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JackieO

Selective private education

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37 minutes ago, JackieO said:

How naturally clever does a kid need to be get in and is it worth the investment?

From my own experience (albeit quite a long time ago) I'd say the entrance exams are there to weed out the terminal window lickers, but that a child with moderate IQ and some decent coaching ought to be able to get in. The schools need the money so they need to make the threshold as inclusive as possible without introducing kids who are disruptively slow.

Worth the investment? So many answers to that. Investment in what, the child's happiness? Their future earnings? The parent's bragging rights to their friends? The parent's future old age care? I don't know how you quantify the return on the investment in order to assess whether it was worth it or not. I'm always dubious about parent's rationale behind sending their kids to private school - I hated one, loved another, but I don't feel that either of them gave me anything I couldn't have got at a state school, and I'm still scratching my head wondering exactly what my parents were hoping I or they were going to gain from it. I do know that they feel they spent a lot of money "on me", which is interesting, given that they gave me no choice to do anything different at any point in my entire school career.

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I went to one from eleven. I failed the 11+ a few months earlier. Bright but disruptive and needs to be stretched was the reference from my primary, apparently.

Edited by Panther

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A medium public school will cost you 10k year.

Even if they go to a state primary thats 60k to gcse or 80k to a levels.

Its cheaper to get a tutor for english and maths.

Despite the claim, state school kids tend to be better at dealing with other people. Most public schools type are like fish out of water. And theres no jobs for publuc school kidswith poor qualifucations.

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1 minute ago, spygirl said:

A medium public school will cost you 10k year.

Even if they go to a state primary thats 60k to gcse or 80k to a levels.

Its cheaper to get a tutor for english and maths.

Despite the claim, state school kids tend to be better at dealing with other people. Most public schools type are like fish out of water. And theres no jobs for publuc school kidswith poor qualifucations.

Ah but there is. One will sell you a new ketborad in Argos.

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My kids go to a selective private school - not for bragging rights or snobbery but simply because the secondary schools in our (catchment) area are shit and  the price of entry into the good comprehensive schools was too high (house price premium equivalent to rent/mortgage is equal to the whole cost of their paid for education). 

The entrance test for middle school are based on the 11+ and the whole of pre-prep is geared to getting your child ready to pass this so if they fail here then you/we can blame the teachers/teaching. Children coming in to our school at 8years old will either be naturally very bright or have come from another selective school. Conversely all the kids that fail to move up here go onto state schooling or a less selective grammar school nearby. The real thickos/trouble makers are whittled out before middle school so everyone there wants to learn and is prepared to learn. 

It's worth every penny to us as we have incredibly happy, motivated children capable of independent thought and not state formed SJW flowers who can only recite from the rote learned PC script. 

If it becomes apparent either of my two are falling irrecoverably behind then they'll go into the state system from 11+ and we'll bank the cash for vocational training at a later date. 

This came through the post this morning... 

 

 

IMG_0327.JPG

Edited by longtomsilver

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The kid doesn't have to be really really bright, just not really really stupid.

The main benefits are much better standard of sport, music, drama etc and of course many fewer of the really shit kind of parents.

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58 minutes ago, spygirl said:

Despite the claim, state school kids tend to be better at dealing with other people. Most public schools type are like fish out of water.

Anecdotally that's what I've found too.  I'm state schooled but the Grammar/Private kids I know fit a certain, different mould.  On the positive side they're smart, capable, productive, able to think for themselves and think differently.  But on the flip side they were argumentative, over opinionated and unable to fit in.

I think there's context too it though, the guys I knew who were like that didn't come from money.  So they had to fight to get there, or were pushed.

People I know who came from money and went to those schools (i.e. Reading Blue Coat School) are actually some of the most smart yet grounded and well rounded people I know.

That said, if either of my kids were capable and I could afford it, I'd send them.

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A private school teacher told me that in his view private education did little for the smartest (except provide a useful future network) and little for the dumbest, but did most for kids of mid-range intellectual ability and for those with exceptional ability in non-academic disciplines(sport, theatre, dance etc) due to the greater facilities/opportunities.

So you could consider saving the money on the school and spending it on high-quality extra-curricular activities and any extra tuition required.  Little bastards won't thank you anyway whatever you do, see Fully Detached's post above... :P

More seriously, not everyone loves being a parent to their child(ren) but no-one ever admits it even though it's blindingly obvious to everyone including the kids - be honest with yourself, if you're not really passionate about it, private boarding education is probably a good option and they'll have nothing to complain about, but if you love being a caring loving close parent, a decent state school is fine, and spend the money on them on other things that you can watch and share in their enjoyment. 

