Diary of a house purchase

[Green Devil]

6 hours ago, Sasquatch said:

Drove up to take a look at the house today and a quick peer through the windows. 

As usual the estate agent's photos are vastly superior to the actuality. I think one of the windows was so rotten that we could probably have lifted the pane out. Therefore more of a refurb project than one would expect from the details. If it was in Ambleside or some other hyped up place then an EA/owmer can perhaps get away with it. Otherwise, it just a huge disappointment for the house viewer. We can now see why it hasn't sold. 

Great potential though. Lovely spot, proper 4 bed with 3 receptions, 1/2 acre garden, big garage. Small annexe. 

Pretty sure we'll put in an offer this week. We're keen to get settled.

Sounds Nice. What price is that sort of property asking now in the frozen North? 

[Sasquatch]

12 hours ago, Green Devil said:

Sounds Nice. What price is that sort of property asking now in the frozen North? 

Did some research today online and it came on the market at £500,000 in spring 2019. Bought by the current owners for £300,000 in the early 2000's. Had three price drops and now down at £425,000. It's empty and deteriorating. I'm pretty sure they would accept £400,000 (note: we haven't been inside yet) but from our external inspection I'd like to offer £350,000. Reckon £100,000 to £125,000 would get it back up to spec. In the current marketplace and fully refurbished, I think it might be worth £475,000. It's a nice village but not necessarily a premium postcode if you know what I mean, and slightly off patch for some people. 

We've had a good think this weekend and it could be perfect. We have 9 months to run on our rental so could buy and refurbish without having to live in the mess. Even better, we have access to a small builder/handyman who can turn his hand to most jobs and can be trusted. 

Will post more if we offer.

[Andersen]

25 minutes ago, Sasquatch said:

We have 9 months to run on our rental so could buy and refurbish without having to live in the mess. Even better, we have access to a small builder/handyman who can turn his hand to most jobs and can be trusted. 

It could be worth offering to let you friendly builder (or one of his trusted mates) use it as a base, him as "live in property guardian" (look it up - it's often exempt from council tax ), and he does work on the place as payment-in-kind. He gets free accomodation you get free work done  PM if you have any questions  Good luck with the plans, keep us updated 

[Democorruptcy]

19 hours ago, Sasquatch said:

Drove up to take a look at the house today and a quick peer through the windows. 

As usual the estate agent's photos are vastly superior to the actuality. I think one of the windows was so rotten that we could probably have lifted the pane out. Therefore more of a refurb project than one would expect from the details. If it was in Ambleside or some other hyped up place then an EA/owmer can perhaps get away with it. Otherwise, it just a huge disappointment for the house viewer. We can now see why it hasn't sold. 

Great potential though. Lovely spot, proper 4 bed with 3 receptions, 1/2 acre garden, big garage. Small annexe. 

Pretty sure we'll put in an offer this week. We're keen to get settled.

Start negotiating them down before the viewing. Tell the agent you have had a look as you were passing anyway viewing another and it's in a right mess. Ask how realistic they are about the price, don't commit to anything and be sure to offer less after the viewing.

I once saw one at £400k phoned up and said no point in viewing unless they would accept £350k max if everything was OK. They said too low then phoned back a couple of days later, OK then. Viewed and agent phoned next day expecting us to snap it up at £350k. We offered £325k and it was accepted but then we got cold feet and decided against it. It sold £325k so I like to think I did the buyer a favour softening the vendor up.

[Green Devil]

3 hours ago, Democorruptcy said:

Start negotiating them down before the viewing. Tell the agent you have had a look as you were passing anyway viewing another and it's in a right mess. Ask how realistic they are about the price, don't commit to anything and be sure to offer less after the viewing.

I once saw one at £400k phoned up and said no point in viewing unless they would accept £350k max if everything was OK. They said too low then phoned back a couple of days later, OK then. Viewed and agent phoned next day expecting us to snap it up at £350k. We offered £325k and it was accepted but then we got cold feet and decided against it. It sold £325k so I like to think I did the buyer a favour softening the vendor up.

