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Frank Hovis

Outbreak of commonsense in the Army

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Just now, Frank Hovis said:

Well, who'd a thunk it?

SQUAD A SHOCK 

Army set to end easier fitness tests for women and older soldiers with exercises including 4km hikes with 40kg bags

Under current guidelines, women were given fewer exercises or more time on marches than men

All combat soldiers will have to meet the same physical standards.

Under current guidelines, female and older soldiers were given fewer exercises or more time on marches.

 

Field Army Sergeant Major Gavin Paton said: “I don’t care if you are a man or a woman, I don’t care what you do, and the enemy doesn’t either.”

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/7319985/army-soldiers-fitness-tests-women/

 

Refreshing.

Just a guess but I’m thinking a bigger picture. If there are concessions for one, then others might jump on the bandwagon. An example,

”oh, I cannot possibly train/fight, it’s Ramadan don’t you know”

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Surely it depends on what role you have in the army? I can't see fitness being supercritical to a mechanic or a General. I'm not saying we want fat fuckers in the army but at the same time not all roles in the army require the ability to run over a hill with 40kg on your back

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5 minutes ago, Great Guy said:

Surely it depends on what role you have in the army? I can't see fitness being supercritical to a mechanic or a General. I'm not saying we want fat fuckers in the army but at the same time not all roles in the army require the ability to run over a hill with 40kg on your back

 

3 minutes ago, Panther said:

Ultimately they do.

What Panther said.  In peacetime you may be a bandsman but in wartime you're carrying a rifle instead of a cornet.

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9 minutes ago, Great Guy said:

Surely it depends on what role you have in the army? I can't see fitness being supercritical to a mechanic or a General. I'm not saying we want fat fuckers in the army but at the same time not all roles in the army require the ability to run over a hill with 40kg on your back

All generals were once a second lieutenant -- and expected to be doing pretty much exactly the same stuff as the men under their command.

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1 minute ago, dgul said:

All generals were once a second lieutenant -- and expected to be doing pretty much exactly the same stuff as the men under their command.

Officer trainees are meant to set an example and only drop out of any training through unconsciousness.

My rowing club had a similar ethos as I dropped out of my first Sunday morning run knackered after a few miles and was roundly bollocked for it the next day.  Unless you literally collapse you keep running. 

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My dad was bit of a fatty while in the forces. Obviously not when he first joined up but they certainly didn't hold him to strict standards from as long as I can remember as a child. But like Great Guy said he wasn't infantry so perhaps had a bit of leeway. Occasionally he would take up squash or a bit of exercise every year but it wouldn't last xD

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55 minutes ago, One percent said:

Just a guess but I’m thinking a bigger picture. If there are concessions for one, then others might jump on the bandwagon. An example,

”oh, I cannot possibly train/fight, it’s Ramadan don’t you know”

They'll just lower the standards for everyone. It works in the rest of society, why not the army? 

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54 minutes ago, Great Guy said:

Surely it depends on what role you have in the army? I can't see fitness being supercritical to a mechanic or a General. I'm not saying we want fat fuckers in the army but at the same time not all roles in the army require the ability to run over a hill with 40kg on your back

Guess it depends on whether you are running towards the enemy or running away.

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8 minutes ago, whitevanman said:

They'll just lower the standards for everyone. It works in the rest of society, why not the army? 

I think for general infantry they will have to. Can't see them getting the required sign-ups who know they're very likely to go fight a pointless war in the desert. Previously there was an incentive for young men to join up for economic reasons. Less so now.

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1 hour ago, Frank Hovis said:

Well, who'd a thunk it?

SQUAD A SHOCK 

Army set to end easier fitness tests for women and older soldiers with exercises including 4km hikes with 40kg bags

Under current guidelines, women were given fewer exercises or more time on marches than men

All combat soldiers will have to meet the same physical standards.

Under current guidelines, female and older soldiers were given fewer exercises or more time on marches.

 

Field Army Sergeant Major Gavin Paton said: “I don’t care if you are a man or a woman, I don’t care what you do, and the enemy doesn’t either.”

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/7319985/army-soldiers-fitness-tests-women/

 

Refreshing.

Combat troops.

The big issue for most western countries is the large threats are just not bothering to turn up, physically, these days.

Sure youll be shooting people in the shitholes but even there theyve decuied to throw towel in a get a rubber dingy over the Med.

Uk main threat is cyber war - remote attacks on infrastructure and economic assets. Mainly Rusdian and China.

Worlds i.e merkas problem is China. Merka did not need to bribe and jnvade asia. All those gripes about yanks - see Japan protesting about military bases in the 00s, all gone. Its Us or China now. Adians are picking a rowdy base of marines over China.

