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spygirl

So many unasked questions

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I remember this as it was so Wtf!

And i used to drink in the old purple turtle, some 25 years ago.

http://www.readingchronicle.co.uk/news/15773401.WATCH__Bus_driver_who_ploughed_into_pedestrian_banned_from_driving_for_two_years/

Did he have a license? If so, what country?

How long had he been driving buses? What trsining did he have.

Who the fuck takes their passport to work?

If he needs photo id yhen he can get a uk photo driving license. Or is that the problem?

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2 minutes ago, One percent said:

I don’t believe he hit the accelerator instead of the brake. I’ve never even come close to doing that in all my years of driving. More surprisingly though is that this was actually believed   

Ahh thats it though.Your many years of driving.

He might have borrowed his mates license.

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You were driving a hybrid bus and they have as I understand a habit of surging forward slightly which is normal.

---

If electric, they have much faster acceleration than a sole diesel engine. I think I believe him. 

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2 minutes ago, One percent said:

I don’t believe he hit the accelerator instead of the brake. I’ve never even come close to doing that in all my years of driving. More surprisingly though is that this was actually believed   

You'ere a decent driver.

I did my motorbike training at an excellent Sunday morning venue in west London.  They were volunteers so the fees were notional and the CBT deliberately went over weeks or months rather than an afternoon as the commerical operators do it.

On the course was an older ?60 lady called Joan who had been a cleaner in the Channel Islands and was retiring to rural Norfolk, so rural that it had no bus service so she thought to get a moped to get around.

She had never driven so rather than try to cope with gears for the first time (especially those odd foot operated motorcycle gears) she trained on a "twist and go" scooter.  Accelerator and brake only.

Whilst we all graduated to the roads (even me, who wasn't a natural) Joan was never allowed out of the school playground where the course was held.

This was because every time she became flustered she mixed up the brake and accelerator.

Joan was frequently seen accelerating across the playing field or in one case jamming her bike under the playground rail because she had crashed into it at speed.

I had sympathy because her planned retirement was not going to work; but she should never be allowed to drive on public roads.

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1 minute ago, Frank Hovis said:

You'ere a decent driver.

I did my motorbike training at an excellent Sunday morning venue in west London.  They were volunteers so the fees were notional and the CBT deliberately went over weeks or months rather than an afternoon as the commerical operators do it.

On the course was an older ?60 lady called Joan who had been a cleaner in the Channel Islands and was retiring to rural Norfolk, so rural that it had no bus service so she thought to get a moped to get around.

She had never driven so rather than try to cope with gears for the first time (especially those odd foot operated motorcycle gears) she trained on a "twist and go" scooter.  Accelerator and brake only.

Whilst we all graduated to the roads (even me, who wasn't a natural) Joan was never allowed out of the school playground where the course was held.

This was because every time she became flustered she mixed up the brake and accelerator.

Joan was frequently seen accelerating across the playing field or in one case jamming her bike under the playground rail because she had crashed into it at speed.

I had sympathy because her planned retirement was not going to work; but she should never be allowed to drive on public roads.

Ok but Joan wasn’t employed to drive busses. Anyone who can’t tell the brake from the accelerator has no business being paid to drive. 

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8 minutes ago, One percent said:

Wasn’t it checked?  If not his employers would be in the dock alongside him, surely?  

Well thats it. They are not saying.

The fact its him in the dock rather than busco. And the fact there seems to have been no other incidents points to him.

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1 minute ago, One percent said:

Ok but Joan wasn’t employed to drive buses. Anyone who can’t tell the brake from the accelerator has no business being paid to drive. 

But they'll take anyone!

<refers again to concertina file of anecdotes>

A "spiky" work colleague had a browbeaten husband who could not hold a job down; I met him a couple of times, nice but understandably quiet guy.

He was pushed to take a job with the local bus company but, being an unconfident driver, made sure in the interview that he would only be driving local routes around the roads that he knew in SE London.  "Yes, yes" was the response.

Within weeks he'd been put on the route that went up to and around Traflagar Square.

He understandably resigned.

Some bus drivers are absolutely excellent drivers but it is very much not a requirement.

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Pressing the accelerator instead of the brake is apparently a pretty common cause of accidents. It's almost certainly the cause of the "OAP crashes into shop" type accidents that you see reported fairly regularly.

https://www.dmv-defenders.com/traffic-collisions-caused-by-pedal-error/

As part of our mandatory 'Driver CPC' training my bus company had a 15 minute segment devoted to the problem with a leaflet and training video and everything. Several of the more spectacular accidents our buses were involved in were attributed to pedal errors. The theory is that the driver thinks they are stamping on the brake and that the vehicle has manlfunctioned; they then panic and don't lift their foot, after all why would you lift your foot off the brake when the vehicle is already running away?

I did it myself once maneuvering a bus in the yard- I seem to recall I was sat awkwardly trying to look down the front of the bus or something, and hit the accelerator rather than the brake. I realized as soon as I'd done it and stopped before I hit anything, but it woke me up!

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5 hours ago, Frank Hovis said:

Some bus drivers are absolutely excellent drivers but it is very much not a requirement.

