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One percent

Chavs: cuddly and lovable

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https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6182395/Council-house-tenants-friends-neighbours-not-second-rate-citizens-says-Theresa-May.html

Treason May will today launch an all-out assault on the 'stigma' attached to living in a council house.

In a marked change of tone on housing policy, the Prime Minister will condemn sneering attitudes towards housing association and council house tenants, who she says have nothing to be ashamed of

Mrs May will today say council house tenants are our 'friends and neighbours' and 'not second-rate citizens', as she announces £2billion for new housing association properties.

She will say: 'For many people, a certain stigma still clings to social housing. Some residents feel marginalised and overlooked, and are ashamed to share the fact that their home belongs to a housing association or local authority.

 

she will need to bring in zero tolerance to antisocial behaviour if she seriously believes this 

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Does she have no more serious concerns to worry about?

Nobody wants to live next to or on a council estate, not because of the majority of reasonable people who live there, but because of the lesser number of scum who make life miserable for firstly the reasonable people on the estate and then the people living around it.

Exhibit A from the generally nice place that is Saltash. A family who made their neighbours' lives hell for twenty years before the council finally got around to evicting whilst proudly announcing:

 

Pete Jarman, Cornwall Housing's Director of Landlord Services said: "Repossessing a property is always the last resort and Cornwall Housing will work hard in trying to support families to try and avoid an eviction. In this case however, we were left with no other choice.

"Everyone should be able to live in their homes without being in fear of their neighbours on a daily basis. Such behaviour stops local communities thriving and it is something that Cornwall Housing will not tolerate."

 

It shouldn't be; it should be an early solution.  And what form does this "support" take? Painting their baseball bats in LGBT rainbows and unicorns possibly?

https://www.piratefm.co.uk/news/latest-news/2067674/photos-reign-of-fear-tenant-evicted/

 

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15 minutes ago, Frank Hovis said:

Does she have no more serious concerns to worry about?

Nobody wants to live next to or on a council estate, not because of the majority of reasonable people who live there, but because of the lesser number of scum who make life miserable for firstly the reasonable people on the estate and then the people living around it.

Exhibit A from the generally nice place that is Saltash. A family who made their neighbours' lives hell for twenty years before the council finally got around to evicting whilst proudly announcing:

 

Pete Jarman, Cornwall Housing's Director of Landlord Services said: "Repossessing a property is always the last resort and Cornwall Housing will work hard in trying to support families to try and avoid an eviction. In this case however, we were left with no other choice.

"Everyone should be able to live in their homes without being in fear of their neighbours on a daily basis. Such behaviour stops local communities thriving and it is something that Cornwall Housing will not tolerate."

 

It shouldn't be; it should be an early solution.  And what form does this "support" take? Painting their baseball bats in LGBT rainbows and unicorns possibly?

https://www.piratefm.co.uk/news/latest-news/2067674/photos-reign-of-fear-tenant-evicted/

 

Treason may will not ever have to live next door to people like this. 

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I was once told: not all people that live in social housing are scum, bit all scum live in social housing.

I live near a council estate. My wife has her hair done in a salon there. The hairdresser was telling here a story about a family moved in next door to the salon, who had been moved out from Portsmouth because they were trouble. After months of serious anti social behaviour, including constant threats of violence, the police became involved. The final straw was when the bloke kicked off with threats and banging on the door whilst a copper ws actually inside taking a statement. The scum are gone now and the house boarded up. Presumably moved again to be someone else's problem. 

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1 minute ago, Popuplights said:

I was once told: not all people that live in social housing are scum, bit all scum live in social housing.

I live near a council estate. My wife has her hair done in a salon there. The hairdresser was telling here a story about a family moved in next door to the salon, who had been moved out from Portsmouth because they were trouble. After months of serious anti social behaviour, including constant threats of violence, the police became involved. The final straw was when the bloke kicked off with threats and banging on the door whilst a copper ws actually inside taking a statement. The scum are gone now and the house boarded up. Presumably moved again to be someone else's problem. 

