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How safe is it to travel by aeroplane after taking the Oxford Astra Zeneca jab?


Democorruptcy
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Democorruptcy

Matthew Hancock has downplayed the blood clot risk of the Astra Zeneca jab by stating the risk is only the same 4 per 1 million, as on a long haul flight. That long haul flight risk of a blood clot was calculated before people had taken the Astra Zeneca jab. If being vaccinated does lead to more chance of a blood clot, then the risk of one forming on a long haul flight, must also be increased. It's a double whammy?

If flying in a pressurised cabin increases your chance of a blood clot, what about the risks of flying after taking a potentially blood clot inducing jab? Although the Astra Zeneca jab is now blocked for 20 to 29 year olds. What about the blood clot risks for a jabbed 30, 40, 50 year old etc on just a short haul flight? It's still a double whammy?

Of course after taking both jabs and then going on a plane, the risk could be a triple whammy?

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Especially if it goes exponential.

Surely we would have heard by now of a few planes having to land prematurely? 

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The risk on a flight can't be as low as 4 per million. 4 per million what anyway? 

Happened to me on flight back from USA. Nothing for about three weeks then medium-severe pain and leg swelled up. Assumed I had overdone it at the gym.

Finally went to GP about six weeks after the flight. He went nuts and said go directly to A&E right now don't go home first just go. After emergency treatment you have to see doc again later to find out what triggered it off; he didn't seem very surprised that a flight was the only explanation.

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Zero.  You'll never be allowed to fly regardless.  There's a climate war to be won next don'tyaknow.

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The Masked Tulip

I was wondering the other day whether airlines are taking any precaution re having two pilots on board - one jabbed and one non jabbed - for this very reason. 

Pilots are not allowed to have the same meals on a flight out of fear of food poisoning. It crossed my mind that we could have a situation where two jabbed pilots die or are incapacitated via stroke and 500 people are, well, buggered.

Edited by The Masked Tulip
typo
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spygirl

Well ... you are assuming its thevirus.

AZ is delivered by a deep msucle jab.

It might be the actual jabbing rather than the vaccine that causes the clots.

If you took ~20m people and stuck a needle into their arms then youd expect a few blood clots later.

i.e any other virus that needs an injection will probably show the same outcome - some clots.

 

 

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Don Coglione
1 minute ago, spygirl said:

Well ... you are assuming its thevirus.

AZ is delivered by a deep msucle jab.

It might be the actual jabbing rather than the vaccine that causes the clots.

If you took ~20m people and stuck a needle into their arms then youd expect a few blood clots later.

i.e any other virus that needs an injection will probably show the same outcome - some clots.

 

 

Yet another area of Spy expertise!

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Chewing Grass
32 minutes ago, ashestoashes said:

what do they recommend pilots do ?

Masturbate regularly as part of the pre-flights in the cock-pit.

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2 hours ago, Democorruptcy said:

Matthew Hancock has downplayed the blood clot risk of the Astra Zeneca jab by stating the risk is only the same 4 per 1 million, as on a long haul flight. That long haul flight risk of a blood clot was calculated before people had taken the Astra Zeneca jab. If being vaccinated does lead to more chance of a blood clot, then the risk of one forming on a long haul flight, must also be increased. It's a double whammy?

If flying in a pressurised cabin increases your chance of a blood clot, what about the risks of flying after taking a potentially blood clot inducing jab? Although the Astra Zeneca jab is now blocked for 20 to 29 year olds. What about the blood clot risks for a jabbed 30, 40, 50 year old etc on just a short haul flight? It's still a double whammy?

Of course after taking both jabs and then going on a plane, the risk could be a triple whammy?

I think the two mechanisms are independent (altitude and sitting still vs a vaccine induced thrombocytopenia).  That is, a predisposition to one doesn't say anything about risk from the other.  This isn't certain, however.

I'd say the interesting factor is whether having the jab increases the risk of having a clot problem if exposed to covid months or years later.  There are theoretical reasons why this might be the case (or might not), but there's no data yet to see if theory => practice.

Anyway, what people should be worried about (re vaccinated flying) is sitting in a plane full of people with exactly the same immune characteristics as one another (re covid).  If one person on the plane has an escape variant then it is likely that everyone will have it a week later.  (this isn't necessarily true for the unvaccinated, as their broader immune characteristic might be able to better fight off the escape variant.)

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Chewing Grass
2 hours ago, Democorruptcy said:

Matthew Hancock has downplayed the blood clot risk of the Astra Zeneca jab by stating the risk is only the same 4 per 1 million, as on a long haul flight.

Selective use of words, most people would say 1 in X, not 4 in Y.

They have carefully told him to say that instead of 1:250,000 and generalise over the whole population.

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The Masked Tulip

Pilots and shift workers are at increased risk of stroke. Pilots fail in both categories. IIRC the risk is about 3 times. Pilots are carefully checked in medicals for stroke risk. 