That is usually a pretty good policy. However if youre the first one offering at a lower price its likely to be not accepted first time. However the vendor gets that price into their head as "what its worth" and a few months later thats what it sells for. Its happened to me a few times and ive been very pissed off that i did the softening/negotiating and some one else (usually an agents mate) then gets the deal price. Its worth trying this with a mate. Getting a low ball in first with no intention to get it sold, as the vendor wont accept (if they do you pull out but then you know theyre good to go), then you come back two weeks later and offer the same for a quick sale (cash blah blah).

 

[Sasquatch]

8 hours ago, Andersen said:

It could be worth offering to let you friendly builder (or one of his trusted mates) use it as a base, him as "live in property guardian" (look it up - it's often exempt from council tax ), and he does work on the place as payment-in-kind. He gets free accomodation you get free work done  PM if you have any questions  Good luck with the plans, keep us updated 

I'm not sure our friendly builder's wife and children would be too keen if he buggered off for 3 months to refurbish our house! 

If we do buy it (or another wreck) I might set up a thread for some before and after photos. The property dates back to the 18th C so its bound to have some 'interesting' hidden features...

[wherebee]

11 hours ago, Sasquatch said:

I'm not sure our friendly builder's wife and children would be too keen if he buggered off for 3 months to refurbish our house! 

If we do buy it (or another wreck) I might set up a thread for some before and after photos. The property dates back to the 18th C so its bound to have some 'interesting' hidden features...

if you do, metal detect the grounds first.  You never know....

[Sasquatch]

We've banged in our offer this afternoon. £350,000. This is 15% under current asking and therefore 30% lower than the original asking price when first on the market. Did my usual email with reasons why. The agent rang back straight away and will put it to the vendors. However, she first went to chapter 6 of the Ladybird Book of "How to Drive Up An Offer On A House In Three Easy Steps"

Apparently they already have an offer on the table but it's not really on the table as the buyer has told them not to tell the vendor and that they weren't quite sure if the house was right as they want their mum to live in the annex but the mum is not sure if she likes it and they are thinking about it for a while but please tell us if you have any offers from other parties and by the way this offer from the other buyer is quite a bit higher than your offer and the vendors have already knocked the price down a lot.

Mrs S who took the call just said get back to us when you have heard back from the vendor. Classic negotiation techniques at work. Always try to let the other party fill in the gaps in the conversation. I use it all the time when negotiating with builders on construction projects.

 

 

 

We'll probably be told to get stuffed....

[TMM]

Best of luck to you.

[leonardratso]

who knows.... i have to ring a guy later and tell him to get stuffed, they arent building any new houses you know.

[sleepwello'nights]

We sit here surrounded by boxes of our stuff still to be unpacked. We downsized to a bigger house, but with one less floor and one fewer room.  This move was definitely worse than our previous move. The stuff we've accumulated over the last fifteen years! Our old house must have increased in height by a good few inches (or centimetres if you no longer use proper imperial units) since we removed our possessions. 

The removal company came to pack on Monday. The plan was to pack as much on Monday, finish off on Tuesday drive down later that day, stay overnight and wait for our arrival at the new house on Wednesday and unpack. They rushed us to finish by Tuesday lunch time, earlier than we anticipated. Drove down Tuesday afternoon and started off loading that day. I drove to the new house on Tuesday afternoon to let them in. Thankfully our buyer's money was paid on Tuesday and we were able to complete. 

My wife arrived Wednesday afternoon just as the removal guys were leaving. I think she was hoping I had made a good start on us settling in. Some hope. We've unloaded 15 wardrobe boxes they told me, are you sure I asked, yes, why they asked in reply as they thought that was more than usual. You must have lost a couple I said. They then realised I was joking. 

Anyway the Cornish air, well rain, with strong gusts of wind greeted us. It had howled all through the night to welcome us to our Cornish idyll.