This is the problem isn’t it, they just move these people round. My mum was brought up in a council house as were most of her friends. They apparently had contracts that said that if they didn’t behave, keep the garden tidy, the house tidy and internal decs done I think every seven years, they were out on their ear. 

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It is an interesting problem.

The Tories' solution was to sell the things off.  This sort-of worked in the short term, but didn't actually address the real problem -- I'd imagine that the sort of person who (in the early days) RTB their property was the sort that would try to keep the estate under control.

The problem is (and has been for a while) unpleasant people and what to do with them.

Edited by dgul

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1 minute ago, One percent said:

With right come responsibilities. If you cannot behave, you lose you right to any help and support from the state. Out on the street with no entitlement to benefits or the NHS. 

Internment camps, aka Gulags and SJW holding centres in high rise blocks adjacent to former polytechinics and adjoining fenced off cultural enrichment zones.

That should help keep a lid on things, a bit like good old fashioned disease quarantine measures.

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7 minutes ago, One percent said:

With right come responsibilities. If you cannot behave, you lose you right to any help and support from the state. Out on the street with no entitlement to benefits or the NHS. 

A helicopter ride out over the Atlantic ocean would be my solution.

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Don't know about other places in the country but Kent has been the victim of ethnic cleansing from London Borough councils shipping out their scummiest council house dwellers (and tramps) to Kent in return for cash to the local authorities. Crime rates have rocketed. It's another scandal that you probably won't hear about on the national news.

https://www.kentonline.co.uk/kent/news/kent-should-not-be-used-to-house-londons-homeless-180158/

https://www.kentonline.co.uk/dartford/news/town-hotspot-for-exodus-of-158564/

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13 minutes ago, dgul said:

It is an interesting problem.

The Tories' solution was to sell the things off.  This sort-of worked in the short term, but didn't actually address the real problem -- I'd imagine that the sort of person who (in the early days) RTB their property was the sort that would try to keep the estate under control.

The problem is (and has been for a while) unpleasant people and what to do with them.

The start of RTB in 1981 was partly politically motivated but in a good way - homeowners in work are more likely to vote Conservative so create more Conservative voters by giving people a hand up.  It did improve people's lives and improved the estates from within.

It was also solving a problem that still continues today - councils do not look after their housing stock and it steadily decays.  The reason for this is partly the way that government regulates this but more that councils see their housing revenue accounts as a source of cross-funding for other things so they take money out rather than putting it in.  This has been solved across whole swathes of the country by stock transfers to housing associations who, because they only do housing, maintain their stock properly.  I'm not saying that they're perfect but they're far better than councils.

What makes little sense is the continuation of RTB for these housing association properties which are totally maintained and refurbished and when purchased, including by somebody on HB who clearly can't afford to do so, often end up as BTLs.

In the 1980s if you drove through a council estate you could easily pick out the RTB properties - well maintained, tidy garden, painted.

Since 2000 you can equally well identify the RTB properties on a housing association estate - scruffy, old roof, old windows, peeling paint.

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28 minutes ago, Popuplights said:

I was once told: not all people that live in social housing are scum, bit all scum live in social housing.


Not any more. There's not enough council housing to house the scum so some live in private rented too.

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24 minutes ago, One percent said:

With right come responsibilities. If you cannot behave, you lose you right to any help and support from the state. Out on the street with no entitlement to benefits or the NHS. 

 

15 minutes ago, Chewing Grass said:

Internment camps, aka Gulags and SJW holding centres in high rise blocks adjacent to former polytechinics and adjoining fenced off cultural enrichment zones.

That should help keep a lid on things, a bit like good old fashioned disease quarantine measures.

 

All that you actually need is:

  • A police force that responds to and acts upon crimes and a criminal justice system that punishes people
  • Councils / HAs instantly evicting people who are making lives a misery for their neighbours and then blakclisting them.

