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Electric Winches - Advice from Engineering bods for my potential boat project


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I am currently looking at a yacht with has a lift keel with failed manual hydraulic pump. This boat has been built with a proper Cast iron lift keel weighting about 1000

Im keen on the boat because the women who is selling it just wants to get rid and will sell it for peanuts. However I don't want to be stuck with yacht with a 1000lb lump of iron stuck in place. 

As an alternative to a hydraulic pump I thought you could use an electric winch - like what you might have on a trailer or car. While it is straight forward to me these can easily lift the keel the other issue is dropping the keel - is the release of cable controlled or does it free spool?

Freespool is a no no because a 1000lb dropping 5 feet freefall is likely to tear the bottom of the boat out. 

This is the sort of thing I am thinking about. 

https://www.machinemart.co.uk/p/warrior-ninja-907kg-12v-dc-steel-rope-winch/

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Hydraulics are simple to fix (providing no machining needed ) and diagnose ,the chances are the seals are fucked in the hand pump 

No winch designed to lift (a hoist) should free-spool under load as that would be dangerous. A winch should have sufficient mechanical advantage that the doesn't inadvertently happen. Perhap

It will fall at the same rate as it lifts ,as it will have a huge reduction in the gearbox ,it will be driven down by the motor

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8 minutes ago, Kurt Barlow said:

I am currently looking at a yacht with has a lift keel with failed manual hydraulic pump. This boat has been built with a proper Cast iron lift keel weighting about 1000

Im keen on the boat because the women who is selling it just wants to get rid and will sell it for peanuts. However I don't want to be stuck with yacht with a 1000lb lump of iron stuck in place. 

As an alternative to a hydraulic pump I thought you could use an electric winch - like what you might have on a trailer or car. While it is straight forward to me these can easily lift the keel the other issue is dropping the keel - is the release of cable controlled or does it free spool?

Freespool is a no no because a 1000lb dropping 5 feet freefall is likely to tear the bottom of the boat out. 

This is the sort of thing I am thinking about. 

https://www.machinemart.co.uk/p/warrior-ninja-907kg-12v-dc-steel-rope-winch/

Let’s cut to the chase. Do you have a pair of yellow wellies?  If not, no matter what you do, you will never be accepted into the yacht club. 
 

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14 minutes ago, Kurt Barlow said:

I am currently looking at a yacht with has a lift keel with failed manual hydraulic pump. This boat has been built with a proper Cast iron lift keel weighting about 1000

Im keen on the boat because the women who is selling it just wants to get rid and will sell it for peanuts. However I don't want to be stuck with yacht with a 1000lb lump of iron stuck in place. 

As an alternative to a hydraulic pump I thought you could use an electric winch - like what you might have on a trailer or car. While it is straight forward to me these can easily lift the keel the other issue is dropping the keel - is the release of cable controlled or does it free spool?

Freespool is a no no because a 1000lb dropping 5 feet freefall is likely to tear the bottom of the boat out. 

This is the sort of thing I am thinking about. 

https://www.machinemart.co.uk/p/warrior-ninja-907kg-12v-dc-steel-rope-winch/

No winch designed to lift (a hoist) should free-spool under load as that would be dangerous.

A winch should have sufficient mechanical advantage that the doesn't inadvertently happen.

Perhaps all you need is a chain block.

https://www.uktoolbox.com/products/draper-chain-hoistchain-block-05-tonne.html

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9 minutes ago, Chewing Grass said:

No winch designed to lift (a hoist) should free-spool under load as that would be dangerous.

A winch should have sufficient mechanical advantage that the doesn't inadvertently happen.

Perhaps all you need is a chain block.

https://www.uktoolbox.com/products/draper-chain-hoistchain-block-05-tonne.html

Cheers. Ideally Id like something on a remote control I can do from the cockpit especially I am likely to do a fair amount of single handed sailing. 

That said something like that would be handy in the event of the electric hoist failing although you would need to get the top of the keel close to the block. 

21 minutes ago, One percent said:

Let’s cut to the chase. Do you have a pair of yellow wellies?  If not, no matter what you do, you will never be accepted into the yacht club. 
 

You had much experience around Essex Marinas / docks? :D

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2 minutes ago, Kurt Barlow said:

Cheers. Ideally Id like something on a remote control I can do from the cockpit especially I am likely to do a fair amount of single handed sailing. 

That said something like that would be handy in the event of the electric hoist failing although you would need to get the top of the keel close to the block. 

You had much experience around Essex Marinas / docks? :D

A lady never tells.  o.O

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9 minutes ago, Kurt Barlow said:

Cheers

So something like this might do the job?

https://www.screwfix.com/p/hilka-pro-craft-500kg-electric-hoist/72809?

