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More Tory tax breaks for landlords

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Hammond the property bubble blowing cunt of a landlord is clearly out to protect his bubble and his fellow parasitic kind.

instead of lowering taxes for workers the Tory party want to end the for certain leveraged landlords, they really are fucken clueless and deserve to lose the next election if this is the best they can do.

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/cc3e2e4e-c9ab-11e8-87c7-eeebbaac8ad7

Under existing rules, those who sell a rental property are liable to pay capital gains tax at 28% on any profits they make, which is a big disincentive to selling up.

The plan comes as ministers are due to respond to a public consultation, which closed last month, on increasing tenancies to three years in order to provide renters with more security.

The prime minister used her party conference speech last week to scrap the cap on councils borrowing to build social housing. Hammond has previously extended the Help to Buy scheme for first-time buyers. But aides believe the Tories will struggle to win the next general election without winning over Generation Rent.

Onward has calculated that the shift from homeownership to private renting is greater in marginal seats that the Tories need to win to secure a parliamentary majority than in seats they already hold.

In 2001, there were just 18 seats where private renters made up more than 20% of households. By 2022, there will be an estimated 253 such seats.

The number of seats where owner- occupiers represent 70% of households is due to fall from 330 to just 88. Analysis by Shelter found that 50% of private renters voted Labour in the 2017 election while just 28% voted Conservative.

A senior Tory said: “This is getting a warm welcome in Downing Street.”

A Treasury source said no decisions had yet been taken on the budget but confirmed such a plan would be “relevant to our housing agenda”.

The proposals come amid bitter divisions between Downing Street and the Treasury over the budget. Hammond was “furious” that he was kept in the dark about May’s plan to scrap the council borrowing cap, “stole” his plan to freeze fuel duty and announced the end of austerity in her conference speech without telling him, piling pressure on the chancellor to loosen spending restraints.

The chancellor has told colleagues he is prepared to hold a post-Brexit emergency budget to kick-start growth if there is a risk of a downturn next spring.

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Right, so saying that landlords won't pay CGT if they sell to renters is meant to benefit renters. Landlords need to get financially burned in order to decentivise people buying up flats. Whilst some will find selling easier, others will buy up because they've been told you can't go wrong with property. I am sick that this country has no grasp of economics. 

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5 minutes ago, UnconventionalWisdom said:

Right, so saying that landlords won't pay CGT if they sell to renters is meant to benefit renters. Landlords need to get financially burned in order to decentivise people buying up flats. Whilst some will find selling easier, others will buy up because they've been told you can't go wrong with property. I am sick that this country has no grasp of economics. 

Theyll have to raise taxes elsewhere to fund this... It is just the most idiotic idea imagineable and show s that May Hammond and the rest of the Blairite cunts are clueless.

They are petrified hence this pathetic attempt to keep both tenants and landlords onside. They must be aware lanlords are one of the few groups thatll vote for them.

The docile idiots need a HPC asap.

Can only see this making BTL more attractive knowing CGT doesnt apply.

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Posted (edited)
36 minutes ago, Banned said:

Theyll have to raise taxes elsewhere to fund this... It is just the most idiotic idea imagineable and show s that May Hammond and the rest of the Blairite cunts are clueless.

They are petrified hence this pathetic attempt to keep both tenants and landlords onside. They must be aware lanlords are one of the few groups thatll vote for them.

The docile idiots need a HPC asap.

Can only see this making BTL more attractive knowing CGT doesnt apply.

Tenants currently cant afford (or dont want) to buy so i dont see it making a massive difference at the moment.

Look at it another way:

1. HPC happens

2. BTL need to exit fast and as cheaply as possible.

3.  They sell to current tenants at the much lower market price with no liability preventing loads of people out on the streets.

Its a pretty good policy for encouraging the transfer of housing stock as fast as possible from landlords to renters IMO.  I think HMRC might also be aware that the majority of landlords have already spent the CGT liability anyway and there is not much chance of extracting enough cash from the rest of their estate to cover it.

Edited by Majorpain

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Its picking winners again. If youve been forced to move then you dont get this free handout.

Its anothet bail out for btl parasites after theyve been bailed out for the last decade.

If this is the best they can come up with they are fucked as theyre out of ideas.

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12 minutes ago, Majorpain said:

Tenants currently cant afford (or dont want) to buy so i dont see it making a massive difference at the moment.

Look at it another way:

1. HPC happens

2. BTL need to exit fast and as cheaply as possible.

3.  They sell to current tenants at the much lower market price with no liability preventing loads of people out on the streets.

