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I have problems with agencies that reject me for jobs I can do with my eyes closed, just because I don't have a degree or I lack a very specific skill (which I could easily learn), with these I know i

I think it's really tough for kids.They get University qualifications misrepresented to them and assume(very much like I did), that a degree guarantees you a job.I went the Spunko route and got a govt

It's weird in a way that we assume that over a certain age, you just have to have the skills already. I could train people up to do several jobs in my industry in 2-3 months, no matter their age.

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@snark ^ This is the 2nd time today I've seen comment like this, the other was a fabricator who found out during an interview that the employer was offering near-minimum wage - but wanted an experienced time served individual.
It's not new, years ago agencies wanted 3+ years experience in new technologies that hadn't existed 3 years earlier. Morons.

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saw this earlier and didn't know where to put it till I saw this thread.

I suspect the end of furlough will see a lot of job losses

I went into my local hardware store this morning where they're limiting themselves to two customers at a time.Just like Amazon.

https://www.retailgazette.co.uk/blog/2020/09/high-street-bloodbath-sees-125000-job-cuts-since-start-of-2020/

More than 125,000 jobs in the UK retail sector have been lost in the first eight months of 2020 – far higher than previous estimates, new data shows.

According to analysis by the Centre for Retail Research, 125,515 retail jobs have been axed and 13,867 shops have permanently shut across high streets, shopping centres and retail parks.

The research found a previously-unaccounted 32,598 positions have gone at independent retailers, although the majority of job cuts have been at multiple retailers – those with five stores or more, including the bigger-name chains – with 92,917 job cuts.


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18 hours ago, Snark said:

I have problems with agencies that reject me for jobs I can do with my eyes closed, just because I don't have a degree or I lack a very specific skill (which I could easily learn), with these I know i'd ace an interview...... and then employers who won't take me for "simpler" jobs, because i'm too experienced and seen as a threat.

They're looking for "purple squirrels" who will work for peanuts, with companies looking to replace a retiring/retired engineer with 40 years experience and expecting to get someone who has all the industry specific skills that person had. Then they start crying about a shortage of engineers......

I really need to change career, I love engineering, but this BS is going to drive me to an early grave. I can't even go off and work as a sparky, because these days there's a whole pile of cards and certificates you need to get.

You just have to learn to play the game! 

I know someone who (after many job applications) finally landed an online interview.  Being a theatrical type when he was asked about "diversity" he launched into the "I have a dream ......." speech by Martin Luther King.  Since it was  a housing association job they were probably more interested in him maybe talking about access for the disabled ie ramps etc.

Needless to say he didn't get the job.

Learn all the relevant SJW lingo whether you believe it or not and the job will be yours.  It's all complete b*ll*cks so that HR types can feel important.

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18 hours ago, Snark said:

I have problems with agencies that reject me for jobs I can do with my eyes closed, just because I don't have a degree or I lack a very specific skill (which I could easily learn), with these I know i'd ace an interview...... 

You are not being rejected because you cant do the job, you are being rejected because someone else can also do the job who ticks off more if their nice-to-have requirements. Thats just the harsh reality of a tight job market.

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On 08/09/2020 at 20:32, Snark said:

I have problems with agencies that reject me for jobs I can do with my eyes closed, just because I don't have a degree or I lack a very specific skill (which I could easily learn), with these I know i'd ace an interview...... and then employers who won't take me for "simpler" jobs, because i'm too experienced and seen as a threat.

They're looking for "purple squirrels" who will work for peanuts, with companies looking to replace a retiring/retired engineer with 40 years experience and expecting to get someone who has all the industry specific skills that person had. Then they start crying about a shortage of engineers......

I really need to change career, I love engineering, but this BS is going to drive me to an early grave. I can't even go off and work as a sparky, because these days there's a whole pile of cards and certificates you need to get.

See this at our place. A year ago we needed electronics guys for field service work - very large value kit, but believe it or not occasionally we do get to component level simply because this stuff is very niche and it's not so quick to get a board.

So we get these guys in who claim to have a  degree in elctronic engineering and they can't read a circuit diagram. Really basic stuff too. My boss tells me the stories. Good example: bloke who apparently had an electronics degree didn't know what an 2 input AND gate was on a diagram. My boss thought he'd persue the question by asking him that, "if I put a 1 on this input and a 1 on that input, what would i get on the output".  Answer: "a 2?"

Just a waste of time.  Feel a bit sorry for some of these kids cos they have been sold a lie.

It's a mixture at our place. We've got those with an HNC (me for example), grads and in Europe even a couple of PHD's all doing the same job. We've had some great blokes who are ex-forces with HNC's. If it were up to me that's where I would continue to look.

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On 08/09/2020 at 20:32, Snark said:

I have problems with agencies that reject me for jobs I can do with my eyes closed, just because I don't have a degree or I lack a very specific skill (which I could easily learn), with these I know i'd ace an interview...... and then employers who won't take me for "simpler" jobs, because i'm too experienced and seen as a threat.

