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Sgt Hartman

What sort of sentence is this!?

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Incredible. Pissed as a fart, speeding and kills two young girls.

For this he receives...six years.

Potentially out in three.

I've seen a few pissant judgements like this involving cars killing kids. I think the judiciary need to start having a serious word with themselves.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-hampshire-39587564

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Yes it did look stupidly lenient but when I read the DM article through he was only just over the limit on the breath test although the prosecution were pushing the notion he must have been well over at the time of the accident, it's speculation really. 

The drink drive limits need changing in my view, to a level there is just no prospect of driving for at least a couple of hours after even a single pint.

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4 minutes ago, SNACR said:

Yes it did look stupidly lenient but when I read the DM article through he was only just over the limit on the breath test although the prosecution were pushing the notion he must have been well over at the time of the accident, it's speculation really. 

The drink drive limits need changing in my view, to a level there is just no prospect of driving for at least a couple of hours after even a single pint.

Why? I am entirely fine on two pints, my reactions and anticipation (I can always tell at roundabouts) are as good as when I've had none and better than when I'm tired.

This continual "crank it down" approach is unnecessary; it is fine at two pints. 

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Seems outrageous IMO, didn't someone get put away for a year after they chucked some bacon in a mosque?

I'm surprised he was just over the limit, if I'd had what's on his drinks list I think I'd be pretty well arseholed. 

There were a couple of boy racers near here that were doing about 70 in a 30, they obliterated a nine year old and for that were given the princely sum of four years. 

These sentences are bullshit.

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27 minutes ago, Frank Hovis said:

Why? I am entirely fine on two pints, my reactions and anticipation (I can always tell at roundabouts) are as good as when I've had none and better than when I'm tired.

This continual "crank it down" approach is unnecessary; it is fine at two pints. 

Is it worth it? 

If someone pulls out in front of you, on your way home after just two pints, once the Police have breathalysed you they won't bother doing much accident investigating after that.

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13 minutes ago, Sgt Hartman said:

Seems outrageous IMO, didn't someone get put away for a year after they chucked some bacon in a mosque?

I'm surprised he was just over the limit, if I'd had what's on his drinks list I think I'd be pretty well arseholed. 

There were a couple of boy racers near here that were doing about 70 in a 30, they obliterated a nine year old and for that were given the princely sum of four years. 

These sentences are bullshit.

As soon as they allow broadband, in prison, I'm not sure a prison sentence is going to be any deterrent at all.

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29 minutes ago, Frank Hovis said:

Why? I am entirely fine on two pints, my reactions and anticipation (I can always tell at roundabouts) are as good as when I've had none and better than when I'm tired.

This continual "crank it down" approach is unnecessary; it is fine at two pints. 

Funny. I would be slaughtered on two pints but sober as a judge on 2 large glasses of wine. Each to their own. If we go for zero levels it will kill the pub and restaurant trade.

That said, on what this guy had - ten years at least.

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Just now, SNACR said:

As soon as they allow broadband, in prison, I'm not sure a prison sentence is going to be any deterrent at all.

It is if you're in for insulting the religion of peace in some way - Britain's prisons are run by muslim gangs.

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6 minutes ago, This Time said:

Yep, a year in jail for putting bacon on a mosque. He died in prison.

So, going by the sentences we have before us. One packet of danepak rindless (the misuse of) is the equivalent of around five years of life that these girls had.

Makes perfect sense. >:(

 

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9 minutes ago, SNACR said:

Is it worth it? 

If someone pulls out in front of you, on your way home after just two pints, once the Police have breathalysed you they won't bother doing much accident investigating after that.

I'd be within the legal limit and in terms of my driving ability / reaction times I am not taking any additional risk.

I don't these days drink during the day at all (not through any effort of my own or external influence, just don't fancy it) so the only time this matters is early in the morning and I cap myself to having what will be at most a pint equivalent of alcohol when I get behind the wheel; so comfortably under the limit.

I don't drink drive at all - in my terms, as in being adversely affected - these days but when I did drink during the day I found that two pints of decent bitter (2.5 units each) at lunchtime and then driving did affect me and so I stopped doing it.

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1 minute ago, blobloblob said:

This one from round here - racing each other through a 30 limit, killed a 9 year old. 4 year sentence so realistically just 2 years inside.

http://www.rossendalefreepress.co.uk/news/local-news/boy-racers-who-tailgated-double-12519338

That's the one I was talking about above. Disgustingly short sentence.

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4 minutes ago, Sgt Hartman said:

That's the one I was talking about above. Disgustingly short sentence.

Ah, so you did and I scrolled straight past. Takes the piss that they got so little, it really does.

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Might as well keep up my record of strongly disagreeing in cases like this. You could lock the driver up for 20 years and the girls are still going to be dead. In fact I'd go so far as to say in a case like this, where the driver was driving badly, and clearly impaired, but not obviously racing or deliberately driving dangerously, there's not much point locking him up at all. Better to hand down a sentence of 2000+ hours of community service so he can give something back to the society he deprived of two promising young people.