Its a pretty good policy for encouraging the transfer of housing stock as fast as possible from landlords to renters IMO.  I think HMRC might also be aware that the majority of landlords have already spent the CGT liability anyway and there is not much chance of extracting enough cash from the rest of their estate to cover it.

And the other way to look at it is itll make btl more attractive which is what the tory party want to keep house prices inflated for their Surrey voters and their banker and builder sponsors.

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How about having everyone pay capital gains tax when they sell?

Give a 1% discount for every full year that they have owned the house.

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2 hours ago, Majorpain said:

Look at it another way:

1. HPC happens

2. BTL need to exit fast and as cheaply as possible.

3.  They sell to current tenants at the much lower market price with no liability preventing loads of people out on the streets.

4.  The lower price is recorded, and reported, and taken into account by sellers and surveyors.  HPC deepens.

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2 hours ago, Banned said:

And the other way to look at it is itll make btl more attractive which is what the tory party want to keep house prices inflated for their Surrey voters and their banker and builder sponsors.

But no-one can buy at current prices or they would be much less likely to be renting.  I take your point about it being potentially gamed but you would need to keep a tenant for 3 years and there is no guarentee at the end they would be able or want to buy your house.  It works far better as a mechanism to turn renters in OO imo, with landlords very desperate to sell to someone who will keep HMRC out of their affairs!

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1 hour ago, Bricks & Mortar said:

4.  The lower price is recorded, and reported, and taken into account by sellers and surveyors.  HPC deepens.

You seriously think this Tory party are looking in any way shape or form to crash the housing market. Even if they did sell for a lower price which is unlikely it'd only be for the select winners.

I remember when MMR came in all the genius on HPC were 100% sure it'd crash the market, and after it came in prices went up massively.

Basel 3 that was going to fix things, but the day it was wholly agreed bank share prices were up 3%.

But this tax break makes gambling on the housing market a far more prosperous bet as now CGT doesnt have to be paid.

What do you think would happen if next month Hammond the landlord cunt stated that on Telecom shares there will be no capital gains tax? 

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BBC news reported that they had to sell it to tenants who had been in the property for 3 years... surely the market for people who've a) been in a place 3 years b) can afford to buy the place c) want to buy the place is so small as to be meaningless?

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12 minutes ago, Cosmic Apple said:

BBC news reported that they had to sell it to tenants who had been in the property for 3 years... surely the market for people who've a) been in a place 3 years b) can afford to buy the place c) want to buy the place is so small as to be meaningless?

It would enable  scum  scum like the Wilsons to extract themselves from their BTL/capital gains predicament.

Another bail out to the landlords passed of as some kind of a benefit to tenants.

HOW MUCH MORE MONEY ARE WE GOING TO THROW AT THESE CUNTS!

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They probably wouldn't get away with this.

With HTB etc the money is given to the buyer (sort of), and you've got to have a bit of thought to get to the point where 'but if you give buyers more cash the prices will just go up -- so it actually helps the seller'.

But saying 'we'll take less from the sellers' doesn't take any thought at all to appear geared to the seller not the buyer -- it actually takes a bit of thought to get to 'so they could sell for less and still be quids in' which is immediately followed by 'but why would they?'

If they wanted to do this they'd have to make it a bit less clear -- perhaps do a deal where the seller gets tax relief to get CGT to 18% but has to offer half the gains (5%) as a cash gift to the purchaser.  That's the sort of thing that people would love ('free cash!') but would end up actually being the same as any other purchaser incentive (prices are buoyed).

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12 minutes ago, XswampyX said:

It would enable  scum  scum like the Wilsons to extract themselves from their BTL/capital gains predicament.

Another bail out to the landlords passed of as some kind of a benefit to tenants.

HOW MUCH MORE MONEY ARE WE GOING TO THROW AT THESE CUNTS!

+ LOTS

Just now, dgul said:

They probably wouldn't get away with this.

Agreed, itd be too easy for Labour and the Libs to show it as the Tory party giving tax breaks to landlords.

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I've said before that the next owner perk will be base rate miras*.  I'm of the opinion that that's why they left base rate tax relief for btl (ie, they could normalise matters by giving tax relief to OOs, rather than take more off BTL).

[* I'd suggest that this'll be for any debt, not just mortgages, but there's lots of details to sort out between here and there]

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41 minutes ago, dgul said:

I've said before that the next owner perk will be base rate miras*.  I'm of the opinion that that's why they left base rate tax relief for btl (ie, they could normalise matters by giving tax relief to OOs, rather than take more off BTL).

