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Sgt Hartman

More WTF sentencing

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Sorry, I'm sure I've made a thread on this subject before but I couldn't find it.

This just caught my eye in the news...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-coventry-warwickshire-43926623

Now surely it can't just be me who thinks that nine years for killing two little kids while off his tits, plus his long list of previous is far, far less than this waste of skin and piss deserves?

In fact I think it's absolutely disgusting. 

It's got me thinking, what with the 'Alfie's Army' morons, rampant pikeys and that untouchable swagger that seems to be pretty prevalent and on the rise amongst the cunt-class. What exactly can the average decent punter do to protect themselves these days against such scumbags? 

If nine years is what you get for killing two small children after a lifetime of being a piece of shit then what system are we supposed to rely on for our protection and justice? 

 Because this one isn't working.

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I feel your pain about life and the system.

No answers from me though.

IMO the ruling elite, mega wealthy, politicians, judiciary.....view ordinary folk as a pain in the arse. Anyone who, for whatever reason, who can’t be self supportive is a “useless eater”. That opinion is ok if we lived in a society where everyone has opportunities to be self supportive. Unfortunately we do not! Luck plays a big part in life as well as hard work. Success isn’t guaranteed!

Similarly, “pleb” offences and sentencing are subject to the same system. Winners and losers!

Totally agree that nine years for killing kids while having previous convictions is a farce.

Considering that there are more “plebs” or as I prefer to call us, ordinary people, I’m just sitting back waiting until a tipping point is reached with the vast majority of decent inhabitants of the uk stamping their feet and not accepting the political agenda.

I think we’re getting there. Social media allows people to mobilise and campaign about their grievances.

Of course life in the uk may just keep declining because the majority of us have to work to pay bills so no option to protest about many life grievances for the majority.

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3 minutes ago, Economic Exile said:

I feel your pain about life and the system.

No answers from me though.

IMO the ruling elite, mega wealthy, politicians, judiciary.....view ordinary folk as a pain in the arse. Anyone who, for whatever reason, who can’t be self supportive is a “useless eater”. That opinion is ok if we lived in a society where everyone has opportunities to be self supportive. Unfortunately we do not! Luck plays a big part in life as well as hard work. Success isn’t guaranteed!

Similarly, “pleb” offences and sentencing are subject to the same system. Winners and losers!

Totally agree that nine years for killing kids while having previous convictions is a farce.

Considering that there are more “plebs” or as I prefer to call us, ordinary people, I’m just sitting back waiting until a tipping point is reached with the vast majority of decent inhabitants of the uk stamping their feet and not accepting the political agenda.

I think we’re getting there. Social media allows people to mobilise and campaign about their grievances.

Of course life in the uk may just keep declining because the majority of us have to work to pay bills so no option to protest about many life grievances for the majority.

We could all stop paying bills.

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2 hours ago, Sgt Hartman said:

Sorry, I'm sure I've made a thread on this subject before but I couldn't find it.

This just caught my eye in the news...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-coventry-warwickshire-43926623

Now surely it can't just be me who thinks that nine years for killing two little kids while off his tits, plus his long list of previous is far, far less than this waste of skin and piss deserves?

In fact I think it's absolutely disgusting. 

It's got me thinking, what with the 'Alfie's Army' morons, rampant pikeys and that untouchable swagger that seems to be pretty prevalent and on the rise amongst the cunt-class. What exactly can the average decent punter do to protect themselves these days against such scumbags? 

If nine years is what you get for killing two small children after a lifetime of being a piece of shit then what system are we supposed to rely on for our protection and justice? 

 Because this one isn't working.

Tough one, because you could argue that the proportionate, reasonable response would be to go there, en masse, and tear them limb from limb. And the same for anybody who tries to stop you.

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13 minutes ago, Hopeful said:

We could all stop paying bills.

Unfortunately, IMO, the masses haven’t realised that they really hold the power!

Being honest though my personal view is that humanity is stuffed. 

Downhill to annihilation for many!

Live in the day and enjoy what you can is my approach to life!

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2 hours ago, Sgt Hartman said:

Sorry, I'm sure I've made a thread on this subject before but I couldn't find it.

This just caught my eye in the news...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-coventry-warwickshire-43926623

Now surely it can't just be me who thinks that nine years for killing two little kids while off his tits, plus his long list of previous is far, far less than this waste of skin and piss deserves?

In fact I think it's absolutely disgusting. 

It's got me thinking, what with the 'Alfie's Army' morons, rampant pikeys and that untouchable swagger that seems to be pretty prevalent and on the rise amongst the cunt-class. What exactly can the average decent punter do to protect themselves these days against such scumbags? 

If nine years is what you get for killing two small children after a lifetime of being a piece of shit then what system are we supposed to rely on for our protection and justice? 

 Because this one isn't working.

'9 years' means he might only serve 4-5 years.

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2 hours ago, Happy Renting said:

'9 years' means he might only serve 4-5 years.

See this is the thing.

If someone like that killed both of my children and was potentially out in five years, I would feel it to be my duty as a father who's had his life torn away from him to hunt this man down and fucking kill him.

