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Frank Hovis

Prison Governors' Association says "let them all out"

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You would expect the president of the Prison Governors' Association to be calling for more staff and more modern prison buildings.

But no:

Addressing the association's annual conference on Tuesday, Ms Albutt will say: "The government must be brave and reduce the prison population and don't worry about votes.

"Don't dabble, just do it - because morally it is the right thing to do."

Ms Albutt believes short sentences are "pointless" because they do not work.

She will say that those on sentences of less than a year could instead be dealt with in the community.

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-41561659

 

Define "pointless". A burglar or mugger off the streets for a year works for me.

 

And stop laughing at "Ms Albutt".

 

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13 minutes ago, Frank Hovis said:

You would expect the president of the Prison Governors' Association to be calling for more staff and more modern prison buildings.

But no:

Addressing the association's annual conference on Tuesday, Ms Albutt will say: "The government must be brave and reduce the prison population and don't worry about votes.

"Don't dabble, just do it - because morally it is the right thing to do."

Ms Albutt believes short sentences are "pointless" because they do not work.

She will say that those on sentences of less than a year could instead be dealt with in the community.

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-41561659

 

Define "pointless". A burglar or mugger off the streets for a year works for me.

 

And stop laughing at "Ms Albutt".

 

When i read this I misread "Albutt" as "Abbott" and thought that was the reason she said to let 'em all out. After all there are only 3 of them. Or is it 30 million, 300,000 or a trillion? All these numbers look the same.

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14 minutes ago, Frank Hovis said:

You would expect the president of the Prison Governors' Association to be calling for more staff and more modern prison buildings.

But no:

Addressing the association's annual conference on Tuesday, Ms Albutt will say: "The government must be brave and reduce the prison population and don't worry about votes.

"Don't dabble, just do it - because morally it is the right thing to do."

Ms Albutt believes short sentences are "pointless" because they do not work.

She will say that those on sentences of less than a year could instead be dealt with in the community.

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-41561659

 

Define "pointless". A burglar or mugger off the streets for a year works for me.

 

And stop laughing at "Ms Albutt".

 

Oh good, 'dealt with in the community', huh?

Would that be like the wonderful 'care in the community' where treatment for the seriously mentally ill mainly involves letting them run around town centres shouting at pigeons? 

Or, as has happened here a couple of times, succumbing to the voices and stabbing people to death?

Any scheme that involves the words 'in the community' should be read by the general public as 'it's your fucking problem now'.

Jesus.

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The government should "be brave" and remove her from her post instantly, since her comments have clearly illustrated that she is not fit to be a prison wardress, let alone president of the Prison Governors Association.

oops sorry, just remembered that Amber Rudd is home secretary, who is far too busy drafting laws to curtail the right to hold opinions contrary to those proscribed by the state to worry about such things.

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The yanks have a "three strikes and you're out" policy. Tbh, if you're sent to prison three times your obviously a 'rong 'un that will never learn your lesson. Just lock them up and forget about rehabilitation. 4 to a cell and they're never let out.

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Prison has two purposes.

To protect society from the scum who would harm it.

To rehabilitate people so they don't want to harm society.

If you want it to cost less you could do home prison.

Big cage put in the corner of the person's lounge with a bed and a slop bucket. Family is then responsible for feeding and helping slop out. Cost to society = cost of installing cage and a bucket.
 

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1 minute ago, Great Guy said:

The yanks have a "three strikes and you're out" policy. Tbh, if you're sent to prison three times your obviously a 'rong 'un that will never learn your lesson. Just lock them up and forget about rehabilitation. 4 to a cell and they're never let out.

And they are put to use as labour and produce a lot especially for the US military.  I know this because arch-luvvie Stephen Fry was having a whinge about "prison slavery".

Well, everybody else is required to work in order to eat and have a bed.

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Any foreign prisoner in jail should less than 10 years should be instantly deported. And their family. And never let back in.

UK nations in for non violent/sex crimes should be let out if less than 2 years service left.

Shoplifting and nicking should be let and forced to do community service at weekend.

Young offenders for non violence let out but ankled to be in before 8pm and forced into community service at weekend.

UKGOV should organise a version of a chain gain in regions  to take all these people and make them do menial task at the weekend and keep them inside after 8pm.

Make them work during the week to pay for their food and accomodation. And take their weekends off them. FFS is it taht difficult?

The technology for this sort of stuff is dirt cheap. Use it it.

 

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6 minutes ago, spygirl said:

Any foreign prisoner in jail should less than 10 years should be instantly deported. And their family. And never let back in.

UK nations in for non violent/sex crimes should be let out if less than 2 years service left.

