Mass Testing Roll-out in Schools

[Vendetta]

Thought I’d start a thread on this as it is hugely significant and has the potential to be an absolute clusterfuck....

So how will it work?

How do they expect (say a 1500 pupil school) to carry out testing on all the kids?

Where will they get the staffing to do this? 

What rooms will they use? 

Who will do the training?

What happens if a kid tests positive?

How will they manage to test every kid in a 200 year group - each test will take 5 mins I presume? That’s 1000mins (16 hours - nearly 3 school days?) 

Surely mass testing just gives a ‘snap shot’ of who has / has not the disease that day - but unless every kid is tested everyday the process and results are effectively useless - other than telling you the incident rate at that point in time.

Also as most cases are asymptomatic - surely this testing program will just discover cases that ‘would not otherwise be discovered’ (not to mention false positives), and as a result cause mass closures/ bubbles sent home?

I’ll stop there.... I just cannot understand it? Any teachers on this site? Or people involved in testing or the policy roll out? What do parents think? 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-55471095

[Popuplights]

They are currently advertising for ex-teachers to do the training. 

[ccc]

Just to keep numbers up. Nothing more.

[Vendetta]

Even if they get the 6-10 extra staff (on average) per secondary school required to do the testing - and I cannot see that happening....

What is the point? Am I missing something? 
 

 

[muggle]

2 minutes ago, Vendetta said:

What is the point? Am I missing something? 

 

 

DNA harvesting? 

[working woman]

A few days ago I was looking at jobs on websites such as Reed.

There are currently adverts for testing jobs in schools to test the kids.

I get the impression the kids test themselves, you just supervise.

Anyone can apply and you need to pass the criminal records checks (CRB?).

[Hail the Tripod]

I can’t understand this at all. Surely we want kids to catch it while they’re kids. Why are we even trying to stop kids catching it? All that effort and resource should be dedicated to protecting the vulnerable!!!

[sarahbell]

As I understand it kids will do the tests on themselves.

If they can't organise it then the army will give them advice over the phone.

 

[Green Devil]

4 minutes ago, Vendetta said:

Even if they get the 6-10 extra staff (on average) per secondary school required to do the testing - and I cannot see that happening....

What is the point? Am I missing something? 
 

 

There's no point. It's pointless. Like you say a snapshot means nothing. It's more bullshit to a) avoid going down the online learning route, b) keep the kids at school so the parents can keep paying taxes. 

[Stuey]

PCR or lateral flow?

[Vendetta]

That cockwomble is starting to realise it’s a complete clusterfuck.
 

Panic setting in.... new bbc headline just now. If I can see the problems ... then they must be seeing it. 😂

The introduction / late announcement of the school ‘delayed start’ until 18th Jan was purely about realising they had fucked up...... they need an exit route or policy U-turn.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-55496444

 

Edited December 31, 2020 by Vendetta

[dgul]

I've had letters from my children's school.

They're amazingly light on detail of how it is going to work.

I'm also very concerned about psychological stuff -- eg, there's no mention of how they'll control peer pressure or peer shaming.  

But the main problem I have with it is there's pretty much no discussion anywhere of the impact of false-positives.  Eg, in the kid's school they'll isolate each case plus all in their 'bubble' of about 15.  So, in a school of 1,500 and a FP rate of 1% (the low end of the government's estimate, if you can find it), there'll be 15 FPs per testing day, leading to about 225 isolating -- that's 15% of the school excluded from their lessons each time.  And, again, that's with the low side of the FP estimate.

The whole thing is ill thought through and will just lead to immense disruption without any identifiable benefit (especially given that all the science now says that the asymptomatic don't spread the disease anyway).

[If they wanted to make a difference they'd get the head-teacher of each primary school to go round all the 'pick uppers' at closing time and tell each and every grandparent on pick-up duty that they're being extraordinary stupid in interacting with the little viral vectors, and are directly causing deaths and increasing demand on the NHS.]

[Vendetta]

14 minutes ago, dgul said:

I've had letters from my children's school.

They're amazingly light on detail of how it is going to work.

I'm also very concerned about psychological stuff -- eg, there's no mention of how they'll control peer pressure or peer shaming.  

But the main problem I have with it is there's pretty much no discussion anywhere of the impact of false-positives.  Eg, in the kid's school they'll isolate each case plus all in their 'bubble' of about 15.  So, in a school of 1,500 and a FP rate of 1% (the low end of the government's estimate, if you can find it), there'll be 15 FPs per testing day, leading to about 225 isolating -- that's 15% of the school excluded from their lessons each time.  And, again, that's with the low side of the FP estimate.