Actually it's not particularly easy to pass a bus test in the UK, though clearly some fairly poor drivers might get lucky by fluking a good drive on their test. Bus companies are not in my experience all that cavalier about employing bad drivers either, though clearly cost pressures on wages mean that they are not as discriminating as they used to be. I like to think I became a pretty good bus driver in my 20 months on the job, but I was sacked by the first company I trained with after three weeks for not making sufficient progress towards passing my test. Bus accidents can cause a lot of damage, and so result in serious costs and loss of reputation to the company.

I quit the industry just over 18 months ago but I'm still in contact with several of my former colleagues, and I've heard that they've had no end of problems with the drivers they have recruited from the more recent EU accession countries- they come over here with an EU Category D licence and so are fully legal to start work, but are in no way up to the job of driving a bus around London when they turn up, some of them have needed as much remedial training as a new starter would to get their licence!

But sometimes, drivers with previously good records who have never given their employers any cause for concern have massive accidents. A geezer at my old garage who had something like thirty years on the job switched off one day on a route he'd been driving for years and slammed a brand new double decker into a low bridge, taking the entire roof off. You can't legislate for every eventuality.

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That whole stretch of road (from King street, if you know Reading) is very slow.  There are pedestrians wandering around, it is pedestrianised (apart from busses and taxis) and it is a 20mph zone.

The guy was speeding way in excess of the posted speed limits and (clearly) in excess of what was physically possible on that road.  This wasn't just a simple surge forwards.

It was a professional driver -- this is a serious H&S violation.  Yet what has happened is the guy has been fired -- IMO H&S violations are nearly always the fault of the management.  It is the management that should be in the dock, explaining their checks on recruitment, their training, their monitoring to ensure speeding does not occur, etc, etc.

[and you're right -- the passport part is really weird]

5 minutes ago, Rave said:

Actually it's not particularly easy to pass a bus test in the UK, though clearly some fairly poor drivers might get lucky by fluking a good drive on their test. Bus companies are not in my experience all that cavalier about employing bad drivers either, though clearly cost pressures on wages mean that they are not as discriminating as they used to be. I like to think I became a pretty good bus driver in my 20 months on the job, but I was sacked by the first company I trained with after three weeks for not making sufficient progress towards passing my test. Bus accidents can cause a lot of damage, and so result in serious costs and loss of reputation to the company.

I quit the industry just over 18 months ago but I'm still in contact with several of my former colleagues, and I've heard that they've had no end of problems with the drivers they have recruited from the more recent EU accession countries- they come over here with an EU Category D licence and so are fully legal to start work, but are in no way up to the job of driving a bus around London when they turn up, some of them have needed as much remedial training as a new starter would to get their licence!

But sometimes, drivers with previously good records who have never given their employers any cause for concern have massive accidents. A geezer at my old garage who had something like thirty years on the job switched off one day on a route he'd been driving for years and slammed a brand new double decker into a low bridge, taking the entire roof off. You can't legislate for every eventuality.

And they can't show any negatives towards the EU category D as that would be racist.

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15 minutes ago, Rave said:

Actually it's not particularly easy to pass a bus test in the UK, though clearly some fairly poor drivers might get lucky by fluking a good drive on their test. Bus companies are not in my experience all that cavalier about employing bad drivers either, though clearly cost pressures on wages mean that they are not as discriminating as they used to be. I like to think I became a pretty good bus driver in my 20 months on the job, but I was sacked by the first company I trained with after three weeks for not making sufficient progress towards passing my test. Bus accidents can cause a lot of damage, and so result in serious costs and loss of reputation to the company.

I quit the industry just over 18 months ago but I'm still in contact with several of my former colleagues, and I've heard that they've had no end of problems with the drivers they have recruited from the more recent EU accession countries- they come over here with an EU Category D licence and so are fully legal to start work, but are in no way up to the job of driving a bus around London when they turn up, some of them have needed as much remedial training as a new starter would to get their licence!

But sometimes, drivers with previously good records who have never given their employers any cause for concern have massive accidents. A geezer at my old garage who had something like thirty years on the job switched off one day on a route he'd been driving for years and slammed a brand new double decker into a low bridge, taking the entire roof off. You can't legislate for every eventuality.

Reminds me of a story that my old housemate (was a bus driver in SW London) told me about one of his colleagues. Can't remember the nickname she was given (was over 10 years ago) but, after two crashes, she was demoted to only being allowed to drive single deckers. 

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Just now, The Generation Game said:

Reminds me of a story that my old housemate (was a bus driver in SW London) told me about one of his colleagues. Can't remember the nickname she was given (was over 10 years ago) but, after two crashes, she was demoted to only being allowed to drive single deckers. 