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My son was really unhappy at the local village school and the head was a complete wank stain who knew how to manipulate OFSTED. The school was crappy with many good points, but my son was unhappy.

I took him out and sent him to the local Prep school. He loved it and turned out gentle and confident (If those are the desired characteristic of males these days?). But the problem was with my daughter. Very bright and energetic. She started to demand (and quite rightly so) that she also went to a better school. So off to a private school she went.

It busted me. 

Was it worth it?  For my son yes but my daughter would have achieved high grades wherever she went.

Do my kids respect me?  No.   They talk about there terrible childhood.

Kids will make your life a misery and it doesn't matter a fig what school they go to.

 

(ps...I recognise that I am a crap parent :D)

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Not all private schools are equal. Reading Bluecoats will take anything that can fog a mirror but you need to be exceptional to get into Guildford Grammar. You need to be very bright, or very well connected, to get into Wellington.

The key advantage of private schools is that they can still expel pupils so the dysfunctional, disruptive scroat count is usually zero.

 

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1 minute ago, swissy_fit said:

IME the kidadults that whine about their bad childhoods are mostly just born whiners who've bought into the zeitgeist of nothing ever being their own fault.

The ones that had REALLY bad childhoods don't even talk about it.

That is so true.  My best mates are from humble backgrounds.....always keen to see each other and no demands.

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My generation of the family were educated in middle to upper ranking public schools. I would say it was worth it for 1, possibly 2 out of the 7 of us. That is defining success in terms of having well paid professional careers in London. The rest of us are trades  and badly paid professional / admin types living in the same area as our parents. We were unusual in the sense that a good chunk of the fees were paid for by a trust established when the family business was sold during 83% tax era of the Wilson government; without this, our parents would not have been able to pay. I think that although we all did fine at school, having been manual labourers a generation or two earlier there probably wasn't the network of contacts and influence available to us that many of our contemporaries may have enjoyed and that had far bigger effect on employment prospects than where we went to school.

I think people who have been to boarding school can struggle in adult life if they end up in a social / work arena where the majority do not have the same background. Having a twatty accent and being obviously fairly well educated has certainly been a hindrance in my chosen path. My parents did recently admit they now realise sending us away to school was probably not the best decision.

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3 hours ago, Wahoo said:

My son was really unhappy at the local village school and the head was a complete wank stain who knew how to manipulate OFSTED. The school was crappy with many good points, but my son was unhappy.

I took him out and sent him to the local Prep school. He loved it and turned out gentle and confident (If those are the desired characteristic of males these days?). But the problem was with my daughter. Very bright and energetic. She started to demand (and quite rightly so) that she also went to a better school. So off to a private school she went.

It busted me. 

Was it worth it?  For my son yes but my daughter would have achieved high grades wherever she went.

Do my kids respect me?  No.   They talk about there terrible childhood.

Kids will make your life a misery and it doesn't matter a fig what school they go to.

 

(ps...I recognise that I am a crap parent :D)

I had a friend at school whose parents sent his brother to the best private school in the area. He was an exceptional fencer although I don't know if this happened before or after attending said school. My friend went to the same local comp as I did. 

I always felt sorry for him, like his parents were treating him as second best. He was never the most gifted but ended up as a lawyer so he must have done something right. 

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8 hours ago, JackieO said:

How naturally clever does a kid need to be get in and is it worth the investment?

My eldest daughter entered private school last year. Not cheap (about 47k per term)  But she's worth it. She's my daughter. 

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19 minutes ago, Charles Carter said:

My eldest daughter entered private school last year. Not cheap (about 47k per term)  But she's worth it. She's my daughter. 

Christ! That would buy a load of shoes and handbags, and a nose job.

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9 hours ago, Cunning Plan said:

Not all private schools are equal. Reading Bluecoats will take anything that can fog a mirror but you need to be exceptional to get into Guildford Grammar. You need to be very bright, or very well connected, to get into Wellington.

The key advantage of private schools is that they can still expel pupils so the dysfunctional, disruptive scroat count is usually zero.

 

One of the things i noticed in my thankfully few years in Reading was the schools.

Theres the insanely competitive state grammar selective ones - that boy school near the RBH and the girls school - Kendriek (state, i think). Then theres scatterings of smallish private schools that seem to pop up all around - Blue coats is one, but I never went that way in town.

But I guess when you meet t80% of the families in Reading you understand why.

The other thing is that getting your kids to anything but the local nearby school requires one parent to become a full time driver - or at least a fulltime sitter in traffic.

 

 

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