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SIPP funds when markets high?


Mirror Mirror
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Mirror Mirror

I’ve just brought three modest pension plans together into a SIPP with a single provider.

I made cash transfers so at present the money is just sitting there as cash. I’ve got a few ideas as to what funds to invest it in, but right now the markets are at near all time highs. I wouldn’t be surprised to see them tank again in the autumn when our corrupt government takes the next steps in maintaining the covid scamdemic, so I’m reluctant to invest in the stock markets at this time.

Any recommendations as to funds which might pay a bit of I come to be re invested but wouldn’t be vulnerable to a market crash?

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stockton

Not financial advice ect..

When I transferred mine it as all cash and I bought funds over time.  I still have some cash sitting for any big movements and I have put a chunk into regular income funds paying around 4% (monthly or quarterly).

My thinking is there are no charges to enter or exit the funds (although these are not instant) so better as a holding area rather than bigger (% wise) paying divi stocks which incur charges to buy and sell.

There isnt a no risk option but at least this way my money is devaluing slightly less than if it was just cash waiting to jump in.

Longer term I am averaging in to high paying dividend stocks along with some punts on juniors but for much less.

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Snake Plissken

If you have a sipp and invest in some funds how is the interest/profit/loss calculated ? is it like a daily rate or a minimum time you have to have the fund for ?

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stockton
23 minutes ago, Snake Plissken said:

If you have a sipp and invest in some funds how is the interest/profit/loss calculated ? is it like a daily rate or a minimum time you have to have the fund for ?

For HL is it the daily rate, no interest or divis are included in the calc AFAICT. 

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Mirror Mirror
3 hours ago, stockton said:

Not financial advice ect..

When I transferred mine it as all cash and I bought funds over time.  I still have some cash sitting for any big movements and I have put a chunk into regular income funds paying around 4% (monthly or quarterly).

My thinking is there are no charges to enter or exit the funds (although these are not instant) so better as a holding area rather than bigger (% wise) paying divi stocks which incur charges to buy and sell.

There isnt a no risk option but at least this way my money is devaluing slightly less than if it was just cash waiting to jump in.

Longer term I am averaging in to high paying dividend stocks along with some punts on juniors but for much less.

Thanks, I was thinking of just buying funds gradually over time, to cater for the unlikely event that my timing isn’t perfect xD.

Would you mind pointing me to some regular income funds, of course with the proviso that it’s not investment advice?

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stockton
14 minutes ago, Mirror Mirror said:

Thanks, I was thinking of just buying funds gradually over time, to cater for the unlikely event that my timing isn’t perfect xD.

Would you mind pointing me to some regular income funds, of course with the proviso that it’s not investment advice?

https://www.hl.co.uk/funds/fund-discounts,-prices--and--factsheets/search-results/s/schroder-us-equity-income-maximiser-income

Very tech heavy - not good at the moment IMO, but low charges

 

https://www.hl.co.uk/funds/fund-discounts,-prices--and--factsheets/search-results/v/vt-gravis-uk-infrastructure-income-c-gbp-income

Higher fees but less reliance on tech sector

 

https://www.hl.co.uk/funds/fund-discounts,-prices--and--factsheets/search-results/j/jupiter-monthly-alternative-income-class-i-income

A monthly earner to keep the income ticking over

 

https://www.hl.co.uk/funds/fund-discounts,-prices--and--factsheets/search-results/a/artemis-high-income-class-i-monthly-income

This is the one I currently use and has done me well but is mainly bonds and they are looking like the worst place to be at the moment, time to review the other funds and change I think.

 

Full list here, could tighten up the filter to only show the higher yielding funds but I like to pick from a bigger pool.

https://www.hl.co.uk/funds/fund-discounts,-prices--and--factsheets/search-results?unitTypePref=4&payment_frequency=M%2CQ&payment_type=Dividend&yield=4-6%2C6-gt&start=0&rpp=20&lo=0&sort=fd.net_ocf&sort_dir=asc

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Mirror Mirror

Thanks for that, very useful!

I see the graphs for these funds have % on the y axis, which from the data sheets is % return per fund price.

Does the price of these income funds tend to be quite stable, ie resistant to market fluctuations, even though the rate of return seems to vary?