 

[Green Devil]

On 15/01/2021 at 18:02, Sasquatch said:

We've banged in our offer this afternoon. £350,000. This is 15% under current asking and therefore 30% lower than the original asking price when first on the market. Did my usual email with reasons why. The agent rang back straight away and will put it to the vendors. However, she first went to chapter 6 of the Ladybird Book of "How to Drive Up An Offer On A House In Three Easy Steps"

Apparently they already have an offer on the table but it's not really on the table as the buyer has told them not to tell the vendor and that they weren't quite sure if the house was right as they want their mum to live in the annex but the mum is not sure if she likes it and they are thinking about it for a while but please tell us if you have any offers from other parties and by the way this offer from the other buyer is quite a bit higher than your offer and the vendors have already knocked the price down a lot.

Mrs S who took the call just said get back to us when you have heard back from the vendor. Classic negotiation techniques at work. Always try to let the other party fill in the gaps in the conversation. I use it all the time when negotiating with builders on construction projects.

 

 

 

We'll probably be told to get stuffed....

You'll know soon enough. 

If there's another higher offer they will tell you to get stuffed even if it's not proceedable. 

If they come back to negotiate they're liars and you should stall and knock off another 10k after reconsideration 😂

[Green Devil]

On 15/01/2021 at 20:47, sleepwello'nights said:

We sit here surrounded by boxes of our stuff still to be unpacked. We downsized to a bigger house, but with one less floor and one fewer room.  This move was definitely worse than our previous move. The stuff we've accumulated over the last fifteen years! Our old house must have increased in height by a good few inches (or centimetres if you no longer use proper imperial units) since we removed our possessions. 

The removal company came to pack on Monday. The plan was to pack as much on Monday, finish off on Tuesday drive down later that day, stay overnight and wait for our arrival at the new house on Wednesday and unpack. They rushed us to finish by Tuesday lunch time, earlier than we anticipated. Drove down Tuesday afternoon and started off loading that day. I drove to the new house on Tuesday afternoon to let them in. Thankfully our buyer's money was paid on Tuesday and we were able to complete. 

My wife arrived Wednesday afternoon just as the removal guys were leaving. I think she was hoping I had made a good start on us settling in. Some hope. We've unloaded 15 wardrobe boxes they told me, are you sure I asked, yes, why they asked in reply as they thought that was more than usual. You must have lost a couple I said. They then realised I was joking. 

Anyway the Cornish air, well rain, with strong gusts of wind greeted us. It had howled all through the night to welcome us to our Cornish idyll.

 

You didn't buy a place on a cliff with a sea view did you? 🤔

[sleepwello'nights]

11 minutes ago, Green Devil said:

You didn't buy a place on a cliff with a sea view did you? 🤔

We didn't fall for that. 

We're 6 or 7 miles inland and high up. Coastal erosion shouldn't be a problem or increasing sea level because of climate change 

[MrXxxx]

On 15/01/2021 at 18:02, Sasquatch said:

Apparently they already have an offer on the table but it's not really on the table as the buyer has told them not to tell the vendor and that they weren't quite sure if the house was right as they want their mum to live in the annex but the mum is not sure if she likes it and they are thinking about it for a while but please tell us if you have any offers from other parties and by the way this offer from the other buyer is quite a bit higher than your offer and the vendors have already knocked the price down a lot

So basically in about 100 words the Estate Agent said there were no other offers :-)))...the games they play!

[Sasquatch]

1 hour ago, MrXxxx said:

So basically in about 100 words the Estate Agent said there were no other offers :-)))...the games they play!

They're a funny lot those estate agents. 

This particular one is quite pleasant to deal with. However I think they expected us to move our offer up before going back to the vendor. Going to be very interesting to see what the response is tomorrow.

My gut feeling is they will say that they can't possibly drop below £400K. Whether this is because of some phantom 'other offer' or because that's the vendor's bottom line, who knows. 

However the facts remain that the house has been on the market since Spring 2019 and is falling apart. I reckon I could lean on a couple of the windows and they would fall out. It's that bad in places. And the boiler appears to be broken so the house is damp and cold at the moment so pretty depressing viewing.

[MrXxxx]

7 minutes ago, Sasquatch said:

They're a funny lot those estate agents. 

