DTMark 3,646 Posted April 4, 2018 I've always loved Italian music and have been learning the language. (That's just for anyone new here). Much Italian music is composed of metaphors. It is literally like poetry. Translating it is.. interesting. "I know what it says. What does it mean?" Even pop music. It's a culture thing. I have weekly lessons with a tutor in Verona and we use music to explore Italian culture and Italy - then, and now. As we work through the lyrics, I can for the most part translate to English but then there's the secondary stage where you work out the meaning and intention. An example - "Fino all'imbrunire" - literally, "end of dusk" - here, dusk is a metaphor for innocenza, or innocence. The lyrics are great. Even if you know no Italian the power of this song and imagery give it away. And I would like to be able to send back something in English which is similar. But I can't think of very much. I don't mean obvious crap (sorry, fans) like "Lucy in the Sky with Diamonds". It's not a metaphor when it's bluntly obvious what it refers to even if the meaning was missed by people at the time (how?). Really stuck here. Can you think of any English language songs which are strongly metaphor-based? 0 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Frank Hovis 16,312 Posted April 5, 2018 I don't think this is quite what you mean Mark, though it is technically "strongly metaphor-based". I will have a think. On the fourteenth of May at the dawn of the day With my gun on my shoulder to the woods I did stray In search of some game if the weather proved fair To see could I get a shot at the bonny black hare Oh, I met a young girl there with her face as a rose And her skin was as fair as the lily that grows I says "My fair maiden, why ramble you so? Can you tell me where the bonny black hare do grow? " Oh, the answer she gave me, her answer was "No But it's under me apron they say it do grow And if you'll not deceive me I vow and declare We'll both go together to hunt the bonny black hare" Well, I laid this girl down with her face to the sky And I took out my ramrod and my bullets likewise I says "Lock your legs round me and dig in with your heels For the closer we get, oh, the better it feels" The birds they were singing in the bushes and trees And the song that they sang was "Oh, she's easy to please" I felt her heart quiver and I knew what I'd done Says I "Have you had enough of my old sporting gun?" Oh, the answer she gave me, her answer was "Nay It's not often young sportsmen like you come this way And if your powder is willing and your bullets play fair Why don't you keep firing at the bonny black hare? " "Oh, my powder is wasted and my bullets all gone My ramrod is limp and I cannot fire on But I'll be back in the morning and if you are still here We'll both go together to hunt the bonny black hare" 0 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DTMark 3,646 Posted April 5, 2018 (edited) An example.. Who lives in a shack, who sweats the salary? who loves the love and the dreams of glory who steals pensions, who has poor memories who eats once, who pulls to the target who wants the pay raise, who plays in Sanremo who carries the glasses, who goes under a train who loves the aunt, who goes to Porta Pia who finds discount, like those have found na na na na na na na na na but the heavens are always bluer, uh uh, uh uh, but the heavens are always bluer, uh uh, uh uh, uh uh… Who dreams of millions, who gambles who plays with the strings, who made the Indian who makes the farmer, who sweeps the courtyards who steals, who fights, who made the spy na na na na na na na na na but the heavens are always bluer, uh uh, uh uh, but the heavens are always bluer, uh uh, uh uh, uh uh… Who is hired by the Mint, who has misfired who has an inner crisis, who digs into the hearts who reads the palm, who reigns supreme those who sweat, those who fight, those who eat once those who miss the house, those who live alone those who take very little, those who play with fire those who live in Calabria, those who live in love who made war, who take until sixty who make it to eighty, who die at work na na na na na na na na na but the heavens are always bluer, uh uh, uh uh, but the heavens are always bluer, uh uh, uh uh, uh uh… but the heavens are always bluer Who is insured, who has been fined who owns and has had, who goes to the chemist who died of envy or of jealousy who has it wrong or right, who is Napoleon who shouts, “a thief!”, who has the burglar alarm? who has made a beautiful painting, who writes on the walls who acts on instinct, who has lost, who has won who eats