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58 minutes ago, Panther said:

Ultimately they do.

tbh, I can't see any massive need for many roles in the military requiring the ability to run 5km with 40kg on your back...

when you think of the army you might think it's all running up a hill and putting bayonets into enemy soldiers. However a lot of the military is back up roles like air traffic controller/ Apache technician/ cook/ logistics etc. Like it or not, someone that refuels/ rearms an Apache helicopter doesn't need to be super fit IMHO.

Yeah, I get the argument that when the shit hits the fan every one in the military should be able to run up a hill and put a bayonet into someone. But being pragmatic about it should the military get rid of an air traffic controller, who might be brilliant at his job, because he's put on a few pounds?

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4km?

that's not a hike, that's a leisure walk, FFS I walked the dog 5km this morning before breakfast. I do have to  laugh at the idiots I see out walking in a) full lycra as if wearing it helps you get fit, or b) The full Everest survival gear, because urban country parks are an adventure.

 

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Just now, Great Guy said:

tbh, I can't see any massive need for many roles in the military requiring the ability to run 5km with 40kg on your back...

when you think of the army you might think it's all running up a hill and putting bayonets into enemy soldiers. However a lot of the military is back up roles like air traffic controller/ Apache technician/ cook/ logistics etc. Like it or not, someone that refuels/ rearms an Apache helicopter doesn't need to be super fit IMHO.

Yeah, I get the argument that when the shit hits the fan every one in the military should be able to run up a hill and put a bayonet into someone. But being pragmatic about it should the military get rid of an air traffic controller, who might be brilliant at his job, because he's put on a few pounds?

99% of the time youre ok.

Its just when things ho to shit, heli crashes, pilots leg blown off then you have to make a quick exit on foot, lugging stuff.

These days wars are 99% boredom and 1% terror.

1 minute ago, snaga said:

4km?

that's not a hike, that's a leisure walk, FFS I walked the dog 5km this morning before breakfast. I do have to  laugh at the idiots I see out walking in a) full lycra as if wearing it helps you get fit, or b) The full Everest survival gear, because urban country parks are an adventure.

 

4km, at quickish pace, lugging about 7 stone.

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54 minutes ago, Admiral Pepe said:

My dad was bit of a fatty while in the forces. Obviously not when he first joined up but they certainly didn't hold him to strict standards from as long as I can remember as a child. But like Great Guy said he wasn't infantry so perhaps had a bit of leeway. Occasionally he would take up squash or a bit of exercise every year but it wouldn't last xD

Army stuff is grunting not running sprints.

Think more Eddy Hall than Mo Farah.

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1 minute ago, spygirl said:

99% of the time youre ok.

Its just when things ho to shit, heli crashes, pilots leg blown off then you have to make a quick exit on foot, lugging stuff.

These days wars are 99% boredom and 1% terror.

4

Not many walk away from a heli crash, and if so you're only walking to safe distance to then get picked up in another heli. 

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Just now, Admiral Pepe said:

Not many walk away from a heli crash, and if so you're only walking to safe distance to then get picked up in another heli. 

Ok hard landing. Very common with helis.

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I don't know about all roles requiring this level of fitness, the article says "combat soldiers" and it's absolutely right that these standards aren't watered down. Are there standards of fitness for other roles?- I think there should be, anyone serving in the Armed forces should be pretty fit whether they are desk based or not, same goes for the Police - not that you see that many beat coppers these days but the majority of them are lardy and I can't imagine them chasing anyone other than a pensioner on foot.

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17 minutes ago, snaga said:

4km?

that's not a hike, that's a leisure walk, FFS I walked the dog 5km this morning before breakfast. I do have to  laugh at the idiots I see out walking in a) full lycra as if wearing it helps you get fit, or b) The full Everest survival gear, because urban country parks are an adventure.

 

Now, now. Enough of that. A small part of my daily happiness involves random encounters with ladies in tightly fitting lycra bottoms - especially the bottom and thighs.

You just reminded of someone I saw yesterday.

:)

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15 minutes ago, spygirl said:

Ok hard landing. Very common with helis.

Actually on the contrary. They are very rare. Are you thinking of Harriers or perhaps the US mil? The British mil doesn't have a high incident rate with helis. Certainly not in my experience.

Just to add this is talking about recent years. Not in the early years of helicopter flight eg 60,70s,80s

Edited by Admiral Pepe

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7 minutes ago, Admiral Pepe said:

Actually on the contrary. They are very rare. Are you thinking of Harriers or perhaps the US mil? The British mil doesn't have a high incident rate with helis. Certainly not in my experience.

Just to add this is talking about recent years. Not in the early years of helicopter flight eg 60,70s,80s

No, helis. Recentky, where they are going out at night, to unknown areas, where theres cross winds, not being able to pick n choose the time or weather.

Uk does not have a lot.

US does.

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Yeah, thinking about it everyone in the military should be at the peak of physical perfection. I'd make even desk jockies be able to bench press 300kg and be able to run 10km carrying a piano. Nothing less is suitable.

I'd also ensure ship cooks were ex special forces in case terrorists hijacked the ship.

 

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