With a 5-10 year driving ban, of course. I also think that there ought to be a two strikes and you're out rule for drink driving and dangerous driving, with custody the punishment for anyone caught driving while disqualified.

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58 minutes ago, Rave said:

Might as well keep up my record of strongly disagreeing in cases like this. You could lock the driver up for 20 years and the girls are still going to be dead. In fact I'd go so far as to say in a case like this, where the driver was driving badly, and clearly impaired, but not obviously racing or deliberately driving dangerously, there's not much point locking him up at all. Better to hand down a sentence of 2000+ hours of community service so he can give something back to the society he deprived of two promising young people.

With a 5-10 year driving ban, of course. I also think that there ought to be a two strikes and you're out rule for drink driving and dangerous driving, with custody the punishment for anyone caught driving while disqualified.

I can see where you are coming from but I'd disagree with the 'not deliberately driving dangerously' part.

If he consumed what is being reported that he did, the man got behind the wheel of his car absolutely shitfaced, he was also speeding. That for me is deliberate dangerous driving.

If I were one of the parents, I'd be beyond outraged with three years for the death of my child. The boy racers above got away with four years for killing a little girl. That's absolutely nothing and I'll bet in five years time, neither of them will be giving a shit about what they did. I doubt they did at the time.

If we are going to stick with the six years I'd add the 2000 hours community sentence on to that (if you can pin them down to do it). Plus a total driving ban.

The UK's roads are getting worse, the volume of traffic and pedestrians now is making driving very hard work. Standards on the road (IMO) have dropped through the floor, whether that's because of the former I'm not sure; but we certainly should have a low tolerance for dick driving, there just isn't the margins for gross stupidity any more.

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1 hour ago, Rave said:

Better to hand down a sentence of 2000+ hours of community service so he can give something back to the society he deprived of two promising young people.

With a 5-10 year driving ban, of course. I also think that there ought to be a two strikes and you're out rule for drink driving and dangerous driving, with custody the punishment for anyone caught driving while disqualified.


I am in favour of community service for non-dangerous offenders.

Dangerous driving is only dangerous if they have access to a car. So they could be banned from driving for life. Why not? 

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1 hour ago, sarahbell said:


I am in favour of community service for non-dangerous offenders.

Dangerous driving is only dangerous if they have access to a car. So they could be banned from driving for life. Why not? 

Because maybe some people learn from mistakes, and the job might require driving!

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2 hours ago, Sgt Hartman said:

If I were one of the parents, I'd be beyond outraged with three years for the death of my child. The boy racers above got away with four years for killing a little girl. That's absolutely nothing and I'll bet in five years time, neither of them will be giving a shit about what they did. I doubt they did at the time.

If we are going to stick with the six years I'd add the 2000 hours community sentence on to that (if you can pin them down to do it). Plus a total driving ban.

The UK's roads are getting worse, the volume of traffic and pedestrians now is making driving very hard work. Standards on the road (IMO) have dropped through the floor, whether that's because of the former I'm not sure; but we certainly should have a low tolerance for dick driving, there just isn't the margins for gross stupidity any more.

I'd be outraged if I were the parents too, but that's why sentences are handed down by judges rather than grieving relatives. It's a massive presumption to say that this guy, or the two guys racing, don't give a shit. They could be consumed with guilt and grief, you really don't know.

As for the UK's roads getting worse, in terms of traffic volume and general incompetence they may well be. But the trend for numbers of serious / fatal injuries continues to trend down, as do deaths and injuries due to, and convictions for, drink driving.

https://www.drinkdriving.org/drink_driving_statistics_uk.php

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1 hour ago, MrPin said:

Because maybe some people learn from mistakes, and the job might require driving!

There are also some people who realise that drinking and driving is a big mistake without having to experience it for themselves.

Interestingly his cocktail was one also drunken by the defendant in the case I was on last year.

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1 hour ago, Rave said:

I'd be outraged if I were the parents too, but that's why sentences are handed down by judges rather than grieving relatives. It's a massive presumption to say that this guy, or the two guys racing, don't give a shit. They could be consumed with guilt and grief, you really don't know.

As for the UK's roads getting worse, in terms of traffic volume and general incompetence they may well be. But the trend for numbers of serious / fatal injuries continues to trend down, as do deaths and injuries due to, and convictions for, drink driving.

https://www.drinkdriving.org/drink_driving_statistics_uk.php

It is a presumption I'll admit, but in the case of the racers (I've not assumed anything about the other guy apart from he's an idiot) I'm happy to assume that people who race each other through residential 30 zones at 70 mph couldn't give a toss about anybody else, they wouldn't have done it in the first place otherwise.

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7 hours ago, sarahbell said:


I am in favour of community service for non-dangerous offenders.

Dangerous driving is only dangerous if they have access to a car. So they could be banned from driving for life. Why not? 

Anybody who causes a death through some fault in their driving should be banned for life.

If they don't like it they can fuck off and spend their time standing at the bus stop thinking about what a twat they've been.

 

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