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Hopeful

Is it a devalued 1st ? (for > 25% of students)

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First-class honours for a quarter of UK graduates

 

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More than one in four UK students graduated from university with a first-class degree last year, data shows.

 

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the share of graduates with the highest possible result rose 44% in five years.

 

I'd like to see the breakdown between old and new Universities.

A 1st is becoming worthless IMO. Lumbered with debt and a degree with no more value than 25% of the rest.

 

Edited by Hopeful

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Ridiculous isn't it?

So, 50% of young people going to University, and they are so clever that 1:4 are getting Firsts.

Just an extension of prizes for all.

Doesn't bare thinking of how clever they are compared to the older thickos (who voted Brexit, like Trump, are anti-immigration and are generally misogynist).

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I got mine in the mid-nineties. I was told there was a quota and despite having the grades, nothing was guaranteed. My lecturer mentioned that the likes of Cambridge had a higher quota.

Less than 10% in my discipline got a first. Too many got a 2:1 and that is the main reason I worked hard to ensure I stood out from the other students.

Edited by OurDayWillCome

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7 minutes ago, Hopeful said:

First-class honours for a quarter of UK graduates

 

 

 

I'd like to see the breakdown between old and new Universities.

A 1st is becoming worthless IMO. Lumbered with debt and a degree with no more value than 25% of the rest.

 

The tell will be, as you say, which universities are more likely to award a first. 

Trots off to find out....

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Just now, OurDayWillCome said:

I got mine in the mid-nineties. I was told there was a quota and despite having the grades, nothing was guaranteed. My lecturer mentioned that the likes of Cambridge had a higher quota.

I got mine a long long time ago. The lecturers said only the top 5% would get firsts. They actually went over this figure in our year due to some exceptional students but had to get that signed off.

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1 minute ago, davidg said:

I got mine a long long time ago. The lecturers said only the top 5% would get firsts. They actually went over this figure in our year due to some exceptional students but had to get that signed off.

And that’s how it should be - it was the fear of being pipped at the post by another student that kept me striving for a +90% average.

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I was awarded my first class degree (psychology) through the open university in 2006 when I was in my 40’s. To be awarded that I had to have an average score of 85% in assignments and exams IIRC.

When I went to my graduation ceremony I was seated in the first two rows of about 40 to 50 rows. The first two rows were PhD, masters and firsts The it was seconds etc from then. I certainly felt I’d done well and that a first was an achievement bestowed on a minority. As an aside I was allowed to choose a Bsc or a Ba. I chose a Ba because while I think psychology is most interesting and a lot of it can be useful I do not regard it as a science!

I’m not sure how OU fares now though in what’s needed to be awarded a first.

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20 minutes ago, OurDayWillCome said:

And that’s how it should be - it was the fear of being pipped at the post by another student that kept me striving for a +90% average.

+90%?!? Wow, you deserve that first. No one on my physics course got higher than mid-80s (and several of them are now professors at Russell Group institutions). 

Edited by The Generation Game

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10 minutes ago, The Generation Game said:

+90%?!? Wow, you deserve that first. No one on my physics course got higher than mid-80s (and several of them are now professors at Russell Group institutions). 

My teen years were fairly wild. Got it out of my system by Uni and only went to the pub on a Friday and Saturday because I worked behind the bar :-) I would not have been getting +90% on a physics degree!

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I got mine in 2000, in a difficult discipline too (Electronic engineering), my year as odd there were two firsts awarded but no 2:1 everyone else was awarded a 2:2 or lower the cohort was about 15 people if I remember correctly. This was at a ex poly but one with a reasonable reputation for engineering.

 Funny thing is looking back it did not really prepare me to be an practicing engineer, hence the importance of your first few design roles 

Edited by ad_ceng

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My mum is doing her second degree at a former polytechnic to keep her occupied in retirement (she’s 72) - funded by herself. She’s on course to gain a first which is an admirable achievement especially as her faculties are going. 

(Ex-university (English) lecturer herself which is an advantage)

Edited by longtomsilver

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Im not suee its just 1st, which Ive neber paid any intention to, orat least ignore as most people i know with are not the most rounded.

Theres no QA between Unis, courses, different years etc. 

Bar technical degrees at red bricks, the enture degree thing is devaled or, more accurately, using a degree and award asa means of choosing someone is pretty pointless - they cant be trusted any more.

