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BA are making the most of things


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A friend on FaceBook - BA Cabin Crew:

On 15th June, I will be made redundant from the job I still enjoy after 25 years of service. Redundancy notices are to be issued to 43,000 of my colleagues: the entire workforce. Yes, you read correctly!
31,000 "lucky" former employees will then be offered re-employement on a far inferior contract that the company has wanted to enforce since 2010. For me, this would represent a 50% pay cut.

This is to be accompanied by an increase in productivity of 25%, not to mention far inferior T&Cs and, basically, a zero-hours contract.

All of this is with a backdrop of our CEO's bonus of £3.2 million in March this year; he’s been paid £33 million over the last 9 years. For the financial year '19/'20, the company I work for made a near record-breaking operating profit of £1.9 billion. I received no bonus; not a penny.

The company I work for has the biggest cash reserves of any airline on this planet: £9 billion. During this "fight for survival", the company I work for is in the process of spending £1billion buying another airline, Air Europa. All this whilst taking cash handouts from both the UK & Spanish governments & the UK taxpayer paying 80% of the current wage bill....

Nobody is saying we shouldn't all do our bit and take a shared responsibility approach as we ride this storm. However the company I currently work for absolutely refuses to negotiate.
#BAbetrayal

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1 minute ago, Long time lurking said:

That is a huge problem the same problem endowment mortgages had 

The risk of making promises you cannot guarantee 

I've heard stories of some now long retired ex BA captains receiving totally unsustainable pensions.  Which of course means the current staff are having their T&C's worsened to, amongst other things, fund the long since retired staff.  I read on flying forums of basically no older pilots advising their offspring/younger relatives to become pilots.  The glamour long since went, and now the working conditions and pensions have gone too.  I suppose the salaries are still ok, but when the lifestyle is considered it's probably not worth it for most.

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33 minutes ago, Iamcynical said:

I've heard stories of some now long retired ex BA captains receiving totally unsustainable pensions.  Which of course means the current staff are having their T&C's worsened to, amongst other things, fund the long since retired staff.  I read on flying forums of basically no older pilots advising their offspring/younger relatives to become pilots.  The glamour long since went, and now the working conditions and pensions have gone too.  I suppose the salaries are still ok, but when the lifestyle is considered it's probably not worth it for most.

I f the pension is not backed by the tax payer they will never be what they were 

Standard life going bust was the first nail in the coffin as investing rules were changed regarding providers ,zirp from 2088>  then finished them 

 

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4 hours ago, eek said:

A friend on FaceBook - BA Cabin Crew:

On 15th June, I will be made redundant from the job I still enjoy after 25 years of service. Redundancy notices are to be issued to 43,000 of my colleagues: the entire workforce. Yes, you read correctly!
31,000 "lucky" former employees will then be offered re-employement on a far inferior contract that the company has wanted to enforce since 2010. For me, this would represent a 50% pay cut.

This is to be accompanied by an increase in productivity of 25%, not to mention far inferior T&Cs and, basically, a zero-hours contract.

All of this is with a backdrop of our CEO's bonus of £3.2 million in March this year; he’s been paid £33 million over the last 9 years. For the financial year '19/'20, the company I work for made a near record-breaking operating profit of £1.9 billion. I received no bonus; not a penny.

The company I work for has the biggest cash reserves of any airline on this planet: £9 billion. During this "fight for survival", the company I work for is in the process of spending £1billion buying another airline, Air Europa. All this whilst taking cash handouts from both the UK & Spanish governments & the UK taxpayer paying 80% of the current wage bill....

Nobody is saying we shouldn't all do our bit and take a shared responsibility approach as we ride this storm. However the company I currently work for absolutely refuses to negotiate.
#BAbetrayal

That's like the tallest dwarf or the smartest copper.

I'd doubt BA has 9bln in cash. Checking.....

IAG, which is BA n others has a market cap of just under 4bln.

This is union bullshit.

 

3 hours ago, Iamcynical said:

Surely not.  Another large company taking full advantage of the 'virus' :Old:

BA have been pretty shit for ages and have been trashing working conditions for years by all accounts.  Aren't they basically one big underfunded pension scheme that happens to have an airline anyway these days ?!?!

Trashing new employees conditions.

The existing employees are unchanged.

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3 hours ago, Iamcynical said:

Surely not.  Another large company taking full advantage of the 'virus' :Old:

BA have been pretty shit for ages and have been trashing working conditions for years by all accounts.  Aren't they basically one big underfunded pension scheme that happens to have an airline anyway these days ?!?!

That claim, which is true, dates back to the 90s.

Dont invest in Airlines.

Try pay too much and make too little.

They also charge too little now.

