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Medical devices are racist


sarahbell
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sarahbell

Oxymeter is racist. Introduced in the 80's. 

People from ethnic minorities died because of it. 

 

Dark skin causes issues apparently.

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Doesn't the gadget shoot light into the body to do it's measuring.  If it isn't penetrating darker skin I can't see what they can do about it.

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One percent

Just listened to this on radio. I immediately thought that to ensure equality, it surely must be banned.   

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sarahbell
36 minutes ago, One percent said:

Just listened to this on radio. I immediately thought that to ensure equality, it surely must be banned.   

I need to read more. Does it under estimate oxygen levels and so people get put on oxygen earlier than they need?

What alternative methods are available of measurement of oxygen

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One percent
1 minute ago, sarahbell said:

I need to read more. Does it under estimate oxygen levels and so people get put on oxygen earlier than they need?

What alternative methods are available of measurement of oxygen

Dunno. They didn’t seem to get passed, it’s racist.  O.o

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sarahbell
1 minute ago, One percent said:

Dunno. They didn’t seem to get passed, it’s racist.  O.o

So are the staff racist for not noticing?

I'd assume putting one on your fingers during training is something people do. A group of students pointing out the difference between white and black fingers might be something that happens. 

 

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sarahbell

https://pubs.asahq.org/anesthesiology/article/102/4/715/7364/Effects-of-Skin-Pigmentation-on-Pulse-Oximeter

 

However, Severinghaus and Kelleher3reviewed data from several investigators who had reported anecdotal errors (+3 to +5%) in black patients.4–7Model simulations of errors due to various pigments were reviewed by Ralston et al.  8Cote et al.  9reported that nail polish and ink on skin surface can cause errors, a finding confirmed anecdotally by others from fingerprinting ink,10henna,11and meconium.12Intravenously injected dyes cause transient errors.13Lee et al.  14found overestimation of saturation, especially at low saturation in pigmented patients (Indian, Malay vs.  Chinese). The Technology Subcommittee of the Working Group on Critical Care, Ontario Ministry of Health,15reported unacceptable errors in pulse oximetry at low saturation in pigmented subjects. Zeballos and Weisman16compared the accuracy of the Hewlett-Packard (Sunnyvale, CA) ear oximeter and the Biox II pulse oximeter (Ohmeda, Andover, MA) in 33 young black men exercising at three different simulated altitudes. At an altitude of 4,000 m, where arterial oxygen saturation (Sao2) ranged from 75 to 84%, the Hewlett-Packard underestimated Sao2by 4.8 ± 1.6%, whereas the Biox overestimated Sao2by 9.8 ± 1.8% (n = 22). It was stated that these errors, previously reported in whites, were both exaggerated in blacks.

During our many years of testing pulse oximeter accuracy at oxygen saturations as low as 50%, we have occasionally noted unusually high positive bias, particularly at very low saturation levels, in some but not in other deeply pigmented subjects. This investigation was therefore specifically designed to determine whether errors at low Sao2correlate with skin color.

Edited by sarahbell
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https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-59363544

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Covid: Sajid Javid orders review of medical device racial bias

xD Devices must not be racist and must work just as well on all skin colours. "Ye cannae change the laws of physics, Jim". xD

Similarly their lack of understanding of why BAMEers are more susceptible to covid fail to acknowledge that darker skin works less well for vitamin d production the further they are away from the equator.

Instead they prefer to look at victimisation of the BAME forced to live in hovels when plenty of poor white folk are also forced to live in shit conditions due to the 'property is my pension' investment ramping of what should be protected basic human resources (along with food and energy) free from price gouging by the selfish.

Too many dickheads in positions of power through who they know rather than merit. No wonder the covid fiasco is an ongoing omnishambles. Next up, blame the non-vaxxed for all the vaxxed still being hospitalised. Er, blame the shit vaccines. Fucking dolts. xD

 

 

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2 hours ago, jamanda said:

I was more thinking of bleaching fingers white to level things up

Aye, give them whatever Wacko Jacko was on post 'Thriller'. It'll be all white in the end. xD

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Well they probably should look at the BMI (body mass index) as well.

 

Back on topic I presume it’s over worked staff checking in on patients - computer says you are fine! ‘Help’

 

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Bornagain

....and unfortunately, in the world where equality of outcome matters more than anything else, then it is possible to imagine that Oxymeters and Aspirin get banned because "equality innit...."

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sarahbell
1 hour ago, Ash4781b said:

Well they probably should look at the BMI (body mass index) as well.

 

Back on topic I presume it’s over worked staff checking in on patients - computer says you are fine! ‘Help’

 

You're right there perhaps. not enough observation done at the observation checks. 
Just cos a number looks Ok doesn't mean it's not.

And tbh your oxygen has to be pretty different to normal to make a different. One or two % is almost irrelevant isn't it?

 

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I thinks this is just theatre, Oxymeters are more likely to understate O2 levels in dark skin?

We all know it's Vit D.

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sarahbell
6 minutes ago, snaga said:

I thinks this is just theatre, Oxymeters are more likely to understate O2 levels in dark skin?

We all know it's Vit D.

But by how much? Enough to actually make a difference?

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12 minutes ago, snaga said:

I thinks this is just theatre, Oxymeters are more likely to understate O2 levels in dark skin?

We all know it's Vit D.

It is true, due to their darker skin absorbing the light used to 'see through' the skin. 

But that does not make a device racist, its simple physics. 

Same for the drugs and treatments acting on races differently, a doctor treating a white British the same as a black African has the potential to even kill them. 

 

I see all of these people calling racism but not a single answer of what technologies can replace them with similar costs and ease of use, or even replace them at all.

 

The only logical way to move forward is accept the differences (Which most will never do unless it benefits them) and have some real information for people to make informed choices. 

 

I can see it now.. Even more held back progress, higher costs and worse outcomes due to refusing to fund or use 'racist' technology. 

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46 minutes ago, Myco said:

It is true, due to their darker skin absorbing the light used to 'see through' the skin. 

But that does not make a device racist, its simple physics. 

is it's registering a low reading, then that's beneficial to darker skinned people, as NHS will intervene earlier than with paler skinned people. I think that's what this will show. So the devices may be "racist" against white people.

 

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ninjaborrower
13 hours ago, jamanda said:

 

Doesn't the gadget shoot light into the body to do it's measuring.  If it isn't penetrating darker skin I can't see what they can do about it.

Dont black people have white hands,?

 

download.jpeg

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