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stockton

The ones I have are all up by around 1-3% so stable so far* with the huge proviso that I haven't held them through any turmoil yet

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man o' the year

Aren't markets always at all time highs - except when they crash? I have this aspiration to invest when markets are low but it never really happens. If you believe investing in stock markets through funds, as I do, then I generally feel that having money in the market is better than not. The investment firms do not pay interest on cash so although the money in cash is "safe" it is not working and stands no chance of increase. looking back on my investments I have generally regretted hesitating rather then putting money in.

My SIPP only came through in April and I have now invested about half of it, all in funds. The 25% I will withdraw as cash what the end of the financial year so that will likely stay as cash until then. 

Our ISAs are predominantly in Funds (91%). 8% is in ETFs and 1% in Shares. There is only 0.3% in cash at the moment.

My Income from the funds is low and below my target at the moment so I am putting new money into Income Funds. 

Total in ISAs at the moment is £308k. Total in SIPP is just below £100k.

 

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Frank Hovis

Charts like this, which is inflation adjusted, are why I am happy to always sit in equities.

The absolute worst case there - buying all of your holdings in 1999, and who would actually have done that? - would still see you back in the same position by 2012 and from then on making a decent return.

These are inflation-adjusted which is why gold, though increasing nominally, does little more than bump along the bottom.

I wouldn't come of out of equities for cash anymore than I would sell to rent because I think both stocks and properties are good long term investments and also I have very much not bought either at peaks.

 

With an annual SIPP I set aside £20k at the start of the year.  If there is a big fall in the year then I will buy then; if not I buy in March so as to take up the allowance.

Similar charts are logarithmic in order to show what is happening at the foot of the chart to the other investments but by being such they tend to visually downplay the performance of stocks.

This chart shows the reality.

 

Total-real-26-2016.jpg

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Green Devil
4 hours ago, Frank Hovis said:

Charts like this, which is inflation adjusted, are why I am happy to always sit in equities.

The absolute worst case there - buying all of your holdings in 1999, and who would actually have done that? - would still see you back in the same position by 2012 and from then on making a decent return.

These are inflation-adjusted which is why gold, though increasing nominally, does little more than bump along the bottom.

I wouldn't come of out of equities for cash anymore than I would sell to rent because I think both stocks and properties are good long term investments and also I have very much not bought either at peaks.

 

With an annual SIPP I set aside £20k at the start of the year.  If there is a big fall in the year then I will buy then; if not I buy in March so as to take up the allowance.

Similar charts are logarithmic in order to show what is happening at the foot of the chart to the other investments but by being such they tend to visually downplay the performance of stocks.

This chart shows the reality.

 

Total-real-26-2016.jpg

How can an investment of zero in 1925 be worth more than zero 😂😂😂 I wish i had a system that performed that well, id be rich! 

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Frank Hovis
25 minutes ago, Green Devil said:

How can an investment of zero in 1925 be worth more than zero 😂😂😂 I wish i had a system that performed that well, id be rich! 

They all start at $1.

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Popuplights

Great thread. Just about to transfer my pot into a SIPP. I have the same questions. 

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Straingone
23 hours ago, stockton said:

Clean energy funds are decent too, would love to find a fund with some hydrogen plays in it.

https://www.hl.co.uk/funds/fund-discounts,-prices--and--factsheets/search-results/v/vt-gravis-clean-energy-income-accumulation

I would also be keen on something similar. I am doing some research on individual hydrogen stocks for a spray and pray approach in my ISA at the moment. I have sold a load of coins to fund my ISA this week.

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NogintheNog
On 11/07/2021 at 14:25, Popuplights said:

Great thread. Just about to transfer my pot into a SIPP. I have the same questions. 

40% LON: PNL and 40% LON: CTY

20% Cash

The Personal Assets Trust is about as close as you can get to a bond to my mind. Very defensive with the aim of growing but not losing your money. The City of London Investment Trust is invested in UK listed assets most of which have international earnings. Higher risk but has been paying a decent dividend for years, and less exposed to the £ risk due to those international earnings.

Some cash for the likely rainy day in the future or to gobble up a few bargains if they appear.

Check out how the PNL rode over the March 2020 covid speed hump.....

PS - NOT INVESTMENT ADVICE DYOR:)

 

Screenshot from 2021-07-13 10-15-26.png

Edited by NogintheNog
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Popuplights
4 minutes ago, NogintheNog said:

40% LON: PNL and 40% LON: CTY

20% Cash

The Personal Assets Trust is about as close as you can get to a bond to my mind. Very defensive with the aim of growing but not losing your money. The City of London Investment Trust is invested in UK listed assets most of which have international earnings. Higher risk but has been paying a decent dividend for years, and less exposed to the £ risk due to those international earnings.

