• Welcome to DOSBODS

     

    DOSBODS is free of any advertising.

    Ads are annoying, and - increasingly - advertising companies limit free speech online. DOSBODS Forums are completely free to use. Please create a free account to be able to access all the features of the DOSBODS community. It only takes 20 seconds!

     

Sign in to follow this  
Frank Hovis

Boeing 737 MAX second crash

Recommended Posts

Ethiopian airliner crashed with big loss of life this morning. I was assuming it would be propellers and held together with string but no: four month old Boeing 737 MAX.

One also crashed in Indonesia recently.

Is there a rule about when planes are grounded for safety checks as I can't remember a previous example of two brand new planes crashing in a matter of months?

https://www.rt.com/news/453451-ethiopian-airlines-flight-crashes-on/

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The crashes from wiki; "erroneous cockpit readings".

 

On October 29, 2018, Lion Air Flight 610, a Boeing 737 MAX 8, crashed into the Java Sea 13 minutes after take off from Soekarno–Hatta International Airport, Jakarta, Indonesia. The flight was a scheduled domestic flight to Depati Amir Airport, Pangkal Pinang, Indonesia. All 189 onboard died. This is both the first fatal aviation accident and first hull loss of a 737 MAX. The aircraft was delivered to Lion Air in August 2018.[117][118] Following the Lion Air accident, Boeing issued an operational manual guidance, advising airlines how to address erroneous cockpit readings. The crash is currently under investigation.[119]

On March 10, 2019, Ethiopian Airlines Flight 302, a Boeing 737 MAX 8, registration ET-AVJ, crashed shortly after takeoff at 0530 UTC from Addis Ababa. The flight was a scheduled flight from Addis Ababa, Ethiopia to Nairobi, Kenya. [120]

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, Stuey said:

Remote controlled crash like the one into the Alps? 

Was it ever actually determined what happened to the Alps plane?  I often wonder about that. Flew straight into a mountain iirc.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, One percent said:

Was it ever actually determined what happened to the Alps plane?  I often wonder about that. Flew straight into a mountain iirc.  

It got blamed on pilot's mental health, but friends and family all said he was fine. It was at a similar time to the one in Asia which was hacked as well. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, Stuey said:

It got blamed on pilot's mental health, but friends and family all said he was fine. It was at a similar time to the one in Asia which was hacked as well. 

That’s right, it was blamed on the pilot. 

So, who is meant to have hacked it?  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

That is a brand new aircraft. Very sad. Perhaps it was terrorism of some kind?

I got woken in the middle of the night by the sound of jet engines sounding seemingly quite low. Did a quick look on flightradar - it was a Turkish Airlines 747 flying from NY to Istanbul at 35,000 feet. Amazing how the sound had come down to the ground.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
58 minutes ago, One percent said:

Was it ever actually determined what happened to the Alps plane?  I often wonder about that. Flew straight into a mountain iirc.  

The co pilot locked the captain out of the cockpit when the latter went to the loo or similar. He then carried out a descent into the mountains. Flight recorder data showed that he had experimented with the autopliot on the previous flight to the crash flight to see if he could set a sea level altitude to descend to, and data from the crash flight showed that he had done this and programmed the autopilot to descend to this height while over the Alps.

Medical records showed that he had a long history of depression and treatment for depression.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It crashed 6 hours go and the Authorities have still not published a full explanation for the crash. Obviously a cover up.

Cockpit fight, dwarves or squirrels? We demand to be told.

In the meantime, to avoid any display of civilian aircraft, people on the ground are ordered to avert their eyes near airports. You can't be too careful.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, The Masked Tulip said:

That is a brand new aircraft. Very sad. Perhaps it was terrorism of some kind?

I got woken in the middle of the night by the sound of jet engines sounding seemingly quite low. Did a quick look on flightradar - it was a Turkish Airlines 747 flying from NY to Istanbul at 35,000 feet. Amazing how the sound had come down to the ground.

I used to live on the Heathrow flight path. Maybe it's because the original design is from half a century ago, but it was always audibly noticeable when a jumbo was coming in. 

You could argue it's the 4-engines but the A380s were much quieter. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
30 minutes ago, Happy Renting said:

It crashed 6 hours go and the Authorities have still not published a full explanation for the crash. Obviously a cover up.

Cockpit fight, dwarves or squirrels? We demand to be told.

In the meantime, to avoid any display of civilian aircraft, people on the ground are ordered to avert their eyes near airports. You can't be too careful.

Over on PPRUNE they point out that the initial climb and failure is similar to the first crash of this type.

They also have a post pointing out a US embassy warning of a protest in the city today, to avoid the central square and to refrain from flying out of / into the airport.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

BOEING shares were flat for 15 years until back end of 2017 then virtually quadrupled in value.

Some serious profit has been had for shareholders if they cashed in last week.

1244632460_Screenshot-2019-3-10BAHistoricalPricesBoeingCompany(The)Stock-YahooFinance.thumb.png.fbcd2b804bd70796c8d0079c7b6be760.png

The graph below explains the one above.

76053802_Screenshot-2019-3-10Boeing737MAX-Wikipedia.png.e067586ef41627cb69aa0b8fe2f482fc.png

I imagine construction/build quality may be an issue especially as they are only managing to build around 20 per month and have nearly 5000 on the order books.

Any more crashes and the share price will follow suit as orders evaporate.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
32 minutes ago, The Generation Game said:

I used to live on the Heathrow flight path. Maybe it's because the original design is from half a century ago, but it was always audibly noticeable when a jumbo was coming in. 

You could argue it's the 4-engines but the A380s were much quieter. 

Some of them make so much noise going over. There used to be one go over around midnight on a Sunday for months. Noisy twats.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

From the updated RT article:

Quote

 

Bloomberg reported in November that the plane is prone to making “abrupt dives” due to a faulty flight-monitoring system.

Two pilots unions have accused Boeing of failing to properly explain a safety feature on the 737 MAX 8 aircraft in their manuals, claiming that the oversight may be responsible for the Lion Air crash.

The company issued a safety update in November to pilots flying the 737 MAX 8, warning of a possible fault in a sensor that could send the aircraft into a violent nosedive.

 

I find when selecting which aircraft on which to fly that I always express a preference for one that is prone to violent nosedives.  It certainly keeps me alert.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
18 minutes ago, Frank Hovis said:

From the updated RT article:

 

What variables are being sensed that makes the plane think that the best response is to dive vertically?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
17 minutes ago, eight said:

What variables are being sensed that makes the plane think that the best response is to dive vertically?

Faulty Angle Of Attack sensors that gives wrong information to the aircraft master computer. The computer then corrects flight parameters to what it thinks is best even if it is wrong. 

https://www.aviationtoday.com/2018/11/07/faa-issues-boeing-737-aoa-directive-amid-lion-air-crash/

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

the So-Called BBC page (I know....) says it's an anti-stalling device.  Anti-stalling but pro-crashing.


 

Quote

 

Investigators say the pilots of the aircraft had appeared to struggle with an automated system designed to keep the plane from stalling - a new feature of the Boeing 737 Max.

The anti-stalling system repeatedly forced the plane's nose down, despite efforts by pilots to correct this, findings suggest.

There is no suggestion that the Ethiopian Airlines jet suffered similar issues on Sunday.


 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-47513508

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Sign in to follow this  

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.