It astounds me that "crack houses" are monitored rather than closed down immediately and how little the police do about drug dealing.  This spot on response to the sheer uselessness of the police in making people feel safe whilst they monitor hurt feelings on Twitter came up yesterday:

_103473462_pennycreed.jpg

uk-england-london-45557730

 

Quote

 

"Drug dealers only" parking spaces and "crack pickup" points have been installed to highlight drug crime in east London.

Residents commissioned artists - using the name "Columbia Road Cartel" - to launch the campaign on Sunday.

Locals have reported "brazen drug dealing" in the area along with needles and blood left in residential buildings by users.

The signs were quickly removed by council workers.

Penny Creed, vice-chair of the Columbia Road Tenants' and Residents' Association, said the situation had deteriorated in the past two to three years.

"Eight to 10 users congregate on a street waiting for dealers to come past and buy from their car windows," she told the So-Called BBC.

"Cars and mopeds are mounting kerbs and driving very erratically.

"One local resident's stepson was knocked over by a drug dealer.

"Users are also accessing some of the residential blocks to use in stairwells, where they often leave needles or even blood."

 

 

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-45557730

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Just now, Frank Hovis said:

 

 

All that you actually need is:

  • A police force that responds to and acts upon crimes and a criminal justice system that punishes people

25 minutes in queue to report an attempted break in .. allotment not home, but damage caused by some twat. Of course if neighbour had rung police at 2.45am when he saw someone leaving we'd have a crime number by now.
 

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There nothign wrong with council housing - Model T housing.

Whats wrong is the UK benefit system. In short - the more dysfunctional you are, the more money you get. And that feeds on itself..

This started sometime in the 80s. Brown boosted it with tax credits and extra social spend.

Its why, when you g o to any estate build in the 60s, theres a housing is split to nice little old couples who's hubby retired from <low paying job> i nthe 80s. And total feral scum with kids.

The quick fix - and tax credits can be used for that - is to insist each council house is occupied by a perfon working FT.

Other fixes - make single parents funding a loan - they get 10 years to look after kids bt they have 5 years extra towork before they retire.

Only qualify for housing after 5 years working.

UK faces o fures with its current welfare - a future with NO welfare state. Or one where its drastically reformed.

 

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37 minutes ago, One percent said:

This is the problem isn’t it, they just move these people round. My mum was brought up in a council house as were most of her friends. They apparently had contracts that said that if they didn’t behave, keep the garden tidy, the house tidy and internal decs done I think every seven years, they were out on their ear. 

Ultimately people are out on their ear; but it does take ages.  Twenty years in thet Saltash case I posted.

Here is one example of a family who spent their whole lives making others' lives a misery and it did eventually catch up with them; they still get temporary housing but that's it.  No more tenancies next to decent people.  Hopefully anyway.

569e13f42c0fe_birch3.jpg

HELL: The family were made homeless after 300 anti-social incidents

The notorious Birch clan got a joint ASBO after subjecting neighbours to seven years of fighting, shouting and swearing.

They were evicted from their first home – only to be kicked out of their next less than a year later after complaints about yet more disorder.

The family – dad Michael, 69, partner Jane Beard, 52, and daughters Trudie, 28, and Ellen, 22, – are now homeless and living in an abandoned building.

But despite their appalling history the shameless family are pleading for one last chance to change – and begging for another council-funded home.

https://www.dailystar.co.uk/news/latest-news/488642/Family-from-hell-homeless-300-anti-social-incidents-demand-new-house

 

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Maybe they should build a new town a long way from anywhere to house all the troublesome cases. It'd get a fearsome reputation  in no time, but would help control the marginal cases because they'd fear being evicted and sent there. The government could buy up all the private houses in Princetown, or maybe Merthyr Tydfil, those would be ideal places.

 

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2 minutes ago, swiss_democracy_for_all said:

The government could buy up all the private houses in Princetown

 

Ah, home to the famous purple rain.