This particular one is quite pleasant to deal with. However I think they expected us to move our offer up before going back to the vendor. Going to be very interesting to see what the response is tomorrow.

My gut feeling is they will say that they can't possibly drop below £400K. Whether this is because of some phantom 'other offer' or because that's the vendor's bottom line, who knows. 

However the facts remain that the house has been on the market since Spring 2019 and is falling apart. I reckon I could lean on a couple of the windows and they would fall out. It's that bad in places. And the boiler appears to be broken so the house is damp and cold at the moment so pretty depressing viewing.

...and as you have pointed about above, the market value of £475k is based on a perfect/refurbished house with a £125k spend to get it there...and once there if you were to sell it you would have expenses....so pointless buying at anything above £350k as a) you would have to cut corners on the refurb, and b) if something unforeseen came up you would be 'in the hole' for that as well....this is where others make the mistake as they buy with their hearts and think "Oh its only another £50k, whereas they would drive 10 miles to save £50 on an iPhone!

[goldbug9999]

1 hour ago, MrXxxx said:

...and as you have pointed about above, the market value of £475k is based on a perfect/refurbished house with a £125k spend to get it there...and once there if you were to sell it you would have expenses....so pointless buying at anything above £350k as a) you would have to cut corners on the refurb, and b) if something unforeseen came up you would be 'in the hole' for that as well....this is where others make the mistake as they buy with their hearts and think "Oh its only another £50k, whereas they would drive 10 miles to save £50 on an iPhone!

I've always found when looking at houses that poor condition isn't discounted very much unless it requires major work, so I guess the best buys are the ones that are immaculate or completely falling apart.

[Sasquatch]

Not heard from the agent yet. 

Is it a game of 'who blinks first'?

[Green Devil]

1 hour ago, Sasquatch said:

Not heard from the agent yet. 

Is it a game of 'who blinks first'?

Waiting is in their favour as the house is still on the market. Attracting potential new viewers. I think agent deliberately take Mondays off or ignore all offers so all those offers from buyers sit and stew for another 24hrs. As I said they won't sell it for less than what they perceive as market value unless they are certain there are no other buyers. 

[Sasquatch]

Got a no.

Not entirely surprised to be honest. Anyone who has a house on the market that they are not living in and is falling apart is perhaps not thinking entirely logically. 

Apparently they will not consider any offers unless there is a 4 at the front. 

We're viewing again next week but I don't think this is the one for us.

 

 

[leonardratso]

56 minutes ago, Sasquatch said:

Got a no.

Not entirely surprised to be honest. Anyone who has a house on the market that they are not living in and is falling apart is perhaps not thinking entirely logically. 

Apparently they will not consider any offers unless there is a 4 at the front. 

We're viewing again next week but I don't think this is the one for us.

 

 

hold....hold....not yet.....hold.....

[eek]

58 minutes ago, Sasquatch said:

Got a no.

Not entirely surprised to be honest. Anyone who has a house on the market that they are not living in and is falling apart is perhaps not thinking entirely logically. 

Apparently they will not consider any offers unless there is a 4 at the front. 

We're viewing again next week but I don't think this is the one for us.

 

 

Why bother given that you know it's worth £475k max and needs £125k of work. 

Just wish them luck and move on  to the next option.

[Sasquatch]

14 minutes ago, eek said:

Why bother given that you know it's worth £475k max and needs £125k of work. 

Just wish them luck and move on  to the next option.

It's no big deal to view again. In any case we might decide to reconfirm our original thoughts but knock off another £10,000 because there's no way we would be able complete before the end of the stamp duty holiday. 

I'm sure that would go down well...

 

[Democorruptcy]

3 hours ago, Sasquatch said:

Got a no.

Not entirely surprised to be honest. Anyone who has a house on the market that they are not living in and is falling apart is perhaps not thinking entirely logically. 

Apparently they will not consider any offers unless there is a 4 at the front. 

We're viewing again next week but I don't think this is the one for us.

 

 

I can't believe you are viewing again, instead of letting them stew a bit. You are justifying their price.