The whole thing is ill thought through and will just lead to immense disruption without any identifiable benefit (especially given that all the science now says that the asymptomatic don't spread the disease anyway).

[If they wanted to make a difference they'd get the head-teacher of each primary school to go round all the 'pick uppers' at closing time and tell each and every grandparent on pick-up duty that they're being extraordinary stupid in interacting with the little viral vectors, and are directly causing deaths and increasing demand on the NHS.]

The ‘infrastructure’ and resources required for this as well as the skills and collection of data is a massive undertaking.... 

Off the top of my head....

GDPR data collection issues, consent, safety issues (what happens when little Johnny’s nasal cavity gets torn by his English teacher?), need a room with a fridge, paperwork, said room needs a ‘sealed floor’, and needs to be large enough to accommodate hundreds of pupils per day, time required will be massive, PPE, staffing, huge amounts of data will be generated - how to ensure accuracy, communication to parents, etc etc...

For what benefit? 

Edited December 31, 2020 by Vendetta

[Vendetta]

7 minutes ago, Stuey said:

PCR or lateral flow?

Lateral flow

[dgul]

11 minutes ago, Vendetta said:

Lateral flow

In my letter from the school it says they might do either.

(But I'd agree that they're really only going to do LFT -- I think the reference to PCR tests is just covering themselves in case they have to do a few.  Not that they explained in that way at all).

[Vendetta]

No problem - the military will be on hand...   

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/military-to-support-the-testing-of-thousands-of-secondary-school-and-college-students-in-england

 

Will they fuck? Sorry they are on Zoom  so everything sorted....

[Vendetta]

Deleted....

Edited December 31, 2020 by Vendetta

[MrPin]

What's the point in testing kids with symptoms? I would hazard a guess they have caught it, so go home until you are better.

Maybe it's a test for hypochondriacs?

I am not a doctor, but if you have the symptoms, you probably have it.

Edited December 31, 2020 by MrPin

[Vendetta]

2 minutes ago, Vendetta said:

All the guidance is here from the government....

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/coronavirus-covid-19-home-test-kits-for-schools-and-fe-providers/coronavirus-covid-19-home-test-kits-for-schools-and-fe-providers

Sorry updated....

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/asymptomatic-testing-in-schools-and-colleges
 

They have a mass testing handbook so all Will be well....

[Popuplights]

34 minutes ago, Vendetta said:

That cockwomble is starting to realise it’s a complete clusterfuck.

Which of the cockwombles are we talking about??

[Vendetta]

4 minutes ago, Popuplights said:

Which of the cockwombles are we talking about??

Insert: Williamson, Boris, Hancock, Gove, Whitby..... to be honest they are all the same....., twats.

[Vendetta]

47 minutes ago, working woman said:

 

I get the impression the kids test themselves, you just supervise.

“Kids test themselves” ......  not so sure...

Most of the kids can’t blow their noses properly....

....mind they are teaching themselves now ......so this is not a step to far removed.....

[The Generation Game]

49 minutes ago, sarahbell said:

As I understand it kids will do the tests on themselves.

If they can't organise it then the army will give them advice over the phone.

 

What could go wrong?

 

[dgul]

20 minutes ago, MrPin said:

What's the point in testing kids with symptoms? I would hazard a guess they have caught it, so go home until you are better.

Maybe it's a test for hypochondriacs?

I am not a doctor, but if you have the symptoms, you probably have it.

They won't be testing children with any symptoms -- they'll be excluded from school and any testing will be done at the NHS testing stations.

[Reck B]

45 minutes ago, dgul said:

I've had letters from my children's school.

They're amazingly light on detail of how it is going to work.

I'm also very concerned about psychological stuff -- eg, there's no mention of how they'll control peer pressure or peer shaming.  

But the main problem I have with it is there's pretty much no discussion anywhere of the impact of false-positives.  Eg, in the kid's school they'll isolate each case plus all in their 'bubble' of about 15.  So, in a school of 1,500 and a FP rate of 1% (the low end of the government's estimate, if you can find it), there'll be 15 FPs per testing day, leading to about 225 isolating -- that's 15% of the school excluded from their lessons each time.  And, again, that's with the low side of the FP estimate.

The whole thing is ill thought through and will just lead to immense disruption without any identifiable benefit (especially given that all the science now says that the asymptomatic don't spread the disease anyway).

[If they wanted to make a difference they'd get the head-teacher of each primary school to go round all the 'pick uppers' at closing time and tell each and every grandparent on pick-up duty that they're being extraordinary stupid in interacting with the little viral vectors, and are directly causing deaths and increasing demand on the NHS.]

Write a letter to the head teacher pointing the FP rate, they are probably not aware of it.

CC the head of maths to help them understand it.