The Big Short Time and Furnished Holiday Let thread ...

[One percent]

4 minutes ago, Bilbo said:

Article in today's Telegraph ,free at moment. About  double  council tax .

Very interesting to read comments, mainly negative.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2024/03/31/council-tax-to-double-for-80-per-cent-of-second-homes/

Is there a link to get around the paywall please. 

[Bilbo]

15 minutes ago, One percent said:

Is there a link to get around the paywall please. 

It's free for me but have a link 

https://archive.ph/2024.03.31-204346/https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2024/03/31/council-tax-to-double-for-80-per-cent-of-second-homes/

 

[One percent]

I was talking to a farmer from up the valley a bit at the weekend. He has a large party house on his farm he lets out to hen and stag parties and the link. He says that he DOESN’T HAVE ONE BOOKING. Not one.  

[MightyTharg]

A clever ruse to force house prices up.

”wishing to rent out a short-term holiday home for more than 90 days a year must apply for planning permission.”

Restricting the number of days means that instead of buying one home to use for holiday lets for 180 days you will have to buy two for ninety days each. Forcing one extra family into renting or homelessness.

The double council tax will also keep those dirty northerners in their place. No more temporary jobs down South - that double council tax will make it unviable.

Pretty sound Tory policies really.

[One percent]

21 minutes ago, MightyTharg said:

A clever ruse to force house prices up.

”wishing to rent out a short-term holiday home for more than 90 days a year must apply for planning permission.”

Restricting the number of days means that instead of buying one home to use for holiday lets for 180 days you will have to buy two for ninety days each. Forcing one extra family into renting or homelessness.

The double council tax will also keep those dirty northerners in their place. No more temporary jobs down South - that double council tax will make it unviable.

Pretty sound Tory policies really.

I think the devil is in the detail. They go on and on about airbnb but there are loads advertised through alternative sites. Do those count?  What about those who are already let out?  Is it only new to the market properties?   

[eek]

On 03/05/2024 at 17:19, MightyTharg said:

A clever ruse to force house prices up.

”wishing to rent out a short-term holiday home for more than 90 days a year must apply for planning permission.”

Restricting the number of days means that instead of buying one home to use for holiday lets for 180 days you will have to buy two for ninety days each. Forcing one extra family into renting or homelessness.

The double council tax will also keep those dirty northerners in their place. No more temporary jobs down South - that double council tax will make it unviable.

Pretty sound Tory policies really.

The whole point of the 90 day limit is to restrict the turnover to reduce the total income 

 

so the maths doesn’t work out and you don’t buy any holiday home to let out 

Edited May 6 by eek

[MightyTharg]

5 minutes ago, eek said:

The whole point of the 90 day limit is to restrict the turnover to reduce the total income 

 

so the maths doesn’t work out and you don’t buy any holiday home to let out 

It still works out if you can charge 4x the normal rent for your holiday lets. Which you can.

The whole idea is to keep house prices up and keep the poor poor.

Otherwise they would just grant more planning permission.

[Wight Flight]

3 hours ago, MightyTharg said:

It still works out if you can charge 4x the normal rent for your holiday lets. Which you can.

The whole idea is to keep house prices up and keep the poor poor.

Otherwise they would just grant more planning permission.

Not quite. The costs are much higher.

[spygirl]

19 hours ago, MightyTharg said:

It still works out if you can charge 4x the normal rent for your holiday lets. Which you can.

The whole idea is to keep house prices up and keep the poor poor.

Otherwise they would just grant more planning permission.

 

16 hours ago, Wight Flight said:

Not quite. The costs are much higher.

FHL walk a very narrow tight rope.

They need to charge much much more than a rental as they have much higher costs and only let for a small percentage of weeks.

If they charge too much then they wont get the bookings and they'll lose the FHL benefits - these are gone anyway now.

If they charge too little theyll fuck up the yield, which the bank does monitor to check theyve not let to a duffer.

And is commercial loans - the bank can - and does- call the loan in if it finds its let too much to an area.

To quote most (local) people I know whove jumped into FHL im the last 10y - and a eye brow raising number have with a mortgage - we dont make any money.

 They are luck theyll skim low thousands - 3/4k year.

Which when you add up the mortgage debt and risk is laughable.

Previously, locals only let grans old house i.e no debt.

 

 

 

 

[One percent]

17 minutes ago, spygirl said:

 

FHL walk a very narrow tight rope.

They need to charge much much more than a rental as they have much higher costs and only let for a small percentage of weeks.

If they charge too much then they wont get the bookings and they'll lose the FHL benefits - these are gone anyway now.

If they charge too little theyll fuck up the yield, which the bank does monitor to check theyve not let to a duffer.

And is commercial loans - the bank can - and does- call the loan in if it finds its let too much to an area.

To quote most (local) people I know whove jumped into FHL im the last 10y - and a eye brow raising number have with a mortgage - we dont make any money.

 They are luck theyll skim low thousands - 3/4k year.

Which when you add up the mortgage debt and risk is laughable.

Previously, locals only let grans old house i.e no debt.

 

 

 

 

Anyone borrowing to fund a fhl needs their head felt.   
 

im off for my morning walk round town shortly. Given that it’s the day after the bank holiday, i should find it difficult to park. My guess is that I’ll have my pick. 

[sancho panza]

love the way they anticipate rasiing prices into a cost of living crisis

https://uk.finance.yahoo.com/news/nine-10-holiday-let-owners-160000664.html

Nine in 10 holiday let owners to raise prices ahead of tax raid

Nine in 10 holiday let owners say they will increase the price of bookings ahead of Jeremy Hunt’s £300m tax raid on second homes.

