Investing for the next cycle - for beginners!

[MvR]

9 hours ago, Abu Hashim said:

@DurhamBorn I have followed you here from "the other forum" after I noticed you disappeared.  Many thanks for your insight and analysis on possible economic events.

I wanted to ask for some advice (with the caveat that nothing is certain), namely:  I know someone who has circa 20k cash to invest and grow in the hope of buying a property.  I have seen you mention silver etc, what would your feedback be to someone thinking of purchasing gold bars and keeping them in a safe place.  Alternatively purchasing silver bars and keeping them somewhere where it won't be taxed.  The concern is inflation is eating away at this money.

Any advice on the above would be appreciated, apologies in advance for the simplistic style of questioning.

 

Gold or silver Britannias or gold Sovereigns are legal tender so not liable for CGT, which is a big advantage over bars or foreign gold coins. Bullionbypost is a decent UK supplier. You normally have to pay VAT on Silver, but you can buy it VAT free from a dealer in Europe. Coininvest is a popular German supplier on these boards but there are others. So tax isn't really a problem. it's more about safe storage and being able to access them, and sell them, in an emergency. Physical metals are really about having something in case of a SHTF scenario. Since they're universally recognised, could also act as barter goods in a real crisis. 

They're not necessarily an inflation hedge.. they can go down too, but that's part of the risk of investing. To hedge against inflation, there are plenty of stock ideas on the main thread Durhamborn started.  The ISA allowance is £20k per year, so buying shares in a self select ISA will avoid any tax lability.  I use IG.com as my ISA provider, but if you prefer funds, Hargreaves Lansdown seems to be the one people go for.

[Harley]

12 hours ago, Inoperational Bumblebee said:

Totally agree. You can potentially lose loads if you don't know what you're doing. 

Just been on the IG website where they say right up front 79% of their retail clients lose money.

[Harley]

On 10/10/2018 at 13:37, sancho panza said:

Spread betting is tax free.

This particular aspect maybe sometimes over emphasised as you and your partner each get a large cgt allowance each year.  Not good if you have other big enough gains though (from I believe whatever source).  Maybe if I try harder, this could all be a nice issue for me!  Plus I believe you can net off or carry forward lossess a few years to offset future gains.  Need to check.  For me, it's more about the platform, info, stops, being able to short, etc  Again, depends on your own circumstances.

[Harley]

I need to ramp up my investment trust holdings.  Nothing taken as advice (hence not mentioning my objectives) but anyone have any thoughts from don't do it through to that one trust that'll be my ticket for life!

[Bricks & Mortar]

1 hour ago, Harley said:

you and your partner each get a large cgt allowance each year.

Thankyou, SO MUCH!

I'm at the very start of investing.  First time in my life I've had more money at the end of my month, than the opposite.  So, I'd seen the CGT allowance of £11,700 - and assumed, that it was the same as the basic rate tax allowance - i.e. part of it, and so i thought I didn't have any as I was using it all for my wages. 

Your comment suggested otherwise, and a quick google search found a government page stating in black & white that it's in addition to basic rate allowance.

This changes my plans completely!  I'd been assuming any investments would have to be in an ISA, or physical coins.  But now I'll be stacking signature gold and silver at Royal Mint until I'm worried about the threshold.  I like it because it's simple, I've few worries about the institution, and I can sell at the click of a mouse.


 

[Harley]

20 minutes ago, Bricks & Mortar said:

Thankyou, SO MUCH!

I'm at the very start of investing.  First time in my life I've had more money at the end of my month, than the opposite.  So, I'd seen the CGT allowance of £11,700 - and assumed, that it was the same as the basic rate tax allowance - i.e. part of it, and so i thought I didn't have any as I was using it all for my wages. 

Your comment suggested otherwise, and a quick google search found a government page stating in black & white that it's in addition to basic rate allowance.

This changes my plans completely!  I'd been assuming any investments would have to be in an ISA, or physical coins.  But now I'll be stacking signature gold and silver at Royal Mint until I'm worried about the threshold.  I like it because it's simple, I've few worries about the institution, and I can sell at the click of a mouse.


 

You're welcome. 

Cgt is one way rich people stay rich, especially if you include business roll over relief. It's per person so I use a joint stock trading account. 

Deffo worth reading that HRMC stuff.  I should too as my knowledge maybe out of date. 

Gets a bit complicated when working out the tax due on multiple transactions though so you need to keep good stock trading records.  But then a nice problem to have!

Of course they could change the rules on pms!  For example, did they not increase the tax rate on them in the US not too long ago?

Also note (may have changed) you need to report on your tax return disposals above a certain amount even if no tax is due.