They're looking for "purple squirrels" who will work for peanuts, with companies looking to replace a retiring/retired engineer with 40 years experience and expecting to get someone who has all the industry specific skills that person had. Then they start crying about a shortage of engineers......

I really need to change career, I love engineering, but this BS is going to drive me to an early grave. I can't even go off and work as a sparky, because these days there's a whole pile of cards and certificates you need to get.

And i wouldn't get too despondent. I think lots of employers still value experience and skills - I think the experience our place has is not uncommon.

I was chatting to the head of a facilities department in a semiconductor plant recently who basically told me they were having the same experience as we were. They just can't find the skills.

And as for recruitment agencies....

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4 hours ago, UmBongo said:

I've been unemployed a few times during the 2000s and it was tough back then getting back into employment. 

 

Anyone over the age of about 25 has at one point or other struggled to find work. The most bizarre thing I've noticed is how a lot of those people forget how difficult it can be, the moment they get a job again... 

If I found myself unemployed now I'd genuinely look for public sector work. All other jobs are just too high risk.

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12 minutes ago, spunko said:

Anyone over the age of about 25 has at one point or other struggled to find work. The most bizarre thing I've noticed is how a lot of those people forget how difficult it can be, the moment they get a job again... 

If I found myself unemployed now I'd genuinely look for public sector work. All other jobs are just too high risk.

That's a really interesting point. It hadn't occurred to me previously but I've always been employed and chose the timing of my move to a new job. I do consider myself lucky. By contrast my eldest daughter is finding the job market very tough. She was a straight A student but that's not enough these days. She's massively overqualified in her current employment, paid very poorly and under appreciated. Pretty depressing really - we are constantly trying to gee her up.

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It's weird in a way that we assume that over a certain age, you just have to have the skills already.

I could train people up to do several jobs in my industry in 2-3 months, no matter their age. 

However these opportunities only really exist for apprentices or new graduates. 

If more businesses were willing to hire and train older people we would soon skill them up. However everyone wants "skills" on a plate. 

It's also very difficult to access meaningful education in this country as an adult. Compared to e.g. Germany where they will offer free training to job seekers, which results in real qualifications.

The UK doesn't have a skills problem imo, it has an education and training problem.

 

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20 minutes ago, Hardhat said:

The UK doesn't have a skills problem imo, it has an education and training problem.

Immigration doesn't help this situation, it lets gov and employers kick the can down the road. If it were me I'd only let a job be given to a non UK citizen if they were payed 20% over the going rate, that way we would find out if we genuinely needed to import that skill.

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7 hours ago, goldbug9999 said:

Immigration doesn't help this situation, it lets gov and employers kick the can down the road. If it were me I'd only let a job be given to a non UK citizen if they were payed 20% over the going rate, that way we would find out if we genuinely needed to import that skill.

Easiest way to do that is double employers and employees NI for non nationals.

Could be so simple as you just need to give them a different suffix on their NI number.

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10 hours ago, Bandit Banzai said:

See this at our place. A year ago we needed electronics guys for field service work - very large value kit, but believe it or not occasionally we do get to component level simply because this stuff is very niche and it's not so quick to get a board.

So we get these guys in who claim to have a  degree in elctronic engineering and they can't read a circuit diagram. Really basic stuff too. My boss tells me the stories. Good example: bloke who apparently had an electronics degree didn't know what an 2 input AND gate was on a diagram. My boss thought he'd persue the question by asking him that, "if I put a 1 on this input and a 1 on that input, what would i get on the output".  Answer: "a 2?"

Just a waste of time.  Feel a bit sorry for some of these kids cos they have been sold a lie.

It's a mixture at our place. We've got those with an HNC (me for example), grads and in Europe even a couple of PHD's all doing the same job. We've had some great blokes who are ex-forces with HNC's. If it were up to me that's where I would continue to look.

Sounds familiar as electronics is primary line of work, my previous employer just couldn't get people who knew what they were doing, they tried graduates and they just couldn't do the job, but i'm wondering how many good electronics guys got passed over by the agencies in favour of them sending us graduates that we didn't want...... The problem with graduates is they don't want to get their hands dirty, they want to sit at a PC and run CAD simulations al day.

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18 hours ago, janch said:

Learn all the relevant SJW lingo whether you believe it or not and the job will be yours.  It's all complete b*ll*cks so that HR types can feel important.

If you did this, could you live with yourself having lied about your beliefs? You would have become an SJW because that is what they do, publicize their righthink in order to gain approval of the crowd.
And if you got the job, could you survive in the company knowing they will be ramming ethics and values and diversity down your throat until you gag?
Several people on here have said working for yourself is the best thing they have done...you'll always pass the interview!

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9 hours ago, Hardhat said:

It's weird in a way that we assume that over a certain age, you just have to have the skills already.

