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Is full time work going out of fashion?


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Not sure if this is part of any wider pattern or whether I'm just seeing something where it's not there, but I know there are a few people here who have chosen to work fewer hours rather than chase earning as much as possible via full time (or longer) hours.

I can also think of a few other instances that I heard of recently that I can perhaps link to the same pattern:

1. Mate who works 3 shifts a week in Tesco has no plans to ever work 'on the books' more than that. Couple of kids so getting benefits no doubt. Bought a cheap council house at the bottom of the crash for £60K and has no intention to move - nice cheap easy life. Has more spending money than anyone I know somehow. Fair play, he did the right thing. Not a penny he earned ever went to either a landlord or the tax man.

2. The dental hygenist that worked at my NHS practice is quitting - she was really good at her job, still quite young, and I'd guess earning really good money as since the lockdown you have to pay for a double session to get her. But during the lockdown she apparently started some online makeup/beauty thing that took off; whilst she maybe had hit gold I'd imagine she's just decided that it's better to take a pay cut and be at home with the kids more rather than stare into people's gobs all day, and who can blame her.

3. Northern Ireland civil service apparently has 1500 posts that it can't find people for. I was shocked when I heard this; now fair enough maybe there isn't qualified people, but I'd also guess this is perhaps indicitive of there being a shortage of people that really want to work a full time job, especially if it's at the lower end of the Civil Service salary bands.

So is this an indication of more and more of the population frankly not being arsed with working full time if they can find a way out of it? I've also mentioned that everyone I know who owns a house is never planning on moving from that house i.e. is refusing to paricipate in the ludicirous prices in the 2020 housing market where a 2.5 bed semi which was £200K in 2013 is now £300K*.

Is this an indication of a gradual lack of enthusiasm in terms of 'participating' (and therefore handing over the most tax) in the economy?

* like this (I grew up on this street, and left in 2000 when this house would have been about £70K.... maybe £80K max):

https://www.propertypal.com/91-onslow-parade-belfast/667014/photo-2

Edited by JoeDavola
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I thought that this pandemic would affect working intentions in a from pretty narrow viewpoint of just those coming towards the endow their career pulling the rip chord early and retiring. In hindsight for many reasons I suspect that it will cause a much more widespread reassessment and that is before the taxes go up and the restrictions hang around for longer than anticipated.

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2 minutes ago, JoeDavola said:

3. Northern Ireland civil service apparently has 1500 posts that it can't find people for. 

Civil Service in Wales has thousands of posts they can't find people for.

Most of them have been working from home, on full pay, since March.

They've simply been forgotten about.

Prior to the pandemic they never did much, now they do even less.

Now and again, we see the odd one or two around town, or in Spoons.

Hard to spot them because they wear a disguise.

Masks, scarves, hats, and dark glasses.

They'll be pissed off about the pay freeze.  :)

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2 minutes ago, Fully Detached said:

For me, yes. Fuck them. I used to fly all over the world, losing my weekends to travel, spending all week away from my wife and home, and doing a job that stressed me out no end. I earned a lot, I paid and generated a fuck load of personal and business taxes for the government.

And I just don't see what I was getting for my money and for the impact on my home life and mental and physical health. So I decided to vote with my feet. In business I always had the approach that a deal needs to be mutually beneficial to both sides or it will either not get made, or it will end badly at some point in the near future.

The UK government do not understand this. They think you're just a bitch to make them money. They need to be taught otherwise, and the only peaceful way to do this is to withdraw your participation.

Very well put.

I think this is why I was losing my shit over the last few weeks when the new boss that came in was trying to get us to take on extra responsibilities in new areas (for his benefit) for no extra money - there has to be some reward for toil otherwise gradually people will see that "the cake is a lie" *

And how can one be enthusiastic about grafting hard when there is no pay rise and when houses appear to be rising at a faster rate than most people could possibly save.....oh and the entire country is under varying severities of house arrest.

* the cake is a lie:

https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=the cake is a lie

image.png.fa57676f68d481aae9ded88b8b10738f.png

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11 minutes ago, Fully Detached said:

For me, yes. Fuck them. I used to fly all over the world, losing my weekends to travel, spending all week away from my wife and home, and doing a job that stressed me out no end. I earned a lot, I paid and generated a fuck load of personal and business taxes for the government.

And I just don't see what I was getting for my money and for the impact on my home life and mental and physical health. So I decided to vote with my feet. In business I always had the approach that a deal needs to be mutually beneficial to both sides or it will either not get made, or it will end badly at some point in the near future.

The UK government do not understand this. They think you're just a bitch to make them money. They need to be taught otherwise, and the only peaceful way to do this is to withdraw your participation.

I’m not sure they’ll get any message though.

This is what I mean about how people on here haven’t really adjusted their views post-coronavirus response.

Edited by SNACR
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There are those for whom full time work is pointless. The benefits class. Others who don't need a full time income and don't see the point in putting in the hours to pay so much tax. Most of these either own their home or have a high hourly rate. Then there are those who don't yet find themselves in either position.

This is what communism does. No point working harder if you don't see the income from it. Greater rewards come from playing the system than from working hard.

Edited by Yadda yadda yadda
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2 minutes ago, SNACR said:

I’m not sure they’ll get any message though.

This is what I mean about how people on here haven’t really adjusted their views post-coronavirus response.