The keel is sitting in water with much of the weight at the bottom in the keel bomb so this will offset some of the lift requirement. 

Should do.

Note that it is really a 250kg hoist plus a block.  I suppose it doesn't make any difference as long as it isn't too slow to lift with the block.

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Have a small swing lift( 150kg), these designed to dead lift rated weight, not looked inside but sure it has a mechanical clutch that limits lift to rated weight with an adjuster, was going to use what you linked above as a gantry lift mounting it to a bearing dolly on an RSJ beam, suspect it will have similar clutch /limit mechanism and  should do what you want it to do with appropriate mounting. 

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10 minutes ago, Kurt Barlow said:

Cheers. Ideally Id like something on a remote control I can do from the cockpit especially I am likely to do a fair amount of single handed sailing. 

That said something like that would be handy in the event of the electric hoist failing although you would need to get the top of the keel close to the block. 

You had much experience around Essex Marinas / docks? :D

You can buy wireless pendants on Ebay that communicate with a replacement relay control unit.

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3 minutes ago, dgul said:

Should do.

Note that it is really a 250kg hoist plus a block.  I suppose it doesn't make any difference as long as it isn't too slow to lift with the block.

I would size appropriately. This looks more suitable. 

https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B01M02HFO6/ref=sspa_dk_detail_3?

Lift speed is about 5 metres a minute which is fine. The hoist would need to lift 1000lb keel 152cm. A proportion will be below the water line. 

Its the drop speed that is more critical / of interest. 

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1 minute ago, One percent said:

That’s not useful. Useful is drinking gin.  

Never. Gin is the tacky pre-cum of Beelzebub.

A firm favourite of scruffy old drunken actors reeking of piss, who claim to have once worked with "Larry".

Aye, Larry fucking Grayson...

 

XYY

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17 minutes ago, onlyme said:

Have a small swing lift( 150kg), these designed to dead lift rated weight, not looked inside but sure it has a mechanical clutch that limits lift to rated weight with an adjuster, was going to use what you linked above as a gantry lift mounting it to a bearing dolly on an RSJ beam, suspect it will have similar clutch /limit mechanism and  should do what you want it to do with appropriate mounting. 

When you use this is the descent controlled in the same way as a lift. I assume if lifting an engine block you don't want it hitting the floor at 10m/s2

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Just now, Kurt Barlow said:

When you use this is the descent controlled in the same way as a lift. I assume if lifting an engine block you don't want it hitting the floor at 10m/s2

Here you are, if you lived in Yankee land you could get this which would exactly do what you want.

https://www.amazon.com/RUGCEL-Electric-2000lb-Single-Waterproof/dp/B07VG9CF6Q

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Just now, Kurt Barlow said:

When you use this is the descent controlled in the same way as a lift. I assume if lifting an engine block you don't want it hitting the floor at 10m/s2

Yes, the gearbox can't freewheel, there is no mechanical dog / latch / directon control lever - just the up and down switches on the (wired) pendant, it will  hold the weight indefinitely unpowered (up to the clutch weight. You probably want additional mechanical / electrical lockout so that it would never operate without you wanting it to and also maybe something like a locking pin token the keel in the lifted position regardless.

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3 minutes ago, Kurt Barlow said:

Do you any advice on hoists? 

None whatsoever.

I'm just bored shitless with your "look how much money I've got to spunk on shit" posts - that ask for advice about stuff that you have no intention of heeding at all. Indeed, you will strongly disagree with pretty much any advice proffered.

Almost every topic you start follows this pattern, and it really is indicative of what a complete and utter cunt you are...

 

XYY

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5 minutes ago, Chewing Grass said:

Here you are, if you lived in Yankee land you could get this which would exactly do what you want.

https://www.amazon.com/RUGCEL-Electric-2000lb-Single-Waterproof/dp/B07VG9CF6Q

No they free spool and taking note of what DGUL said about winches and hoists. 

1 minute ago, The XYY Man said:

None whatsoever.

I'm just bored shitless with your "look how much money I've got to spunk on shit" posts - that ask for advice about stuff that you have no intention of heeding at all. Indeed, you will strongly disagree with pretty much any advice proffered.

Almost every topic you start follows this pattern, and it really is indicative of what a complete and utter cunt you are...

 

XYY

Get a job ya lazy cunt. 

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2 minutes ago, onlyme said:

Yes, the gearbox can't freewheel, there is no mechanical dog / latch / directon control lever - just the up and down switches on the (wired) pendant, it will  hold the weight indefinitely unpowered (up to the clutch weight. You probably want additional mechanical / electrical lockout so that it would never operate without you wanting it to and also maybe something like a locking pin token the keel in the lifted position regardless.

There are keel pins to lock the keel in place raised and lowered. Particularly useful if you go and roll the boat 180 degrees. 

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