once, who wants a raise who changes the boat to happy and content who, as he found, who all in all who dreams of millions, who gambles who leaves for Beirut with a billion in his pocket who has been fined, who hates the Southerners who sings Prévert, who copies Baglioni who makes the farmer, who made the spy who died of envy or jealousy who reads the palm, who sells trinkets? who writes poetry, who pulls the nets who eats crisps, who drinks a glass who only occasionally, who every night.. na na na na na na na na na but the heavens are always bluer, uh uh, uh uh, but the heavens are always bluer, uh uh, uh uh, uh uh… Edited April 5, 2018 by DTMark Ah, that's what terroni means ;) 0 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Frank Hovis 16,312 Posted April 5, 2018 This one may be famnus but certainly hits the mark, um Mark. The Windmills Of Your Mind Round like a circle in a spiral, like a wheel within a wheel Never ending or beginning on an ever-spinning reel Like a snowball down a mountain, or a carnival balloon Like a carousel that's turning running rings around the moon Like a clock whose hands are sweeping past the minutes on its face And the world is like an apple whirling silently in space Like the circles that you find in the windmills of your mind Like a tunnel that you follow to a tunnel of its own Down a hollow to a cavern where the sun has never shone Like a door that keeps revolving in a half-forgotten dream Like the ripples from a pebble someone tosses in a stream Like a clock whose hands are sweeping past the minutes on its face And the world is like an apple whirling silently in space Like the circles that you find in the windmills of your mind Keys that jingle in your pocket, words that jangle in your head Why did summer go so quickly? Was it something that you said? Lovers walk along a shore and leave their footprints in the sand Was the sound of distant drumming Just the fingers of your hand? Pictures hanging in a hallway and the fragment of a song Half-remembered names and faces, but to whom do they belong? When you knew that it was over were you suddenly aware That the autumn leaves were turning to the colour of her hair! Like a circle in a spiral, like a wheel within a wheel Never ending or beginning on an ever-spinning reel As the images unwind Like the circles that you find in the windmills of your mind 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DTMark 3,646 Posted April 5, 2018 Very good - that's the sort of thing 0 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Fischer 2,059 Posted April 5, 2018 (edited) Apologies, just re-read your post and you said metaphor. PS Suppose "damaged goods, send them back" is a metaphor for how relationships have been devalued. Edited April 5, 2018 by Fischer 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DTMark 3,646 Posted April 5, 2018 No, don't apologise It's the - shall I call it - Shakespearian angle that I'm looking for. OK, the song I posted above with the lyrics isn't quite up to his standards; Shakespeare was a genius (and since it's old English, his grammar patterns are actually quite similar to modern-day Italian which is one of the reasons that it translates well) and some of it still reads a bit like gibberish but it has something of merit about it which is out of the ordinary. With a better understanding of Italian culture then and now, that song does indeed make sense for the most part (which will be why my tutor picked it out - I want more than just language skills). I never really had the patience for poetry at school (does anyone?) but as I've grown older, I've come to appreciate the multiple "levels" and the beauty of language. It does embarrass me that I can't simply flick back some English songs which are similarly lyrically merit-worthy. But then given my musical heritage that's probably not surprising, eh 0 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Duck 188 Posted April 6, 2018 How about Joni Mitchell's Both Sides Now? Bows and flows of angel hair And ice cream castles in the air And feather canyons everywhere I've looked at clouds that way But now they only block the sun They rain and snow on everyone So many things I would have done But clouds got in my way I've looked at clouds from both sides now From up and down, and still somehow It's cloud illusions I recall I really don't know clouds at all Moons and Junes and Ferris wheels The dizzy dancing way you feel As every fairy tale comes real I've looked at love that way But now it's just another show You leave 'em laughing when you go And if you care, don't let them know Don't give yourself away