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3 hours ago, Iamcynical said:

I've heard stories of some now long retired ex BA captains receiving totally unsustainable pensions.  Which of course means the current staff are having their T&C's worsened to, amongst other things, fund the long since retired staff.  I read on flying forums of basically no older pilots advising their offspring/younger relatives to become pilots.  The glamour long since went, and now the working conditions and pensions have gone too.  I suppose the salaries are still ok, but when the lifestyle is considered it's probably not worth it for most.

Back in the mid 90s, I worked out how unsustainable a lot of DB schemes were.

From then, I started looking at a companies pension liabilities as well as TnCs.

BAs was insane.

Most of public sector ones are too.

3 hours ago, Iamcynical said:

I've heard stories of some now long retired ex BA captains receiving totally unsustainable pensions.  Which of course means the current staff are having their T&C's worsened to, amongst other things, fund the long since retired staff.  I read on flying forums of basically no older pilots advising their offspring/younger relatives to become pilots.  The glamour long since went, and now the working conditions and pensions have gone too.  I suppose the salaries are still ok, but when the lifestyle is considered it's probably not worth it for most.

Pilots are less capable than bus drivers, who at least drive the bus, collect the fares n deal with the shit.

 

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5 hours ago, eek said:

A friend on FaceBook - BA Cabin Crew:

On 15th June, I will be made redundant from the job I still enjoy after 25 years of service. Redundancy notices are to be issued to 43,000 of my colleagues: the entire workforce. Yes, you read correctly!
31,000 "lucky" former employees will then be offered re-employement on a far inferior contract that the company has wanted to enforce since 2010. For me, this would represent a 50% pay cut.

 

Nice, all grist the mill for my cheap house prospects.

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The other side of the story is pretty simple.

There are several older crew on legacy contracts.

They can bleat on about the 'difficulties' of the job, but £50k a year for a cabin crew is just too much. Yes, I agree that the new cabin crew make a pretty poor living, but really reflects the supply and demand; nobody is forcing them to work there after all.

Having been on a variety of flights in the last few years I can't say there is much difference between the senior crew and the younger ones, you get bad and good ones at all age groups. I get the feeling that morale is bad, but it isn't just going to be fixed with money.

 

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3 hours ago, Boon said:

The other side of the story is pretty simple.

There are several older crew on legacy contracts.

They can bleat on about the 'difficulties' of the job, but £50k a year for a cabin crew is just too much. Yes, I agree that the new cabin crew make a pretty poor living, but really reflects the supply and demand; nobody is forcing them to work there after all.

Having been on a variety of flights in the last few years I can't say there is much difference between the senior crew and the younger ones, you get bad and good ones at all age groups. I get the feeling that morale is bad, but it isn't just going to be fixed with money.

 

This. Most of the older better paid ones are miserable gits anyhow. 

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3 hours ago, Royston said:

£50k for a trolley dolly!!

I remember a few years ago london Heathrow BA staff were asked to leave their sports cars at home when they attended a meeting with ba Gatwick staff. Trolly dolly's were pulling in 80k+ a year wirh wages, travel allowance etc. 

 

Should be on minimum wage. 

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3 hours ago, Royston said:

£50k for a trolley dolly!!

Itll be about 30k

 But there'll be extra pay for stopovers n odds n sods.

Theyd have to dead old.

I shared a house with 3 air hostesses in the early 90s. They were on shit money then but the side perks, basically a paid mini break every week, were good, if you liked that doet of stuff.

They all changed from BA to Virgin Atlantic, despite shit pay. But they did meet rich hubbies.

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If you can get a gig on long haul then it’s not a bad way to spend a few years in your early twenties. You only have to fly to somewhere and back and you’ve done the best part of a week’s work. You stay in a nice hotel and you have an allowance to spend partying or at least that’s what the two ex long haul air hostesses I know did. One quit shortly after BA took over BMI and the other got sacked by Emirates after over sleeping following a heavy night thus delaying the plane she was supposed to work on.

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Posted (edited)
4 hours ago, Royston said:

£50k for a trolley dolly!!

Yeah. I know a CSD (Cabin Service Director) and a Purser. The CSD is the top of the Cabin Crew tree on the old contract, and full time would be £50K plus easy! All these grades are way out of sync with the standard rates of pay in the industry. And BA rely very heavily on business/first class across the Atlantic. Where's that market gonna be in the next few years. BA, a pension fund with an airline attached, they are in trouble!

Luckily I'm not that friendly with these two stuck up twats, so bring it on!!

Edited by NogintheNog
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1 hour ago, NogintheNog said:

Yeah. I know a CSD (Cabin Service Director) and a Purser. The CSD is the top of the Cabin Crew tree on the old contract, and full time would be £50K plus easy! All these grades are way out of sync with the standard rates of pay in the industry. And BA rely very heavily on business/first class across the Atlantic. Where's that market gonna be in the next few years. BA, a pension fund with an airline attached, they are in trouble!