I'd feel entirely justified too, especially when the legal system feels that four and a half years is an acceptable punishment per dead child. 

From good people having to put up with being abused and threatened as they go to work to help sick children, to people who have nearly gone under after their business has been targeted by gyppos to folk who can do nothing about the asbonauts that cause shit in their street night after night. All of this tells me that we are very very bad at dealing with our scumbags.

It's no wonder there's so fucking many of them when there is virtually no incentive to actually behave yourself.

 

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7 minutes ago, Long time lurking said:

This should go in the Sweden is fucked thread  but seems right for this one 

 

I'm convinced TPTB are looking for a "get out of jail free" card, in that these soft sentences are actually an incitement of violence from the government given to the indigenous population.

They can then hold their hands up in horror as the problem is sorted out by the citizens.

What else can it be? They fucking spit in our faces and laugh at us at every opportunity.

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2 minutes ago, Sgt Hartman said:

6 months?

What the actual fuck?

He'll be out on Tag before August 

That woman survived 88yrs on this planet, probably endured the Blitz and rationing etc 

We have been betrayed in our own country.

Edited by WorkingPoor

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11 hours ago, Economic Exile said:

Unfortunately, IMO, the masses haven’t realised that they really hold the power!

Being honest though my personal view is that humanity is stuffed. 

Downhill to annihilation for many!

Live in the day and enjoy what you can is my approach to life!

TBH I think the elite make little distinction between the self-supporters and the scum, to them it's just a vast amorphous mass of humanity.  Some are vaguely useful as they participate in the current game of funnelling resources to the top, others not. Labour is viewed as a resource pool, not as people.

When the elite have all the resources they need plus robot slaves, the terminators will be coming for us all, they won't be asking us if we've been net contributors or not.

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I think after say three serious convictions society should be locking people up for life. We've all done stupid things (and not been caught for it), however if someone is still doing stupid things after a certain age they're obviously not going to change.

I'd honestly lock up burglars etc for life after three convictions.

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11 hours ago, Sgt Hartman said:

See this is the thing.

If someone like that killed both of my children and was potentially out in five years, I would feel it to be my duty as a father who's had his life torn away from him to hunt this man down and fucking kill him.

I'd feel entirely justified too, especially when the legal system feels that four and a half years is an acceptable punishment per dead child. 

From good people having to put up with being abused and threatened as they go to work to help sick children, to people who have nearly gone under after their business has been targeted by gyppos to folk who can do nothing about the asbonauts that cause shit in their street night after night. All of this tells me that we are very very bad at dealing with our scumbags.

It's no wonder there's so fucking many of them when there is virtually no incentive to actually behave yourself.

 

Take your chances before a jury.

Make a clsim on being druven insane by grief.

I would in this sort of case though id do my best not to be caught. And id rope in brothers and close friends.

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57 minutes ago, Great Guy said:

I think after say three serious convictions society should be locking people up for life. We've all done stupid things (and not been caught for it), however if someone is still doing stupid things after a certain age they're obviously not going to change.

I'd honestly lock up burglars etc for life after three convictions.

Locking them up for life leaves a huge burden on the state to pay for their incarceration and no doubt the benefits for their family on the outside. I'd increase the minimum jail term to the maximum allowable. Currently in England and Wales when convicted of a third domestic burglary a defendant will be sentenced to a minimum of 3 years. I'd increase this to 14 years which is the maximum for the offence. As they'll be out after 1/2 their sentence they should be away for 7 years. Whilst this won't rehabilitate them it will give the community 7 years respite before they come out and do it over again.  

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1 hour ago, Great Guy said:

.... if someone is still doing stupid things after a certain age they're obviously not going to change.

I'd honestly lock up burglars etc for life after three convictions.

There's the maxim of the prison reformers, offenders get sent to prison as punishment, not for punishment. 

There could be worse punishments though, they could be sent to, hmmm, Bradford.

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6 minutes ago, assetrichcashpoor said:

Locking them up for life leaves a huge burden on the state to pay for their incarceration and no doubt the benefits for their family on the outside. I'd increase the minimum jail term to the maximum allowable. Currently in England and Wales when convicted of a third domestic burglary a defendant will be sentenced to a minimum of 3 years. I'd increase this to 14 years which is the maximum for the offence. As they'll be out after 1/2 their sentence they should be away for 7 years. Whilst this won't rehabilitate them it will give the community 7 years respite before they come out and do it over again.  

Prison is only expensive if we try and rehabilitate offenders. If you send someone to prison with the view they will be there for the rest of their life's it gets a lot cheaper.... Putting 100 prisoners in a concrete cell and not letting them out could be cheap... 

Anyway, prison costs £40k a year per prisoner. I'd argue that's cheaper than having scrotes burgling houses and stealing cars.... I'd have no problem paying more in tax to build more prisons....

 

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4 minutes ago, Great Guy said:

Prison is only expensive if we try and rehabilitate offenders. If you send someone to prison with the view they will be there for the rest of their life's it gets a lot cheaper.... Putting 100 prisoners in a concrete cell and not letting them out could be cheap... 

Anyway, prison costs £40k a year per prisoner. I'd argue that's cheaper than having scrotes burgling houses and stealing cars.... I'd have no problem paying more in tax to build more prisons....