No I think you're absolutely right - I shouldn't have said they should be taught otherwise, more that there's no point taking part in a relationship that's so completely one-sided. When enough people vote with their feet, the whole thing presumably falls over and perhaps there's more hope for future generations. If I'm right then great, if I'm wrong then I hope at least on my death bed I will be grateful for the fact that I chose to not willingly take a butt-fucking for the better years of my life.

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9 minutes ago, JoeDavola said:

Very well put.

I think this is why I was losing my shit over the last few weeks when the new boss that came in was trying to get us to take on extra responsibilities in new areas (for his benefit) for no extra money - there has to be some reward for toil otherwise gradually people will see that "the cake is a lie" *

And how can one be enthusiastic about grafting hard when there is no pay rise and when houses appear to be rising at a faster rate than most people could possibly save.....oh and the entire country is under varying severities of house arrest.

* the cake is a lie:

https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=the cake is a lie

image.png.fa57676f68d481aae9ded88b8b10738f.png

Yep - to be fair I think employers have always played the "wave the cake" game. I remember the guy who wrote Freakonomics explaining nearly 20 years ago that the job of a Chief Executive was largely to provide aspiration to the senior management people below him/her so that they would work themselves to death in the hope that they too might one day earn hundreds of k's and spend half their life playing golf and eating in fancy restaurants.

But with employment it's voluntary, and you can decide at any moment that this deal doesn't work for you any more - if they keep pulling the cake away you can choose to go to another job. With government, you can't (practically) decide to switch to a different tax regime - the only thing you can do is stop taking part.

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15 minutes ago, JoeDavola said:

Very well put.

I think this is why I was losing my shit over the last few weeks when the new boss that came in was trying to get us to take on extra responsibilities in new areas (for his benefit) for no extra money - there has to be some reward for toil otherwise gradually people will see that "the cake is a lie" *

And how can one be enthusiastic about grafting hard when there is no pay rise and when houses appear to be rising at a faster rate than most people could possibly save.....oh and the entire country is under varying severities of house arrest.

* the cake is a lie:

https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=the cake is a lie

image.png.fa57676f68d481aae9ded88b8b10738f.png

Employment is a simple transaction. Your labour for monetary recompense.  They pay x, you do y.  If they also want z, you need more money.  
 

as a colleague once explained to me.  What’s the difference between a professional and an amateur?  A professional gets paid, an amateur does it for nothing. I’m a professional   :)

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Avoiding PAYE. Thats the key if you can.

It then all fits into place.

Not easy but if you have a skill.

The system though makes it a lot easier not to. Increasingly so.

So in answer to @JoeDavola yes. It is.

And so is lost a heck of a lot of bright folk who could be innovators and employers.

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45 minutes ago, JoeDavola said:

 

2. The dental hygenist that worked at my NHS practice is quitting - she was really good at her job, still quite young, and I'd guess earning really good money as since the lockdown you have to pay for a double session to get her. But during the lockdown she apparently started some online makeup/beauty thing that took off; whilst she maybe had hit gold I'd imagine she's just decided that it's better to take a pay cut and be at home with the kids more rather than stare into people's gobs all day, and who can blame her.

 

I don't know what the situation now but hygeninsts, because they they are not emergency treatment and whaver they do sprays liquids I guess, would have been hit hard by the lockdown, probably worse than dentists

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Just now, Bear Hug said:

I don't know what the situation now but hygeninsts, because they they are not emergency treatment and whaver they do sprays liquids I guess, would have been hit hard by the lockdown, probably worse than dentists

Mine wasn't - in fact in post-covid, in order to see the dentist for a check up you have to also book the hygenist at the same time for some reson. For a double session. Which brings minimum check up and hygenist cost to £80.

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Given Hancock's pronouncement earlier:

Quote

Don't go to work when sick, 'peculiar' Brits told

They clearly want the private sector to adopt the same approach to sick leave as the Civil Service and other government workers.

[ie, if you can think up any excuse to not turn up, don't turn up.  And consider not turning up even if you've not got an excuse.  And that is what sick leave is for.  (Civil Service Manual, section 14.2.7 'Sick Leave, Uncertified')

That'll end up with everyone effectively working* part time but getting full time pay.  Yeah!

[* note some people might work considerably less time, due to companies folding because they're insufficiently competitive.  But that's just another reason why the private sector is inferior to the public sector which is free to continue operating no matter how many people turn up for work, or how much productive effort they put in]

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6 minutes ago, JoeDavola said:

Mine wasn't - in fact in post-covid, in order to see the dentist for a check up you have to also book the hygenist at the same time for some reson. For a double session. Which brings minimum check up and hygenist cost to £80.

Thanks, I didn't know. Wasn't even attempting to book one as mine cancelled in June, and I haven't heard from them since. 

Will try tomorrow. 

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I got fed up with supporting other people that didn't pull their weight.

I now earn 33% of what I did when I was PAYE. I break even each year. (This year I've not earned a penny but fortunately I've won a couple of prizes) I spend almost no money on myself.

I look at the people where I was, they turn up, sit in their office, drink coffee and satisfy their bosses that they appear to be working - what a waste of their fekking lives.

 

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1 minute ago, Hopeful said:

I got fed up with supporting other people that didn't pull their weight.

I now earn 33% of what I did when I was PAYE. I break even each year. (This year I've not earned a penny but fortunately I've won a couple of prizes) I spend almost no money on myself.

I look at the people where I was, they turn up, sit in their office, drink coffee and satisfy their bosses that they appear to be working - what a waste of their fekking lives.

 

Ah yes.  I used to look at some people at work and think, what the fuck is it that you actually do?  

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