Luckily I'm not that friendly with these two stuck up twats, so bring it on!!

Mrs P's company regularly used to use BA to fly staff business across to US.They've massively cut travel last few years.

Can't imagine they're th e only mulitnational to do so.Especially with the propsect of having staff get stuck on the worng side of the pond.

 

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Posted (edited)

Cry me a fucking river. If you don't like the conditions don't work there. Take fucking responsibility for your life. Being a trolley dolly should purely be for 18 year thots to get free travel for a few years while fucking their way around world while earning some beer money. Every year millions of 18/19 year old thots sign up this "adventure". It should only pay minimum wage at best. If you're over 23 and still doing the job and complaining about the pay and conditions then get fucking real, grow up and get a proper career.

Mate of mine hooked up with a trolley dolly in her 30s, went and moved in with her into her pad as well the idiot. Every time I saw him I told him I thought he was making a mistake letting her have that sort of control over him. Did hold back though and didn't mention the amount of international cock hours she no doubt clocked up. He's a massive simp though. Anyway didn't last long. One night they are out at a bar with a group of mates and she disappears outside for a fag with a mate of his, he looks outside, the bar having all glass walls, and watches them cop off.  

On 24/05/2020 at 15:47, Iamcynical said:

I've heard stories of some now long retired ex BA captains receiving totally unsustainable pensions.  Which of course means the current staff are having their T&C's worsened to, amongst other things, fund the long since retired staff.  I read on flying forums of basically no older pilots advising their offspring/younger relatives to become pilots.  The glamour long since went, and now the working conditions and pensions have gone too.  I suppose the salaries are still ok, but when the lifestyle is considered it's probably not worth it for most.

Anyone take a guess what sort of pensions these ex BA captains might have? I'm guessing you've had thousands of boomer captains retiring on final salary £120k+ pensions and will keep up with inflation?

Being a pilot sounds a shitty deal these days. Far too many grass is greener idiots remortgaging their houses to pay for lessons to then have 5am starts flying to Shagaluf and back 10 times a week for the next 10/15 years until you get a captains chair on international flights and get paid half decent money. 

Edited by gibbon
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11 minutes ago, gibbon said:

Cry me a fucking river. If you don't like the conditions don't work there. Take fucking responsibility for your life. Being a trolley dolly should purely be for 18 year thots to get free travel for a few years while fucking their way around world while earning some beer money. Every year millions of 18/19 year old thots sign up this "adventure". It should only pay minimum wage at best. If you're over 23 and still doing the job and complaining about the pay and conditions then get fucking real, grow up and get a proper career.

Mate of mine hooked up with a trolley dolly in her 30s, went and moved in with her into her pad as well the idiot. Every time I saw him I told him I thought he was making a mistake letting her have that sort of control over him. Did hold back though and didn't mention the amount of international cock hours she no doubt clocked up. He's a massive simp though. Anyway didn't last long. One night they are out at a bar with a group of mates and she disappears outside for a fag with a mate of his, he looks outside, the bar having all glass walls, and watches them cop off.  

Anyone take a guess what sort of pensions these ex BA captains might have? I'm guessing you've had thousands of boomer captains retiring on final salary £120k+ pensions and will keep up with inflation?

Being a pilot sounds a shitty deal these days. Far too many grass is greener idiots remortgaging their houses to pay for lessons to then have 5am starts flying to Shagaluf and back 10 times a week for the next 10/15 years until you get a captains chair on international flights and get paid half decent money. 

Salaries had risen quite significantly for pilots over the past few years. The glut of ex Soviet pilots have been retiring; combine that with no airline willing to pay to train their own pilots and a boom in air travel and suddenly pay even if you flew for Ryan Air was half decent.

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  • 1 month later...
On 28/05/2020 at 10:05, Castlevania said:

Salaries had risen quite significantly for pilots over the past few years. The glut of ex Soviet pilots have been retiring; combine that with no airline willing to pay to train their own pilots and a boom in air travel and suddenly pay even if you flew for Ryan Air was half decent.

expesnive business is it?

https://www.flightdeckfriend.com/how-much-does-it-cost-to-train-as-a-pilot/

 

The Cost of Flight Training

In 2017, it will cost you anywhere between £40,000 to £120,000 to train as a commercial pilot. The cost depends on which flight school you train at and the type of training you do. The majority of airline’s currently require the student to pay the cost of training.

  • A full time commercial flight training course (known as an integrated course) completed at a European flight school will cost upwards of £80,000 to around £120,000.
  • Part time training, or a course completed at a various flight training organisations (known as modular training) will start at around £40,000 to £60,000.

 

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