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Just now, swiss_democracy_for_all said:

Maybe they should build a new town a long way from anywhere to house all the troublesome cases. It'd get a fearsome reputation  in no time, but would help control the marginal cases because they'd fear being evicted and sent there. The government could buy up all the private houses in Princetown, or maybe Merthyr Tydfil, those would be ideal places.

 

It would be best if it was somewhere that all the liberals whose out of touch soft policies have caused this mess actually live so that they can reap the harvest of their weakness. 

Notting Hill maybe?

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26 minutes ago, Frank Hovis said:

The start of RTB in 1981 was partly politically motivated but in a good way - homeowners in work are more likely to vote Conservative so create more Conservative voters by giving people a hand up.  It did improve people's lives and improved the estates from within.

It was also solving a problem that still continues today - councils do not look after their housing stock and it steadily decays.  The reason for this is partly the way that government regulates this but more that councils see their housing revenue accounts as a source of cross-funding for other things so they take money out rather than putting it in.  This has been solved across whole swathes of the country by stock transfers to housing associations who, because they only do housing, maintain their stock properly.  I'm not saying that they're perfect but they're far better than councils.

What makes little sense is the continuation of RTB for these housing association properties which are totally maintained and refurbished and when purchased, including by somebody on HB who clearly can't afford to do so, often end up as BTLs.

In the 1980s if you drove through a council estate you could easily pick out the RTB properties - well maintained, tidy garden, painted.

Since 2000 you can equally well identify the RTB properties on a housing association estate - scruffy, old roof, old windows, peeling paint.

No.

RTB was created in the 7s under Labour.

Ive no problem with RTB but it neds to be market price - or at least replacement cost price.

 

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3 minutes ago, spygirl said:

No.

RTB was created in the 7s under Labour.

Ive no problem with RTB but it neds to be market price - or at least replacement cost price.

 

 

I would still credit its main impleentation to Mrs T:
 

Quote

 

Individual local authorities have always had the ability to sell council houses to their tenants, but until the early 1970s such sales were extremely rare.

The Labour Party initially proposed the idea of the right of tenants to own the house they live in, in their manifesto for the 1959 general election which they subsequently lost.[2] Later, the Conservative-controlled Greater London Council (GLC) of the late 1960s was persuaded by Horace Cutler, its Chairman of Housing, to create a general sales scheme. Cutler disagreed with the concept of local authorities as providers of housing, and supported a free-market approach. GLC housing sales were not allowed during the Labour administration of the mid-1970s, but picked up again once Cutler became Leader in 1977. They proved extremely popular. Cutler was close to Margaret Thatcher (MP for Finchley) who made the right to buy council housing a Conservative Party policy nationally. The policy was largely in place for the 1974 Conservative manifesto, but did not prove an asset in the two general elections that year because of high interest and mortgage repayment rates, as well as the growth of negative equity as house prices fell.[3]

In the meantime, council house sales to tenants began to increase. Some 7,000 were sold to their tenants during 1970; this soared to more than 45,000 in 1972.[4]

Thatcher policies

After Margaret Thatcher became Prime Minister in May 1979, the legislation to implement the Right to Buy was passed in the Housing Act 1980.

 

 

Replacement cost price?  I'd go along with that.  Housing Assoications build to a higher standard than private house builders so your average two bed social house will build at £160k  plus land compared to £140k for a private builder.  RTB would stop dead.

 

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43 minutes ago, swiss_democracy_for_all said:

Maybe they should build a new town a long way from anywhere to house all the troublesome cases. It'd get a fearsome reputation  in no time, but would help control the marginal cases because they'd fear being evicted and sent there. The government could buy up all the private houses in Princetown, or maybe Merthyr Tydfil, those would be ideal places.

 

We could build a Space Ark and offer free fags and sky TV, and resident tattoo artist. Would fill up in no time. 

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The great irony in Belfast is that the council houses are built to a far higher standard than the newbuild tripe, yet are about half the price.

I've been tempted in the past but the fear is always there that you'll be trapped beside some nightmare person/family.

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