Shoplifting and nicking should be let and forced to do community service at weekend.

Young offenders for non violence let out but ankled to be in before 8pm and forced into community service at weekend.

UKGOV should organise a version of a chain gain in regions  to take all these people and make them do menial task at the weekend and keep them inside after 8pm.

Make them work during the week to pay for their food and accomodation. And take their weekends off them. FFS is it taht difficult?

The technology for this sort of stuff is dirt cheap. Use it it.

 

We've got a team of probationers working to cut the grass paths and trim the hedges on our allotment site. Only problem with that is they undercut the contractor we previously employed.

Using them for stuff that wouldn't get done as to pay a contractor would cost too much makes sense though.

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Imprisonment is a useless punishment. It is more of a training school for criminals and terrorists. That said it is important to keep the scum out of general population. What is missing is a real financial punishment.

In the modern world people (criminals especially) care more about money than keeping their liberty 100% time. In other words, most people would suffer a short-to-medium term loss of liberty if they got to keep a £1,000,000-£10,000,000, particularly if their lawyer sorted them out with a stretch in a category C or open prison arrangement away from the nutters.

The sea change that needs to occur is from 19th century imprisonment only type nonsense to strict financial punishment. Any prison sentence would be charged at £3,000 per month and paid off in full at the end of the sentence. If payment was not forthcoming, the prisoner would have the charge placed on their head and sent to a labour camp if no other plan for payment was established.

In the case of non-violent "white-collar" crimes the perpetrator should be wiped out financially, House, bank accounts, everything and a flag put against them so that any significant assets that show up in future can be seized. Prison is an after thought in these cases.

Edited by billfunk
Of off

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5 minutes ago, billfunk said:

Imprisonment is a useless punishment. It is more of a training school for criminals and terrorists. That said it is important to keep the scum out of general population. What is missing is a real financial punishment.

 

Very true, particularly at the moment.

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26 minutes ago, the gardener said:

We've got a team of probationers working to cut the grass paths and trim the hedges on our allotment site. Only problem with that is they undercut the contractor we previously employed.

Using them for stuff that wouldn't get done as to pay a contractor would cost too much makes sense though.

Again, there's a lot of stuff they can be doing, without impeding commercial contractors/council workers.

Using probationers is not about saving money, more about getting them to jump thru hoops on their weekends whilst they work the week.

Co-orrdingating sutff ought to be easy - bar useless public sector type.

again this is for non violent cons.

Have a coordinator - could be a charity, Quakers are good a t hi stuff, to organise the work schedule.

Cutting old ladies gardens, sorting out schools outside/painting, that sort of stuff.

 

 

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13 minutes ago, sleepwello'nights said:

Why not just imprison all offenders somewhere else in the world. What about Australia? Oh its been done? 

Did it work?

It got the scum far away from society at a relatively small cost. It worked exceptionally well.

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3 hours ago, Frank Hovis said:

Here's Attica; too much of a faff to do on the phone:

 

The inmates; are the citizens now

While the citizens; are the inmates now

 

Berlin, New York, London: prisons.

Kirk Brandon has sticky out ears.

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11 minutes ago, MrPin said:

Britain imprisons too many for minor stuff. We are up there with USA and China.

Au contraire, we don't imprison enough.  The number of second, third, fifteenth chances given by judges to clearly habitual offenders is ridiculous.

The US imprisonment rate is 4.5x that of England and Wales.

China's is surprisingly low; marginally less than ours.  I was surprised; maybe they don't bother with prison but just shoot people.

http://www.prisonstudies.org/highest-to-lowest/prison_population_rate?field_region_taxonomy_tid=All

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55 minutes ago, Frank Hovis said:

Au contraire, we don't imprison enough.  The number of second, third, fifteenth chances given by judges to clearly habitual offenders is ridiculous.

The US imprisonment rate is 4.5x that of England and Wales.

China's is surprisingly low; marginally less than ours.  I was surprised; maybe they don't bother with prison but just shoot people.

http://www.prisonstudies.org/highest-to-lowest/prison_population_rate?field_region_taxonomy_tid=All

Here here.

What we have in this country is the deliberate underimprisonment of offenders so as to demoralise and imprison the population a la Alinsky.

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12 hours ago, Mirror Mirror said:

The government should "be brave" and remove her from her post instantly, since her comments have clearly illustrated that she is not fit to be a prison wardress, let alone president of the Prison Governors Association.

oops sorry, just remembered that Amber Rudd is home secretary, who is far too busy drafting laws to curtail the right to hold opinions contrary to those proscribed by the state to worry about such things.

In hard times it seems silly to have women in positions like these two, especially if they speak and act in ways like this. 

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