She was lucky- at my company hitting a low bridge was an instantly sackable offence, though I gather that the union managed once or twice to wriggle the driver out of it. Even hitting an overhanging tree or other obstacle hanging over the road put you on a very sticky wicket. One of ours hit a road planer left parked for the weekend with its conveyor belt hanging out into the carriageway- I felt bad about that one as I'd driven my bus past it earlier and thought it looked unsafe, but hadn't called it in; it turned out that several other drivers had, though, and nothing had been done. There were some nasty injuries on that bus apparently; I never found out who the driver was. The bus came back months later with the whole front of the top deck replaced, you could tell where the damage had occurred by where the seats with the nice new moquette ended!

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32 minutes ago, Rave said:

She was lucky- at my company hitting a low bridge was an instantly sackable offence, though I gather that the union managed once or twice to wriggle the driver out of it. Even hitting an overhanging tree or other obstacle hanging over the road put you on a very sticky wicket. One of ours hit a road planer left parked for the weekend with its conveyor belt hanging out into the carriageway- I felt bad about that one as I'd driven my bus past it earlier and thought it looked unsafe, but hadn't called it in; it turned out that several other drivers had, though, and nothing had been done. There were some nasty injuries on that bus apparently; I never found out who the driver was. The bus came back months later with the whole front of the top deck replaced, you could tell where the damage had occurred by where the seats with the nice new moquette ended!

Not really fair for overhanging trees, it's the local authority's responsibility to ensure there's 5 metres of clearance at least. If a truck or trailer gets damaged by one you pursue them for the cost of repair. They used to have a gang of blokes with chainsaws go round in an open-top buses but haven't seen that for a long while so would guess H&S has finished it. I think they tend to neglect it until they have to fork out for a whole top deck of mangled luxury cars.

It gets messy if a following car is hit and damaged by a branch dislodged by the truck though. Personally in a lot of cases it's a bit of lesson in why not to drive too closely behind any large vehicles.

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1 hour ago, dgul said:

That whole stretch of road (from King street, if you know Reading) is very slow.  There are pedestrians wandering around, it is pedestrianised (apart from busses and taxis) and it is a 20mph zone.

The guy was speeding way in excess of the posted speed limits and (clearly) in excess of what was physically possible on that road.  This wasn't just a simple surge forwards.

It was a professional driver -- this is a serious H&S violation.  Yet what has happened is the guy has been fired -- IMO H&S violations are nearly always the fault of the management.  It is the management that should be in the dock, explaining their checks on recruitment, their training, their monitoring to ensure speeding does not occur, etc, etc.

[and you're right -- the passport part is really weird]

And they can't show any negatives towards the EU category D as that would be racist.

Some years back when truck speed limiters were a mechanical device we used to get a problem with road salt spraying up and seizing the mechanism so occasionally there were problems with the accelerator pedal getting stuck down. You could usually free it by sort of flicking the pedal with the clutch depressed until it freed.

Anyway one day this guy came back to the yard and just as he was driving in the pedal stuck down. He panicked and tried to turn the ignition off, rather than thinking to depress the clutch, but on that model of truck you couldn't turn the engine off with the key you had to close a valve in the exhaust manifold with another small pedal on the floor. He ended up stoving in the side of a building and the CCTV looked exactly like this bus. I would say he definitely lost control by accident. I'm not sure why some posters are getting hung up on his ethinicity or licence bus companies would thoroughly dot all the I's licence wise and give thorough assessment drives to ensure they're competent.

Interestingly, on the EU standards front, I can remember, in one of the newsletter bollocks things the ministry of transport send out to vehicle operators, there being a feature on how UK truck MOT testers were going out on exchange trips to EE countries to train them up on testing standards - this was years after EE trucks had already started to infest UK roads.

 

 

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Fair enough, I phrased that a bit badly, what I should have said was 'trees leaning out into the road'. There are plenty of those in London, off the top of my head Kingsway between Holborn and Aldwych is particularly notorious.

Lots of trees round here have a more or less square hole in the side where buses drive through them every few minutes, and a few little branches brushing against the bus is a fairly standard feature of a ride on the top deck of a London bus. I daresay a lot of councils just rely on this constant minor pruning action as 'maintenance', despite the fact that buses are generally only 14'6 high, while a lorry could quite legally be 2' taller...

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6 hours ago, dgul said:

That whole stretch of road (from King street, if you know Reading) is very slow.  There are pedestrians wandering around, it is pedestrianised (apart from busses and taxis) and it is a 20mph zone.

The guy was speeding way in excess of the posted speed limits and (clearly) in excess of what was physically possible on that road.  This wasn't just a simple surge forwards.

It was a professional driver -- this is a serious H&S violation.  Yet what has happened is the guy has been fired -- IMO H&S violations are nearly always the fault of the management.  It is the management that should be in the dock, explaining their checks on recruitment, their training, their monitoring to ensure speeding does not occur, etc, etc.

[and you're right -- the passport part is really weird]

And they can't show any negatives towards the EU category D as that would be racist.

My Reading street knowledge is post Oracle.

They turn of King street atthe George hotel,  down the side of the Oracle, onto Gun street.

There's a row of bus stops too, so Id guess the average speed is about 10 mph.

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On my commute I regularly come across a bus driver with extreme road rage.  He does not have the temperament.  I shall report him next time I see it.  Also the General aggression showed towards slow pedestrians is shocking.

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