Some cash for the likely rainy day in the future or to gobble up a few bargains if they appear.

Check out how the PNL rode over the March 2020 covid speed hump.....

PS - NOT INVESTMENT ADVICE DYOR:)

 

Screenshot from 2021-07-13 10-15-26.png

Cheers. Very good!!

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  • 3 weeks later...
Popuplights

Finally got my guaranteed CETV. I'm very happy with the sum. The FA is still trying to persuade me to use his services to manage the SIPP. 

I am minded to do it myself to keep fees at the absolute minimum. I was thinking of using the ii platform for the SIPP. Anyone else got  experience?

 

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1 hour ago, Popuplights said:

Finally got my guaranteed CETV. I'm very happy with the sum. The FA is still trying to persuade me to use his services to manage the SIPP. 

I am minded to do it myself to keep fees at the absolute minimum. I was thinking of using the ii platform for the SIPP. Anyone else got  experience?

 

I would like an idea on this too. I've recently found out that my Aviva work pension allows partial transfers out so I'm looking to move most of it to a SIPP. Interactive Investor top of the list at the moment for me. 

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Shamone
1 hour ago, Popuplights said:

Finally got my guaranteed CETV. I'm very happy with the sum. The FA is still trying to persuade me to use his services to manage the SIPP. 

I am minded to do it myself to keep fees at the absolute minimum. I was thinking of using the ii platform for the SIPP. Anyone else got  experience?

 

I’m pretty sure @DurhamBorn could help with this. First world probs, eh? I like HL but you can prob get cheaper. FA after his cut for sweet FA. 

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Popuplights
1 hour ago, Shamone said:

I’m pretty sure @DurhamBorn could help with this. First world probs, eh? I like HL but you can prob get cheaper. FA after his cut for sweet FA. 

It was his idea to do it myself in the first place. The fees are too high! I reckon I can do as well, for much less. 

Fees kill the compounding effect.

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DurhamBorn
2 hours ago, Popuplights said:

Finally got my guaranteed CETV. I'm very happy with the sum. The FA is still trying to persuade me to use his services to manage the SIPP. 

I am minded to do it myself to keep fees at the absolute minimum. I was thinking of using the ii platform for the SIPP. Anyone else got  experience?

 

The question is will the FA still do the transfer if you say you want to self manage,some of them wont.If they will then it depends if you already have a SIPP,if you do and it was running before Jan 20 it would be best to transfer in there as it might have rights to access at 55 protected instead of 58 in 2028.

Id never use an IFA to manage unless it was for someone with no idea at all,with platform fees you can be looking at 2%pa where with HL my fees are 0.05% platform fee.They pretty much use Vanguard 60/40 type funds anyway and dress it up as advice.

If you do need the advisor to manage to do the transfer go along with it,but open a SIPP without telling them,then as soon as the transfer lands hand the IFA a letter telling them to hold as cash and not invest then launch  transfer into you own SIPP.Most IFAs use the platform called Transact,so just make sure you know the platform they are using so you know who to launch the transfer from.

The whole transfer is a nightmare and i had to act like the IFA would manage the funds forever and then launch a transfer on them as soon as the funds land.

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DurhamBorn
On 07/07/2021 at 18:15, Mirror Mirror said:

Thanks, I was thinking of just buying funds gradually over time, to cater for the unlikely event that my timing isn’t perfect xD.

Would you mind pointing me to some regular income funds, of course with the proviso that it’s not investment advice?

I like the Henderson Asian Income Investment Trust.Its underperformed for a while,but holds companies that should do well and pay nice dividends 4 times a year.Investment trusts also have no stamp duty and dont have extra platform fees.

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Popuplights

I am paying a handsome fee to the bloke to handle the transfer. I have already suggested I want to manage it myself, Ans he was fine with that. 

I'm interested in your comment about access age. I'm 52 now. I assumed I would still have the right to access it at 55 as I have beaten the 2028 deadline?

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  • 2 weeks later...
Popuplights

Quick update. Have opened an ii SIPP, Advisor confirmed he is fine to transfer into it. 

Access age also confirmed as 55. Just 2 1/2 years before I can spunk my lump sum on a classic Ferrari!!

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