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‘Variants are created in the unvaccinated’


Boglet
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Right, I want to dive into this statement which seems to be parroted by vax fans and I’ve earnestly done some reading of articles that make this proposition, quoting ‘experts’ and so on.

 E.g. https://www.businessinsider.com/unvaccinated-people-are-variant-factories-disease-expert-says-2021-7?r=US&IR=T

This one is from July 2021, so well after we knew for sure that the vaccinated also catch and transmit the virus.

I’m completely willing to have it explained to me what the mechanism is for the unvaxxed being variant factories but I haven’t yet found reasoning that makes any logical sense to me.

Reason being – We’ve long been told that the medical world has an issue with ‘superbugs’ such as MRSA, which are resistant to antibiotics. I thought it was well understood and accepted science that the reason for this was overuse of antibiotics, driving the bacteria to evolve variants that can survive the antibiotics. Seems to me that this is a pretty good analogy for covid and vaccines? Can someone explain why for covid it’s apparently the opposite way round?

Can we not solve the superbug bacteria problem by just pumping everyone full of antibiotics?

if it weren't for all the selfish anti-antibiotixers there would be no superbugs

Edited by Boglet
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maynardgravy

I can't see how it would make a difference either way. The jab doesn't stop transmission so applies zero filters.

Unless..... The unvaxxed have better immunity leading to filters that the unvaxxed don't have because they have fucked theirs up???

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The argument used which has a sliver of logic is that if you have 100 vaxxed, and 100 unvaxxed, and they are all exposed to covid, the 100 unvaxxed catch it whilst only 1 vaxxed catches it.  So you have 100 chances for mutation in the unvaxxed and 1 in the vaxxed.

What this fails utterly to do it to recognise a few things; one, the virus will be mutating all the time in everybody.  the one that infected the unvaxxed is going to be more likely to be able to sidestep the vaccination -in the unvaxxed that is not an advantage.  So the 100 variations in the unvaxxed will be of no consequence.  Meanwhile the one in the vaxxed now goes yum yum yum and attacks more vaxxed targets.

two, these leaky vaccines are shit.  we don't know the ratio, but I suspect after 5 months it's more like 100 vaxxed and 90 unvaxxed will catch.  No real difference in mutation factories.

three - in the unvaxxed, the mutations will select for less dangerous variants; less symptoms means people avoid you less, which means more spread, which is 'winning' for the virus.  in the vaxxed, the key driver is whether it sidesteps the vaccination, so you might get a more dangerous variant which normally would die out, but is much better at infecting the vaxxed than other, less dangerous variants.

So overall, it's clear that the vaccinated spread evasion variants.  SAGE meeting minutes, number 93, say as much.

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Virgil Caine

The virus main goal in life is to reproduce itself. Natural selection would tend to favour variants that could survive and spread in the host population. As more of the latter have been vaccinated than not I would have thought the process would favour variants of the virus that could spread in that group.

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13 minutes ago, Virgil Caine said:

The virus main goal in life is to reproduce itself. Natural selection would tend to favour variants that could survive and spread in the host population. As more of the latter have been vaccinated than not I would have thought the process would favour variants of the virus that could spread in that group.

I agree.

Also agree that the theory suggests that according to statistics the vaccinated are the largest group and the petri dish for it’s survival.

My opinion is that the human race is currently playing with fire….meddling too much with nature…..money, arrogance, greed, muddling through, planned? I don’t really know but have a bad gut feeling about coof vaxxes.

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8 hours ago, Boglet said:

Right, I want to dive into this statement which seems to be parroted by vax fans and I’ve earnestly done some reading of articles that make this proposition, quoting ‘experts’ and so on.

 E.g. https://www.businessinsider.com/unvaccinated-people-are-variant-factories-disease-expert-says-2021-7?r=US&IR=T

This one is from July 2021, so well after we knew for sure that the vaccinated also catch and transmit the virus.

I’m completely willing to have it explained to me what the mechanism is for the unvaxxed being variant factories but I haven’t yet found reasoning that makes any logical sense to me.

Reason being – We’ve long been told that the medical world has an issue with ‘superbugs’ such as MRSA, which are resistant to antibiotics. I thought it was well understood and accepted science that the reason for this was overuse of antibiotics, driving the bacteria to evolve variants that can survive the antibiotics. Seems to me that this is a pretty good analogy for covid and vaccines? Can someone explain why for covid it’s apparently the opposite way round?

Can we not solve the superbug bacteria problem by just pumping everyone full of antibiotics?

if it weren't for all the selfish anti-antibiotixers there would be no superbugs

Vaccines generally don't drive vaccine escape.  This is because:

  • Viral load in the vaccinated is very low, and evolution needs the sheer numbers of viral particles to create the mutations.
  • Vaccines generally use proteins from the whole virus (usually it is the whole virus inactivated or attenuated in some way).  Thus protection is maintained even with a mutation here or there that might evade one particular antibody (or other immune mechanism).
  • Vaccines generally aren't given in vast numbers during epidemic episodes.
  • Usually with vaccines you only give a relatively small number each year the vaccine, generally focused on those most vulnerable to the disease.
  • Sometimes with vaccines there aren't much in the way of circulating antibodies; instead, the vaccine creates beta memory cells that produce antibodies upon infection.
  • Many viruses don't evolve that quickly anyway (particularly DNA viruses).

This generally works with vaccines.  There nearly always will be vaccine escape eventually, so long as the disease is actually still spreading around somewhere -- but generally the above points keep vaccine escape evolution to tolerably long timescales.

Given the very very low viral load in the vaccinated infected for most vaccines, it is very likely that escape variants will mutate in the unvaccinated (by chance -- they won't have any stimulus to do so) and then cause trouble in the vaccinated community.  I believe that this is why they keep on going on about variants being created by the vaccinated -- it generally is the case and its the sort of thing that you might pick up from a lecture.

But the covid vaccines are different.  They fail every one of the bullet points above -- frankly, if you wanted to design an experiment to create the fastest possible vaccine escape you couldn't do it better.

We've done the immunological equivalent of sticking a sign saying 'KICK ME' on our back, gone to a rugby club, shouted '£100 for everyone that kicks me', slapped the team captain and then bent over the pool table with trousers around ankles.

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mosstrooper
8 hours ago, maynardgravy said:

I can't see how it would make a difference either way. The jab doesn't stop transmission so applies zero filters.

Unless..... The unvaxxed have better immunity leading to filters that the unvaxxed don't have because they have fucked theirs up???

We can only hope. The sheer amount of bile being spewed by the sanctimonious jabbed cretins has been an eye opener for me. We are never going back to the normal before 2019.

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It's pretty simple.

You have a person, unvaccinated who has never had covid = not much chance of creating a new 'variant'

You have a person, unvaccinated who had covid and has recovered, that happened in the past = not much chance of creating a new 'variant' today.

You have a person, unvaccinated who has covid and will kill all variants with the same vigour, in about 2 weeks. If not then this new variant will kill everybody on the planet.

Then you have the vaccinated....

walking-dead-zombie-crowd-1024x683.thumb.png.b20a6c167407271a79a2b4c2d0c75b43.png

 

 

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