 [* I'd suggest that this'll be for any debt, not just mortgages, but there's lots of details to sort out between here and there]

It cost billions it is never going to happen.

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1 minute ago, Banned said:

It cost billions it is never going to happen.

it's the only way they'll be able to increase interest rates and not completely destroy the economy.

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Just now, dgul said:

it's the only way they'll be able to increase interest rates and not completely destroy the economy.

Economy is currently destroyed. Raising rates and having  property crash will fix the economy.

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30 minutes ago, Banned said:

Economy is currently destroyed. Raising rates and having  property crash will fix the economy.

No.  People having revulsion to debt will fix the economy.  This might come with a property crash, but that's merely a symptom of the greater cause.

Anyway, perhaps I should have said 'it's the only way they think they'll be able to increase interest rates and not completely destroy the economy.'  Crashing the economy quickly might get it into a position to have a stronger recovery, but it won't work out that way.  We're due years and years of slow grind down, each point resisted by TPTB (at that time) with ineffectual policies.

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2 minutes ago, dgul said:

No.  People having revulsion to debt will fix the economy.  This might come with a property crash, but that's merely a symptom of the greater cause.

Anyway, perhaps I should have said 'it's the only way they think they'll be able to increase interest rates and not completely destroy the economy.'  Crashing the economy quickly might get it into a position to have a stronger recovery, but it won't work out that way.  We're due years and years of slow grind down, each point resisted by TPTB (at that time) with ineffectual policies.

We've had years and years of HPI, theyve fucked up at letting things deflate slowly.

Crash is the only way out now, maybe they can kick it down the road for a short while longer but its 100% built in now, 8 years of economic mis management has seen to that.

Govt hasnt got a spare few billion to bring back MIRAS, theyre skint so long as they want to keep giving money to the EU and Foreign Aid and the endless other pet projects ... they need to raise 20bln for the NHS.

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It`s another back door bailout of the banks ,there are many IO portfolio LL that got there by extracting equity as prices rose they can no longer  sell up to exit the game as they have not got enough equity to pay the mortgage off and CGT some one is going to get knocked either way

It`s hard to swallow( the feckers should be bankrupted) but on the whole IMO i think the proposed policy seems to indicate which way team blue sees the housing market going and that`s down,the trouble i see if you don`t give the stupid feckers a signed exit they will bury their heads in the sand until the inevitable which could take another half a decade or more ...which is to late for team blue 

I said it eight years ago on TOS,nothing will change until the have not`s demographic become a significant part of the electorate,if we get to 2022 without a GE before it this is what the 2022 GE will be fought on    

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1 hour ago, Banned said:

Economy is currently destroyed. Raising rates and having  property crash will fix the economy.

That`s going to happen and it will be forced upon us even the EU are are talking about raising rates some reckon UK will be looking at a 2% base within the next 18 months or so 

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It puts 3 year renters in prime position for a discount on the asking price. They are the only ones who can save the landlord the CGT, unless they want to wait another 3 years taking a chance on another tenant buying it. The renter can look at the price history and see how much CGT they would save the landlord and offer something between asking and asking-CGT saving.

 

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25 minutes ago, Democorruptcy said:

It puts 3 year renters in prime position for a discount on the asking price. They are the only ones who can save the landlord the CGT, unless they want to wait another 3 years taking a chance on another tenant buying it. The renter can look at the price history and see how much CGT they would save the landlord and offer something between asking and asking-CGT saving.

 

I dont think anything will become of this theyre just putting it out there to get a reaction.

Its too complex and a vote loser.

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22 minutes ago, Democorruptcy said:

It puts 3 year renters in prime position for a discount on the asking price. They are the only ones who can save the landlord the CGT, unless they want to wait another 3 years taking a chance on another tenant buying it. The renter can look at the price history and see how much CGT they would save the landlord and offer something between asking and asking-CGT saving.

 

My initial feeling was that it's another gift for landlords but on reflection I see that overall this could be a positive thing for tenants.

+ may encourage landlords to keep tenants for longer to enable such sale, instead of shopping around for higher rents or allowing estate agents to keep tenants  flowing to maximize agents' fees

+ will encourage keeping larger houses as they are, instead of splitting them into HMO hell holes

+ will add some power for tenants to get a better service from landlords.  Of course this should be as given but we all know landlords treat tenants like shit normally, not as paying customers who expect to receive a service in return  

+ will help reasonably well off tenants (who have higher potential of buying a house) to find accommodation as landlords will prefer them to professional benefits recipients who have little chance of buying a house

- will make it harder for people on benefits (and who genuinely deserve to be on benefits) to find private accommodation  

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