For non voc degrees thats not an issue. But then you beed to question why someone did a degree and incurred the cost.

Imho, for vocational degrees , it just gives you a chance to learn some theory and learn a broad range of rekated subjects. Ive interviwed people who, on paper, were genius - 4 As st A 2.1 1st from Russell. On the application ofknowledge they were shit.

 

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49 minutes ago, ad_ceng said:

I got mine in 2000, in a difficult discipline too (Electronic engineering), my year as odd there were two firsts awarded but no 2:1 everyone else was awarded a 2:2 or lower the cohort was about 15 people if I remember correctly. This was at a ex poly but one with a reasonable reputation for engineering.

 Funny thing is looking back it did not really prepare me to be an practicing engineer, hence the importance of your first few design roles 

In the more technical typically need 2-5 years before you have enough experience. You realky do need to spend the first few years getting experience.

Its shocking hiw many people drop out certain skill roles - used to ve finance, sometimes consulting. I avoid these sort of people. Anyone who jacks in practising a technical role after 2-3  to consult or manage triggers my buffonometer.

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1 hour ago, The Generation Game said:

+90%?!? Wow, you deserve that first. No one on my physics course got higher than mid-80s (and several of them are now professors at Russell Group institutions). 

Same here. I believe the top mark on my undergraduate maths degree in the 80s was 86%. A guy who got just a bit less than that went on to be one of the youngest full professors ever at ETH.

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2 minutes ago, spygirl said:

In the more technical typically need 2-5 years before you have enough experience. You realky do need to spend the first few years getting experience.

Its shocking hiw many people drop out certain skill roles - used to ve finance, sometimes consulting. I avoid these sort of people. Anyone who jacks in practising a technical role after 2-3  to consult or manage triggers my buffonometer.

So very true, nearly 18 years later and I am still technical and delivering. I never understood getting a technical degree and not using it 

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3 minutes ago, ad_ceng said:

So very true, nearly 18 years later and I am still technical and delivering. I never understood getting a technical degree and not using it 

Its pretty shocking having domeone come in eith a top academic record and flunking an interview. Or not knowing the basics.

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2 minutes ago, spygirl said:

Its pretty shocking having domeone come in eith a top academic record and flunking an interview. Or not knowing the basics.

I have seen it many times, over the years. Sadly good engineers are hard to find which is why most companies end up in messes especially defense organisations 

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2 hours ago, OurDayWillCome said:

I got mine in the mid-nineties. I was told there was a quota and despite having the grades, nothing was guaranteed. My lecturer mentioned that the likes of Cambridge had a higher quota.

Less than 10% in my discipline got a first. Too many got a 2:1 and that is the main reason I worked hard to ensure I stood out from the other students.

Similar experience here, graduated in 1994 from northern redbrick Russell group uni, I would say 10% or less got a 1st - and you knew who they were because they were either fucking brilliant at their subject or the spods who never went out and destroyed their brains and livers (like most my cohort!).  A fair proportion got 2:1's and a fairly large proportion got 2:2's

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I got my degree from the North London Poly in the 1980s.

Standards were just about high enough for Jeremy C:Old:byn to leave without a degree, but otherwise we went around in threes. One could read, one could write and the third just liked the company of intellectuals.

But we did have a subsidized bar and although I didn't do so well education wise,  I can still drink any two Oxbridge graduates under the table 

 

Edited by humdrum

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23 minutes ago, ad_ceng said:

So very true, nearly 18 years later and I am still technical and delivering. I never understood getting a technical degree and not using it 

Many thought there was a a worthwhile and well paid job at the end of it, come the milk round my cohort saw the likes of the management consultancies and others and the wages that they were offering and thought sod it.

Likewise after a year on placement of a thick sandwich course I found the 3 following years of university (good rep) pretty useless for the the job itself.

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I did electronics with a computing option (microprocessors) in the 1980s. The degree was quite a lot of work, we had 20 hours+ of lectures and perhaps double, maybe more of homework. Luckily it was an engineering oriented uni so the only women were dykes.

I went into IT, although I feel I was fairly productive reasonbly quickly I'd say it takes about 7 years (like an old style apprenticeship) to be proficient in IT, that is to have enough experience to know when some idea or other is stupid.

Now in my twilight years of my career and just aiming for retirement with as little stress as possible; once I sort out my job change!

Edited by davidg

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