 

What is the breakdown of the 40k and was it always thus (accounting for inflation).

Rehabilitation (staff/pension etc) being the largest part?

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30 minutes ago, Great Guy said:

 

Anyway, prison costs £40k a year per prisoner. I'd argue that's cheaper than having scrotes burgling houses and stealing cars.... I'd have no problem paying more in tax to build more prisons....

 

I'd say the low-level (but not to us) piece of shit that cased chaos next door would have cost about the same as that per annum.

If you are talking about a family of irredeemable scumbags then I think you'd be looking at serious money per year just to keep them contained within society. That's also not taking into account the money/time lost by anyone unfortunate enough to be in their vicinity.

I think we dropped the ball when we started giving people stuff like houses and money unconditionally. I'm still amazed that someone can be handed a house, paid for by the taxpayer and there is virtually no contractual or behavioural obligations required of the tenant whatsoever.

Carry this on for a few decades and it becomes a self-sustaining fuckwit production line. A scumbag Skynet .

Fuck knows how you fix that when people continue to argue that things like child benefit shouldn't be capped and people who don't work should expect the same taxpayer funded wage as someone who does.

 

Edited by Sgt Hartman

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39 minutes ago, Goat said:

It's always interesting to have a look at the sentencing guideline in a case like this (pp 11-14): https://www.sentencingcouncil.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/web_causing_death_by_driving_definitive_guideline.pdf

I'm not sure if this was a section 1 RTA 1988 offence (death by dangerous driving) or a section 3a one (death by careless driving whilst under the influence) but the sentence is the same for either so it doesn't really matter.

Clearly this falls in to the most serious category, starting point 8 years, range of 7 - 14 years, there is every aggravating factor possible so the sentence should be at the top of the range.

They pled guilty which gets them an automatic 1/3 reduction, 9 x 3/2 = 13.5 years, so in reality this was pretty much the maximum he could have got.

The question that should be asked is if this 1/3 reduction is really appropriate when the offender is bang to rights anyway.

Those guidelines need looking at as in cases such as this, the punishments available are completely inadequate.

If this bloke had ploughed into a bus of schoolkids while wasted, killed six of them and then pled guilty, theoretically he'd still get nine years? 

That makes no sense.

It should be per crime commited rather than as a whole and, as you said, if he's bang to rights then his guilty plea should be neither here nor there. He killed two kids and his 11th hour guilty plea can be dismissed as egregious, therefore his sentence should be 14 years X 2, plus additional for being wasted behind the wheel and other driving infringements.

I think then we'd be seeing a more appropriate sentence for a crime of this magnitude. 9 years is a disgrace.

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1 hour ago, Great Guy said:

Prison is only expensive if we try and rehabilitate offenders. If you send someone to prison with the view they will be there for the rest of their life's it gets a lot cheaper.... Putting 100 prisoners in a concrete cell and not letting them out could be cheap... 

Anyway, prison costs £40k a year per prisoner. I'd argue that's cheaper than having scrotes burgling houses and stealing cars.... I'd have no problem paying more in tax to build more prisons....

 

Not quite. Main cost of imprisoning people is the staff to inmate ratio. Clearly at the ratio that the U.K. currently has of 3 active Prison Officers per wing of 100 inmates, it will only work with a degree of consensus between inmates and staff over the regime that is in place.

That current regime yields an average of £30-£40K per year in the U.K. 

If you make the regime tougher, the consensus collapses and the staff:inmate ratio has to increase. That is very very costly.

Many then say, why does this matter? 100 to a cell, lock them up 24/7/365.

Again, this increases costs, as the inmates then do not undertake the work of preparing, cooking and delivering of food, cleaning the facility and the clothes of the inmates, or carrying out all of the tasks required of a prison that houses and staffs thousands of people.

Instead, if the regime collapses, actual staff have to do this work, meaning more costs.

Additional costs could be incurred by preventing, policing and dealing with the consequences of so many people locked up together. You would certainly be at a greater ratio of 100:3, as the Prison Officers would be beaten to death if it kicked off.

I guess, like everything, it is easier to preach blandishments, rather than think through and present solutions.

My solution, given that the largest costs come directly as a result of immigrant crime and their specific 'needs' is deport early and deport on suspicion.

Its what we do here!

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My view is that speeding through urban areas like that is not much different to randomly shooting a gun of the window and the sentancing should reflect this.  The individual convicted in this case is simply scum who should be burnt.

Slight suspicion of inattentive parenting as well reading one of the quotes here regarding “cars and scooters”.

http://news.sky.com/story/hit-and-run-driver-robert-brown-who-killed-young-brothers-jailed-for-nine-years-11348583

 

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Yes obvious attempt to convince public of no negligence

V

The day after the crash, Chelsea Platt-May, the boys' aunt, told Sky News: "We were all in a row doing our checks, double checks and we were all bubbly to go to the park.

"It wasn't until we were halfway that we saw there was a car right next to Corey.

"The boys all had their scooters, Casper has his toy car and was pretending to drive.

"Then there was a sound of crunching plastic and screeching tyres... we all froze."

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