I could train people up to do several jobs in my industry in 2-3 months, no matter their age. 

However these opportunities only really exist for apprentices or new graduates. 

If more businesses were willing to hire and train older people we would soon skill them up. However everyone wants "skills" on a plate. 

It's also very difficult to access meaningful education in this country as an adult. Compared to e.g. Germany where they will offer free training to job seekers, which results in real qualifications.

The UK doesn't have a skills problem imo, it has an education and training problem.

 

I think employers are losing experienced staff and they want direct replacements, people who have all the skills already, even if those skills are almost entirely unique to that workplace.

They also don't like older employees, because we don't just blindly follow orders, i've found myself having "an attitude problem" because I was asking my manager at the time some relevant questions about the task i'd been asked to carry out, I ran through the task in my head and I asked questions about the obstacles I could see, so that I could go ahead and do the job without running back to the manager every few minutes. They like to bark out orders and these days they often have no idea what that task entails, so when you ask questions they look silly.

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12 hours ago, Sasquatch said:

That's a really interesting point. It hadn't occurred to me previously but I've always been employed and chose the timing of my move to a new job. I do consider myself lucky. By contrast my eldest daughter is finding the job market very tough. She was a straight A student but that's not enough these days. She's massively overqualified in her current employment, paid very poorly and under appreciated. Pretty depressing really - we are constantly trying to gee her up.

I think it's really tough for kids.They get University qualifications misrepresented to them and assume(very much like I did), that a degree guarantees you a job.I went the Spunko route and got a govt job at 44 as I had met Mrs P and wanted some insurance in case our family endeavours went awry.

It's been hard-Paramedic-NHS,massively underpiad for the stresses for the first five years.On my course there were loads of graduates,even an art graduate,who needed a job.

My eldest is 13 and I lecture him constantly about getting a degree that will increase his job prospects,and also maybe to consider getting a skill first eg plumbing/sparkying.Then doing a degree.

I remember the unemployment in the 90's and it was pretty bad.I think that's where we're going again.

Lots of graduates in dead end work currently.

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4 hours ago, Nippy said:

If you did this, could you live with yourself having lied about your beliefs? You would have become an SJW because that is what they do, publicize their righthink in order to gain approval of the crowd.
And if you got the job, could you survive in the company knowing they will be ramming ethics and values and diversity down your throat until you gag?
Several people on here have said working for yourself is the best thing they have done...you'll always pass the interview!

Totally agree:)but if you want a job what I said is what you have to do.  In all the jobs I've had over the years they all spout SJW corporate bullshite and you have to just put up with it.  Perhaps I was always in the wrong job as I kept changing to find something with some authenticity and never found it.  The civil service were the worst. 

I agree self-employment must be the best option.  Luckily I'm out of it all now.

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8 hours ago, Snark said:

Sounds familiar as electronics is primary line of work, my previous employer just couldn't get people who knew what they were doing, they tried graduates and they just couldn't do the job, but i'm wondering how many good electronics guys got passed over by the agencies in favour of them sending us graduates that we didn't want...... The problem with graduates is they don't want to get their hands dirty, they want to sit at a PC and run CAD simulations al day.

Forget the character I play on here - it would appear that you and I appear to have a fair bit in common career wise.

I am also finding the same hurdles put in my way by agencies as I search for a new job. 

They are chuggers on Beelzebub's ball sac...

 

XYY

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On 10/09/2020 at 18:03, The XYY Man said:

Forget the character I play on here

You are a decent man, with wit and critical thinking, even when you are sloshed. I'm sure the country is a better place fo having you in it. Let me tell you now, the HR/recruitment nobs who are gate keepers to the job market respond to bullshit, narcissism, bravado, and psychopathy. Ability counts for nothing. Either play their game, or quickly develop osteoarthritis, ME, or depression, and shaft them another way. The only way to beat the a corrupt system is by cheating.

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On 09/09/2020 at 22:03, Bandit Banzai said:

See this at our place. A year ago we needed electronics guys for field service work - very large value kit, but believe it or not occasionally we do get to component level simply because this stuff is very niche and it's not so quick to get a board.

So we get these guys in who claim to have a  degree in elctronic engineering and they can't read a circuit diagram. Really basic stuff too. My boss tells me the stories. Good example: bloke who apparently had an electronics degree didn't know what an 2 input AND gate was on a diagram. My boss thought he'd persue the question by asking him that, "if I put a 1 on this input and a 1 on that input, what would i get on the output".  Answer: "a 2?"

Just a waste of time.  Feel a bit sorry for some of these kids cos they have been sold a lie.

It's a mixture at our place. We've got those with an HNC (me for example), grads and in Europe even a couple of PHD's all doing the same job. We've had some great blokes who are ex-forces with HNC's. If it were up to me that's where I would continue to look.

Really? I did boolean logic at gcse and a level. In fact I knew it by age 11 using power basic. This person  obviously didn't have the qualifications and was lieing

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