

Foxtons is reinstating full pay despite the taxpayer paying some staff wages. It followed a campaign by this newspaper for bosses to 'share the pain' in the crisis.

The chief execs of Burberry,  Bakkavor and Persimmon have reverted to full pay. The bosses also received kudos for standing by staff as businesses fought for survival. But their sacrifice has proved short-lived. Persimmon has placed executives back on full pay just a month after they took a 20 per cent cut.

The boss of Bakkavor, Agust Gudmundsson, cut his pay from £788,000 per year to zero for three months from April and will soon return to full pay.

Marco Gobbetti, boss of fashion firm Burberry, which did not furlough workers, will return to his £1.1million salary after a 20 per cent pay cut. Burberry borrowed £300 million from the Bank of England.

https://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/markets/article-8432863/Fat-cats-pay-millions-face-unemployment.html

 

 

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14 hours ago, Democorruptcy said:

Obviously when the governbankment guarantees loans by 100% to help the economy, it isn't really to help us it's socialising bank losses again.

Yep this is exatly what we were discussing yesterday (with a poster who's name escapes me, sorry!) when there was a topic about business owners allegidly buying swanky cars with covid-money.

True or not, the structure of the UK econcomy is such that everyone is just made poorer and poorer slowly over time. My generation seems happy to spend 35 years paying off a smaller house than it took their parents 25 years to pay off, even if they have 'better' jobs than their folks.

I guess the only thing you can do is don't buy into consumerism, find ways to legally pay less tax, and have your wealth in something other than GBP.

 

Edited by JoeDavola
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5 hours ago, Frank Hovis said:

I keep saying it in the hope that it will help some people:

If your long term investment is in cash it is not an investment because for the government devaluing the currency is the gift that keeps giving.

You should only be holding substantial amounts of cash if you have a specific need for that cash in the short or medium term (house deposit, retirement in a few years and big spend planned).

What is the alternative? Every investment is risky. The stockmarket can fall, PMs can be confiscated, cryptos can go the way of the dodo or be taxed. 

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20 minutes ago, sarahbell said:

This is going to result in the wholesale final slaughter of savings.

Removing the incentive to save is really fucking bad though. As it means everyone will get to the stage where they need help and the state has to fund it. 

The more govt gives to people the more they need.

But they can just print more money. Nobody needs to work, they can just print it all forever and we can all live in a utopia where nobody loses out.

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1 hour ago, HolyCow said:

What is the alternative? Every investment is risky. The stockmarket can fall, PMs can be confiscated, cryptos can go the way of the dodo or be taxed. 

The alternatives are those that you have listed plus property.

I am ignorant of cryptos, for the others:

Stockmarket: is intrinsically inflation proof because it makes, extracts or provides the very things that inflate. Over the long term it always exceeds inflation and there is no better long term investment IMO. The cautionary tale that the stockmarket took thirty years to recover from 1929 conveniently ignores that WWII happened.

PMs: can only be confiscated if you are known to have them; buy small regular amounts where you can reasonably say that you have given them as presents or sold in pawn shops. Don't buy a £200k bullion bar and then wonder why the government comes knocking when the currency needs propping up.

Property: one reasonably sized freehold house saves you the inflating rental stream of that property that you would otherwise be paying out of taxed income; own it outright and you can take a lower paid lower stressed job.

 

Risk is the variability of outcome; it's not necessarily a bad thing.

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42 minutes ago, HolyCow said:

But they can just print more money. Nobody needs to work, they can just print it all forever and we can all live in a utopia where nobody loses out.

There are people who believe this is a way forward. 

The government is the enemy of the people and we should be treating it as such

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36 minutes ago, Frank Hovis said:

 

Risk is the variability of outcome; it's not necessarily a bad thing.

I think you could lay the draw in the Man City v Arsenal match the other night at something like 5.8 before kick off. There are probably Government backed bonds that are riskier than that.

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14 hours ago, stop_the_craziness said:

They know it's happening, we know it's happening

They know we can't stop it, we know we can't stop it.

At least it used to be a secret.  Now everyone knows and nobody cares.

The 100bn printed today was just one of those little rolling ticker items on the BBC news channel during the Daily press conference.   Like ONE HUNDRED THOUSAND MILLION POUNDS being created out of thin air is just one of today's footnotes with the same importance as Dominic Raab blithering on about Game of Thrones on a radio show.

 

and the next time there's an election they'll fall for it all yet again.

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Latest outstanding BoE loans backed by taxpayers. Only one firm hit the £1bn maximum so far, German chemical company BASF.

I see M&S have upped theirs by £40m from £260m to £300m. Previous CEO Marc Bolland was paid £17m over 6 years while he was there. His replacement probably fancies a bit more.

   
Businesses with outstanding CP held by the CCFF, and nominal value, at 17 June 2020  
Business Nominal value of CP held by the CCFF, £mns.
ABB Finance B.V. 400
Akzo Nobel NV 30
Alliance Automotive Investment Limited 20
Amcor UK Finance plc 360
Ansco Arena Limited 45
ASOS plc 100
Baker Hughes UK Funding Company PLC 600
BASF SE 1000
Bayer AG 600
Bourne Leisure Limited 300
Brake Bros Limited 600
British Airways PLC (International Airways Group PLC) 300
Burberry Limited 300
Carnival plc 25
Chanel Limited 600
Chemring Group plc 50
CNH Industrial N.V. 600
Compass Group PLC 600
DXC Capital Funding DAC 600
easyJet PLC 600
FirstGroup plc 300
Fuller Smith & Turner Plc 100
G4S International Finance Plc 300
Goodwin Plc 30
Greggs plc 150
Honda Finance Europe PLC 110
Iberdrola International B.V. 100
Inchcape Plc 100
Intercontinental Hotels Group 600
J.C.B. Service 600
John Lewis Plc 300
Johnson Controls International plc 370
Kingfisher plc 600
Lendlease Europe Finance Plc 300
London & Quadrant Housing Trust 300
Marks and Spencer plc 300
Meggitt PLC 60
Mitsubishi Corporation Finance PLC 300
National Express Group PLC 300
Nissan Motor Co., Ltd. 600
OPTIVO 150
PACCAR Financial PLC 80
Polypipe Group Plc 100
Rentokil Initial plc 600
Rolls-Royce plc 300
Ryanair DAC 600
Schlumberger Plc 150
SSP Financing Ltd 50
Stagecoach Group PLC 300
Telefónica Europe B.V. 200
The National Trust for Places of Historic Interest or Natural Beauty 30
The Vitec Group plc 50
Tottenham Hotspur Stadium Limited 175
Toyota Financial Services (UK) plc 365
Vesuvius plc 200
Westfield UK & Europe Financial Plc 600
Wizz Air 300
Young & Co.'s Brewery, P.L.C. 30
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2 hours ago, sarahbell said:

This is going to result in the wholesale final slaughter of savings.

Removing the incentive to save is really fucking bad though. As it means everyone will get to the stage where they need help and the state has to fund it. 

The more govt gives to people the more they need.

Have savings in 'things' instead. Booze, cigs, razor blades, corned beef...

Ultimately health,  fitness and good support networks - being anti-fragile - are the best investment. 

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1 hour ago, Stuey said:

Have savings in 'things' instead. Booze, cigs, razor blades, corned beef...

Ultimately health,  fitness and good support networks - being anti-fragile - are the best investment. 

I can only store so much food in the house. 

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