I've looked at love from both sides now From give and take, and still somehow It's love's illusions I recall I really don't know love at all Tears and fears and feeling proud To say "I love you" right out loud Dreams and schemes and circus crowds I've looked at life that way Oh but now old friends are acting strange They shake their heads, they say I've changed Well something's lost but something's gained In living every day I've looked at life from both sides now From WIN and LOSE and still somehow It's life's illusions I recall I really don't know life at all I've looked at life from both sides now From up and down and still somehow It's life's illusions I recall I really don't know life at all 0 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bedrag Justesen 9,587 Posted April 9, 2018 Home from work our Juliet Clears her morning meal. She dabs her skin with pretty smells Concealing to appeal. I will make my bed, She said, but turned to go. Can she be late for her cinema show? Romeo locks his basement flat, And scurries up the stair. With head held high and floral tie, A weekend millionaire. I will make my bed With her tonight, he cries. Can he fail armed with his chocolate surprise? Take a little trip back with father Tiresias, Listen to the old one speak of all he has lived through. I have crossed between the poles, for me there's no mystery. Once a man, like the sea I raged, Once a woman, like the earth I gave. But there is in fact more earth than sea. Take a little trip back with father Tiresias, Listen to the old one speak of all he has lived through. I have crossed between the poles, for me there's no mystery. Once a man, like the sea I raged, Once a woman, like the earth I gave. But there is in fact more earth than sea. 0 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bedrag Justesen 9,587 Posted April 10, 2018 There I was in uniform Looking at the art teacher I was just a girl then; Never have I loved since then He was not that much older than I was He had taken our class to the Metropolitan Museum He asked us what our favorite work of art was, But never could I tell it was him Oh, I wish I could tell him, Oh, I wish I could have told him I looked at the Rubens and Rembrandts I liked the John Singer Sargents He told me he liked Turner Never have I turned since then No, never have I turned to any other man All this having been said, I married an executive company head All this having been done, a Turner, I own one Here I am in this uniformish, pant-suit sort of thing, Thinking of the art teacher I was just a girl then; Never have I loved since then No, never have I loved any other man 0 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hail the Tripod 4,936 Posted April 10, 2018 On 4/6/2018 at 00:22, DTMark said: It's the - shall I call it - Shakespearian angle that I'm looking for. Peggy Lee's "Fever" has a compelling simplicity, powerful imagery, and even has an actual Shakespearean verse: Quote Romeo loved Juliet Juliet, she felt the same When he put his arms around her He said, "Julie, baby, you're my flame "Thou giveth fever "When we kisseth "Fever with thy flaming youth "Fever! I'm afire "Fever, yea, I burn, forsooth." Never know how much I love you Never know how much I care When you put your arms around me I get a fever that's so hard to bear You give me fever When you kiss me Fever when you hold me tight Fever! in the morning Fever all through the night Sun lights up the daytime Moon lights up the night I light up when you call my name And you know I'm gonna treat you right You give me fever When you kiss me Fever when you hold me tight Fever! in the morning Fever all through the night Everybody's got the fever That is something you all know Fever isn't such a new thing Fever started long ago Romeo loved Juliet Juliet, she felt the same When he put his arms around her He said, "Julie, baby, you're my flame "Thou giveth fever "When we kisseth "Fever with thy flaming youth "Fever! I'm afire "Fever, yea, I burn, forsooth." Cap'n Smith and Pocahontas Had a very mad affair When her daddy tried to kill him She said, "Daddy, oh, don't you dare! "He gives me fever "With his kisses "Fever when he holds me tight "Fever! I'm his missus "Daddy, won't you treat him right?" Now you've listened to my story Here's the point that I have made Chicks were born to give you fever Be it Fahrenheit or Centigrade They give you fever When you kiss them Fever if you live and learn Fever! till you sizzle What a lovely way to burn What a lovely way to burn What a lovely way to burn What a lovely way to burn 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites