• Welcome to DOSBODS

    Please consider creating a free account to be able to access all the features of the DOSBODS community. It only takes 20 seconds!

Sign in to follow this  
spygirl

Cars and air pollution

Recommended Posts

News feature on health outcomes in a few air pollution hotspots.

Ive been to a number of places, cities and large towns mainly, where the air pollution has been horrendous.

Theres only one outcome/solution - congestion charges for high polluting cars.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, spygirl said:

News feature on health outcomes in a few air pollution hotspots.

Ive been to a number of places, cities and large towns mainly, where the air pollution has been horrendous.

Theres only one outcome/solution - congestion charges for high polluting cars. Stop importing massive numbers of new people and work to get population numbers under control 

FIFY :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
49 minutes ago, spygirl said:

News feature on health outcomes in a few air pollution hotspots.

Ive been to a number of places, cities and large towns mainly, where the air pollution has been horrendous.

Theres only one outcome/solution - congestion charges for high polluting cars.

Taxation as a mechanism to drive change should always be what's chosen last, not first.

Your suggestion would 'solve' air quality problems, but wouldn't solve congestion and would result in other problems emerging.  It is like solving the problem of global warming by taxing people in to diesel cars...

My thoughts?  First understand why people are there in the first place.  Discourage people from being there that don't have a 'good' reason for being there -- economic reasons, yes, but also cultural reasons, say.  Then try to make the infrastructure around the place not contribute to air quality problems -- public transport, of course, but also delivery drivers, taxis, etc.  Then ensure that people who do have a reason for being there have got decent ways of getting to where they need to be (ie an integrated public transport system).  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Given time electric cars will solve the air pollution issue. Popped out earlier today and saw a Leaf and a Model X. Guy round the corner has a Leaf, see plenty around nowdays.

Congestion is going to be a lot harder to fix.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
34 minutes ago, dgul said:

Taxation as a mechanism to drive change should always be what's chosen last, not first.

Your suggestion would 'solve' air quality problems, but wouldn't solve congestion and would result in other problems emerging.  It is like solving the problem of global warming by taxing people in to diesel cars...

My thoughts?  First understand why people are there in the first place.  Discourage people from being there that don't have a 'good' reason for being there -- economic reasons, yes, but also cultural reasons, say.  Then try to make the infrastructure around the place not contribute to air quality problems -- public transport, of course, but also delivery drivers, taxis, etc.  Then ensure that people who do have a reason for being there have got decent ways of getting to where they need to be (ie an integrated public transport system).  

I pt does not to be a blanket ban or tax.

Id guess 70% of the cars i see are big engined 4x4, ocvupied by one person.

Just banning polluting cars from urban centres would work.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Why arent all the trucks, vans and busses running on lpg or similar?

They banned cars from the city of Oxford 30 years ago, net result its constantly clogged with stinking diesel trucks and busses

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)

They are introducing a Low Emission Zone in London in April next year (I think) so petrol cars older than Euro IV (so ~2005) and diesel cars older than Euro 6 (which is very recent) have to pay a fairly punitive charge to drive inside the North and South Circulars. All but one of my cars will be affected, fortunately I live just outside the boundary. I'm thinking it might not be a bad idea to stockpile a few cheap Euro IV petrol bangers and then flog them off to ill prepared people around the time of the deadline, for massive profitz.

I'm not against the idea particularly as the air in London is indeed pretty bad, I just don't think it'll make a lot of difference as my (admittedly anecdotal) experience is that most of the grot comes from trucks, buses and vans. I usually switch my diesel engine off when I'm waiting at the lights so I'm not pointlessly pumping out clag.

Edited by Rave

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Manchester will get it's congestion charging but it'll be called Air pollution charging. That'll be Manchester who voted against it and a mayor but have the elected GM wide mayor now.
 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
20 hours ago, Rave said:

They are introducing a Low Emission Zone in London in April next year (I think) so petrol cars older than Euro IV (so ~2005) and diesel cars older than Euro 6 (which is very recent) have to pay a fairly punitive charge to drive inside the North and South Circulars. All but one of my cars will be affected, fortunately I live just outside the boundary. I'm thinking it might not be a bad idea to stockpile a few cheap Euro IV petrol bangers and then flog them off to ill prepared people around the time of the deadline, for massive profitz.

I'm not against the idea particularly as the air in London is indeed pretty bad, I just don't think it'll make a lot of difference as my (admittedly anecdotal) experience is that most of the grot comes from trucks, buses and vans. I usually switch my diesel engine off when I'm waiting at the lights so I'm not pointlessly pumping out clag.

It comes in from Oct 2021

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have a simple answer to that as I live outside these zones and it is to stop going into them to spend money. Also means I will avoid jobs that require going into them so the skillz will inevitably migrate from Manchester leaving the place to the assorted scummers who hang around there.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, Anglepoise said:

It comes in from Oct 2021

Yeah, just googled that as I was actually warming to the idea of my arbitrage scheme. It might well still be a goer in 2021 especially if the PCP new car market goes to shit in the meantime, but I don't have anywhere to store lots of cars for 2-3 years and storing them that long would be bad for them anyway.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
20 hours ago, Rave said:

 I just don't think it'll make a lot of difference as my (admittedly anecdotal) experience is that most of the grot comes from trucks, buses and vans.

There's some truth in this - the move to electric cars will cure much of the pollution however the HGV/Bus problem will need another approach.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, InLikeFlynn said:

There's some truth in this - the move to electric cars will cure much of the pollution however the HGV/Bus problem will need another approach.

I'm not sure -- the rules for big commercial are quite strict, including emissions.

The really awful thing about all this is that a large %age of the problem is diesel cars, but they wouldn't have been there if it weren't for a terrible policy decision 15 years ago to encourage people into diesel cars.  What's more, they more-or-less reversed the previous policy to encourage people into LPG -- if they'd have got LPG uptake up a bit back then it would have had a positive impact on city pollution levels (vs Petrol, let alone diesel) and would have led us rather nicely into today, where it is possible to buy and run an electric vehicle without too much bother.  But those in power back then were morons and we're living with the consequences in so many areas.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 minutes ago, dgul said:

I'm not sure -- the rules for big commercial are quite strict, including emissions.

The really awful thing about all this is that a large %age of the problem is diesel cars, but they wouldn't have been there if it weren't for a terrible policy decision 15 years ago to encourage people into diesel cars.  What's more, they more-or-less reversed the previous policy to encourage people into LPG -- if they'd have got LPG uptake up a bit back then it would have had a positive impact on city pollution levels (vs Petrol, let alone diesel) and would have led us rather nicely into today, where it is possible to buy and run an electric vehicle without too much bother.  But those in power back then were morons and we're living with the consequences in so many areas.

And who's policty was that ......

 

https://news.motors.co.uk/news/labour-admits-mistakes-on-diesel-cars/

 

'Gordon Brown, Chancellor of the Exchequer when the new vehicle tax rates were introduced, said in 1998: “Diesel cars should attract less vehicle tax than their petrol equivalents because of their better CO2 performance”.

Though diesel engines do produce 15 per cent less CO2 than their petrol counterparts, they release four times more NO2 and 22 times more particulates, which are highly damaging to human health.'

Genius!

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
55 minutes ago, snaga said:

I blame wind farms, they steal the wind, now there is less wind available to blow the pollution over to norway.

Exactly the same here in Wales.

People were incentivised to fit solar,panels onto their roof, with grants, and the promise of lower energy bills.

The hope was that the overall demand for energy would reduce.

Instead, the overall demand requirement for electricity and gas increased substantially.

Welsh Assembly Government didn't realise despite those with solar panels using less energy, everybody else turned their heating up because their homes were colder.

Solar panels steal the Sun's heat making those without them worse off.

They scrapped the scheme now, which has severely impacted the solar panel factories encouraged to come to Wales to supply demand due to the scheme.

Welsh Assembly Government always one step ahead, they have just announced giving Aston Martin almost £100m to encourage them to build electric cars in Wales.

They may have wasted hundreds of millions encouraging a MotoGP circuit  for Wales, and millions encouraging space agencies to build their space ports here for reusable rocket flights, but they are onto something sensible with electric cars.

Everybody in Wales will soon be driving around in an electric Aston Martin !

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, Bedrag Justesen said:

Exactly the same here in Wales.

People were incentivised to fit solar,panels onto their roof, with grants, and the promise of lower energy bills.

The hope was that the overall demand for energy would reduce.

Instead, the overall demand requirement for electricity and gas increased substantially.

Welsh Assembly Government didn't realise despite those with solar panels using less energy, everybody else turned their heating up because their homes were colder.

Solar panels steal the Sun's heat making those without them worse off.

They scrapped the scheme now, which has severely impacted the solar panel factories encouraged to come to Wales to supply demand due to the scheme.

Welsh Assembly Government always one step ahead, they have just announced giving Aston Martin almost £100m to encourage them to build electric cars in Wales.

They may have wasted hundreds of millions encouraging a MotoGP circuit  for Wales, and millions encouraging space agencies to build their space ports here for reusable rocket flights, but they are onto something sensible with electric cars.

Everybody in Wales will soon be driving around in an electric Aston Martin !

It's worrying that I can't tell what % of that post is truth and how much is you just being your usual self.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, Bedrag Justesen said:

Exactly the same here in Wales.

People were incentivised to fit solar,panels onto their roof, with grants, and the promise of lower energy bills.

The hope was that the overall demand for energy would reduce.

Instead, the overall demand requirement for electricity and gas increased substantially.

Welsh Assembly Government didn't realise despite those with solar panels using less energy, everybody else turned their heating up because their homes were colder.

Solar panels steal the Sun's heat making those without them worse off.

What? A few sq meters of solar panels 'stole' enough energy to make the whole of Wales cooler? Well we've just 'fixed' global warming right there!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
13 minutes ago, Bedrag Justesen said:

Exactly the same here in Wales.

People were incentivised to fit solar,panels onto their roof, with grants, and the promise of lower energy bills.

The hope was that the overall demand for energy would reduce.

Instead, the overall demand requirement for electricity and gas increased substantially.

Welsh Assembly Government didn't realise despite those with solar panels using less energy, everybody else turned their heating up because their homes were colder.

Solar panels steal the Sun's heat making those without them worse off.

They scrapped the scheme now, which has severely impacted the solar panel factories encouraged to come to Wales to supply demand due to the scheme.

Welsh Assembly Government always one step ahead, they have just announced giving Aston Martin almost £100m to encourage them to build electric cars in Wales.

They may have wasted hundreds of millions encouraging a MotoGP circuit  for Wales, and millions encouraging space agencies to build their space ports here for reusable rocket flights, but they are onto something sensible with electric cars.

Everybody in Wales will soon be driving around in an electric Aston Martin !

I just checked that.

Wow.

Did the PE people who have hte soon-to-be-bust Aston Martin see the Welsh government coming.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I would argue that air pollution is no greater or even less in most of the UK now than it was in the 1960`s -90`s engine tech has improved beyond comparison since those days even if cars on the road have risen dramatically..emission checks were only implemented in 1994`ish  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 minutes ago, spygirl said:

I just checked that.

Wow.

Did the PE people who have hte soon-to-be-bust Aston Martin see the Welsh government coming.

 

How fecking dare you 

They met them halfway ,after all it`s not their money they are giving away ,just think of the £350 million they gave to LG in the early 2000`s for their shiny new semiconductor plant ,that`s only just been put to work as a film studio after spending the same sort of money on a film studio 25 miles down the road ( thanks Sir Richard Attenborugh)  that have had at least two films made there since it was built over a decade ago 

Then you could look at the ford engine plant in Bridgend ....and the list goes on and on 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
21 minutes ago, eight said:

It's worrying that I can't tell what % of that post is truth and how much is you just being your usual self.

When it's about Welsh politicians, it's 100% true.

If we could only hook them up to the wind turbines we'd be supplying the whole of Europe with free electricity :PissedOff:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this  

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.