Again, deffo worth a read.

PS: I'm rated a "low information voter".  Not sure exactly what that means but grates as I want to be useful so any upvotes appreciated!

[Lavalas]

It doesn’t seem like a set portfolio will get put on a plate (not that that is what was expected really). I reckon just keeping asking questions on this board if you’re starting out. Keep reading the Deflation thread, keep absorbing everything. If some of it is too complicated then just trust that it will make sense when you’ve made the other bits fall into place. I knew next to nothing when I started reading this thread on ToS. Now I still know fuck all in the scheme of things... but actually quite a lot compared to most ordinary people. This is a great site with some really helpful knowledgable people.

Maybe some sector specific threads would help. Don’t want to distract from the ‘main thread’ too much though. Maybe a thread where people add useful resources and links would help. Maybe a thread where we just look at balance sheets or technical analysis to teach/learn those skills. 

I don’t bloody know

[Harley]

On 16/10/2018 at 07:19, Harley said:

I need to ramp up my investment trust holdings.  Nothing taken as advice (hence not mentioning my objectives) but anyone have any thoughts from don't do it through to that one trust that'll be my ticket for life!

Just come to get away from all this - investment trusts.  Been screening all 514ish listed on the LSE.  What a bunch!  Seen a lot of villans and a few possibly good ones but boy it's a minefield.  Bottom line, ETFS, Funds, trusts, they all have their concerns.  Maybe I should just buy shares!  More to follow.....

[goldbug9999]

On 09/10/2018 at 20:22, sleepwello'nights said:

The message is you can't beat the markets. Reinforces what I've found through experience; there are two types of stock picker. Those who know they cant beat the market and those who haven't found out yet.

Third type: those who make money by convincing other that they can.

[goldbug9999]

On 16/10/2018 at 08:42, Bricks & Mortar said:

Thankyou, SO MUCH!

I'm at the very start of investing.  First time in my life I've had more money at the end of my month, than the opposite.  So, I'd seen the CGT allowance of £11,700 - and assumed, that it was the same as the basic rate tax allowance - i.e. part of it, and so i thought I didn't have any as I was using it all for my wages. 

Bear in mind the allowance is only on realised gains i.e. if you keep some investment for 5 years and it make 10k appreciation every year then when you come to cash it in you only get the allowance in that year so youd still pay tax on 38k or so of those gains.

[Bricks & Mortar]

1 hour ago, goldbug9999 said:

Bear in mind the allowance is only on realised gains i.e. if you keep some investment for 5 years and it make 10k appreciation every year then when you come to cash it in you only get the allowance in that year so youd still pay tax on 38k or so of those gains. 

A.  I should be so lucky.
B.  But, if, by some chance, it did make 10K a year, you'd want to pull that 10K in every year to use up your allowance?

[azzuri82]

On 16/10/2018 at 07:01, Harley said:

Just been on the IG website where they say right up front 79% of their retail clients lose money.

No doubt this is true - but isn't this more to do with the psychology of rookie traders than their actual stock picks? Even if you're only right re: the general direction of travel for a stock 50% of the time you'll still make big profits, if you trade that 50% correctly.

[Calcutta]

Looked into shares, ran a simulation of 30+ from the start of this year just to see how I did with the picking. Not taking into account fees or anything like that....got my arse handed to me.

Luckily any real money goes into premium bonds and now I'm winning well above interest rates I'm thinking of downloading a betting app and throwing the extra onto 10,000/1 accumulators for a little excitement.

[Democorruptcy]

On 16/10/2018 at 07:19, Harley said:

I need to ramp up my investment trust holdings.  Nothing taken as advice (hence not mentioning my objectives) but anyone have any thoughts from don't do it through to that one trust that'll be my ticket for life!

Defensive suggestions https://masterinvestor.co.uk/funds-and-investment-trusts/three-different-strategies-protect-capital/

Interview from 2015 about Troy https://moneyweek.com/390525/sebastian-lyon-interview/

Disclosure, I don't hold any at the moment so DYOR etc.

[A_P]

Can anyone clarify what actually happens from a broker/end user perspective at the redeamable period for convertible redeemable preference shares? It's very unlikely I would want to convert these pref shares but interested in how the process works for both converting and not converting. I can't seem to find any clear information online

[A_P]

On 08/11/2018 at 13:46, Admiral Pepe said:

Can anyone clarify what actually happens from a broker/end user perspective at the redeamable period for convertible redeemable preference shares? It's very unlikely I would want to convert these pref shares but interested in how the process works for both converting and not converting. I can't seem to find any clear information online

Well I guess they only way to find out is to get my toes wet!