You often hear in civilian crashes that the pilot had a stroke before the aircraft went out of control. Last year, or it could have been 2019, that a co-pilot lander a passenger airliner after his captain had a stroke. 

I suppose the other risk might be walkers and climbers heading to high altitudes - the Alps, Himalayas,Rockies and even high deserts. or even, perhaps, extreme cold temps such as at the Poles.

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Rare Bear
3 hours ago, Democorruptcy said:

Matthew Hancock has downplayed the blood clot risk of the Astra Zeneca jab by stating the risk is only the same 4 per 1 million, as on a long haul flight. That long haul flight risk of a blood clot was calculated before people had taken the Astra Zeneca jab. If being vaccinated does lead to more chance of a blood clot, then the risk of one forming on a long haul flight, must also be increased. It's a double whammy?

If flying in a pressurised cabin increases your chance of a blood clot, what about the risks of flying after taking a potentially blood clot inducing jab? Although the Astra Zeneca jab is now blocked for 20 to 29 year olds. What about the blood clot risks for a jabbed 30, 40, 50 year old etc on just a short haul flight? It's still a double whammy?

Of course after taking both jabs and then going on a plane, the risk could be a triple whammy?

Is the risk of a stroke to an airline passenger due to the altitude or due to being sitting in a cramped position for hours on end?

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Democorruptcy
1 hour ago, The Masked Tulip said:

I suppose the other risk might be walkers and climbers heading to high altitudes - the Alps, Himalayas,Rockies and even high deserts. or even, perhaps, extreme cold temps such as at the Poles.

At the end of the summer the people that do extreme holidays might be comparing notes who about took the most risk. Base jumping, free climbing or double AZ jab before a flight for some scuba diving - the pressure!

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sarahbell
2 hours ago, spygirl said:

Well ... you are assuming its thevirus.

AZ is delivered by a deep msucle jab.

It might be the actual jabbing rather than the vaccine that causes the clots.

If you took ~20m people and stuck a needle into their arms then youd expect a few blood clots later.

i.e any other virus that needs an injection will probably show the same outcome - some clots.

 

 

Aspiration was discussed in Norway. It isn't done for this vaccine. Or many others. Aspiration would double check the needle is in the right place.

image.thumb.png.556fb6c217da0d56e2eba72e0164e1d5.png

 

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Democorruptcy
2 hours ago, Knickerless Turgid said:

Yet another area of Spy expertise!

Who was assuming it was the virus? My post was only about jabs.

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1 hour ago, Rare Bear said:

Is the risk of a stroke to an airline passenger due to the altitude or due to being sitting in a cramped position for hours on end?

Mixture of effects, at altitude low humidity causes dehydration which thickens the blood which in combination with not moving around is a double whammy.

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Andersen
3 hours ago, ashestoashes said:

what do they recommend pilots do ?

I saw a post a while ago (now lost in the "nobody's going on a foreign holiday" thread?) but unless things have changed airlines were pushing for all passengers to be vacc'd, while saying pilots & aircrew shouldn't be as it's not safe. Clown world O.o 

Edited by Andersen
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Don Coglione
1 hour ago, Democorruptcy said:

Who was assuming it was the virus? My post was only about jabs.

Certainly not me! I was merely marvelling at the extent of Spy's genius.

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Democorruptcy
12 minutes ago, Knickerless Turgid said:

Certainly not me! I was merely marvelling at the extent of Spy's genius.

I wouldn't have seen the post if you hadn't quoted it. Cheers - not.

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Don Coglione
16 minutes ago, Democorruptcy said:

I wouldn't have seen the post if you hadn't quoted it. Cheers - not.

Are the pubs open in Wales again?

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Democorruptcy
Just now, Knickerless Turgid said:

Are the pubs open in Wales again?

NO!

Wales has already allowed holidays within Wales. From 12th April they are allowing people on holidays from outside Wales. However outdoor hospitality in pubs is not allowed until 26th April. I think there isn't even a date for indoor hospitality. The First Twit is very anti-alcohol and clearly sees this an opportunity to decimate the pub industry permanently. While Health Minister it was him who started the campaign for the Minimum Price for Alcohol.

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Don Coglione
Just now, Democorruptcy said:

NO!

Wales has already allowed holidays within Wales. From 12th April they are allowing people on holidays from outside Wales. However outdoor hospitality in pubs is not allowed until 26th April. I think there isn't even a date for indoor hospitality. The First Twit is very anti-alcohol and clearly sees this an opportunity to decimate the pub industry permanently. While Health Minister it was him who started the campaign for the Minimum Price for Alcohol.

You must have stocked up at the supermarket, then...

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Democorruptcy
6 minutes ago, Knickerless Turgid said:

You must have stocked up at the supermarket, then...

While I oppose minimum price for alcohol it doesn't affect me much as I'm not a big drinker. On the days I have a drink it's only one while I'm cooking.

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