From April next year, holiday homeowners in England will no longer be able to offset their mortgage interest payments from profits and will lose generous tax perks on capital gains.

Higher rate taxpayers face the prospect of paying 24pc tax on profits from a sale rather than the 10pc they currently benefit from via Business Asset Disposal Relief.

 

The average annual income for a three-bed holiday let is £24,500 and £16,300 for a one-bed property, according to letting platform Sykes Holiday Cottages, but profits are due to take a hit thanks to the Chancellor’s tax overhaul.

Calculations by wealth planning firm Quilter show that holiday homeowners could be £3,000 a year worse off. The figures are based on a property purchase price of £350,000, with an annual mortgage rate of 4.5pc and £20,000 rental income.

In a bid to soften the impact of the greater tax burden, 87pc are planning to increase the cost of bookings, according to a survey of 500 holiday let owners.

[One percent]

3 minutes ago, sancho panza said:

love the way they anticipate rasiing prices into a cost of living crisis

https://uk.finance.yahoo.com/news/nine-10-holiday-let-owners-160000664.html

Nine in 10 holiday let owners to raise prices ahead of tax raid

Nine in 10 holiday let owners say they will increase the price of bookings ahead of Jeremy Hunt’s £300m tax raid on second homes.

From April next year, holiday homeowners in England will no longer be able to offset their mortgage interest payments from profits and will lose generous tax perks on capital gains.

Higher rate taxpayers face the prospect of paying 24pc tax on profits from a sale rather than the 10pc they currently benefit from via Business Asset Disposal Relief.

 

The average annual income for a three-bed holiday let is £24,500 and £16,300 for a one-bed property, according to letting platform Sykes Holiday Cottages, but profits are due to take a hit thanks to the Chancellor’s tax overhaul.

Calculations by wealth planning firm Quilter show that holiday homeowners could be £3,000 a year worse off. The figures are based on a property purchase price of £350,000, with an annual mortgage rate of 4.5pc and £20,000 rental income.

In a bid to soften the impact of the greater tax burden, 87pc are planning to increase the cost of bookings, according to a survey of 500 holiday let owners.

Good luck with that, bookings have fallen off a cliff.  
 

on a different note, a local group here has done a new calculation on the number of non-residential properties (either fhl or second homes) in the town. Last calculation maybe three years ago was 28 percent. It’s now at 38 percent. 

[swiss_democracy_for_all]

A special article for @One percent and @spygirl, as it's related to Whitby. Try not to cry when you read the sad story of the hardworking second home owner.....

We bought £205k home in pretty seaside town - but retirement dream is now a nightmare (msn.com)

[spygirl]

3 minutes ago, swiss_democracy_for_all said:

A special article for @One percent and @spygirl, as it's related to Whitby. Try not to cry when you read the sad story of the hardworking second home owner.....

We bought £205k home in pretty seaside town - but retirement dream is now a nightmare (msn.com)

Onesie has already done that dog arsed faced cow's whinge.

 

[One percent]

29 minutes ago, swiss_democracy_for_all said:

A special article for @One percent and @spygirl, as it's related to Whitby. Try not to cry when you read the sad story of the hardworking second home owner.....

We bought £205k home in pretty seaside town - but retirement dream is now a nightmare (msn.com)

Talking to people on my wander this morning.  The entitled cow is getting a right bashing from locals. It’s not gone down as she was expecting and the universal view is fuckoff.  

[HousePriceMania]

3 hours ago, One percent said:

Talking to people on my wander this morning.  The entitled cow is getting a right bashing from locals. It’s not gone down as she was expecting and the universal view is fuckoff.  

Her paying over the odds for a 2nd home is a punitive tax on poor young people who need shelter

Silly fucking cow, deserves all that's coming her way when she tries to sell up.

[One percent]

40 minutes ago, HousePriceMania said:

Her paying over the odds for a 2nd home is a punitive tax on poor young people who need shelter

Silly fucking cow, deserves all that's coming her way when she tries to sell up.

The town is full of entitled white settlers who look down their noses at locals, she is one of many.  

[sancho panza]

8 hours ago, One percent said:

Talking to people on my wander this morning.  The entitled cow is getting a right bashing from locals. It’s not gone down as she was expecting and the universal view is fuckoff.  

I cant imagine why?

The last sentence is pure 'no sh1t sherlock'....

'The couple had been enjoying a lower tax value while their property was being rented out, thanks to 100 per cent business rate relief. When they reached retirement, the choice was made not to continue renting but to keep the cottage for personal usage.

They were stunned to discover the annual tax of £1,800 is programmed to nearly double up to £4,000 by April 2025. This surge can be attributed to North Yorkshire Council's introduction of a 'second home premium' charge of 100%, in line with the Levelling Up Act (2023).

In light of this heavy hike, Fiona pondered selling the place. She added: "It's going to cost an awful lot of money to keep the two homes."

[One percent]

18 minutes ago, sancho panza said:

I cant imagine why?

The last sentence is pure 'no sh1t sherlock'....

'The couple had been enjoying a lower tax value while their property was being rented out, thanks to 100 per cent business rate relief. When they reached retirement, the choice was made not to continue renting but to keep the cottage for personal usage.

They were stunned to discover the annual tax of £1,800 is programmed to nearly double up to £4,000 by April 2025. This surge can be attributed to North Yorkshire Council's introduction of a 'second home premium' charge of 100%, in line with the Levelling Up Act (2023).

In light of this heavy hike, Fiona pondered selling the place. She added: "It's going to cost an awful lot of money to keep the two homes."

As someone pointed out on farcebook (she’s getting a real good kicking on there), she would also have got the tens of thousands chucked at small businesses in the convid. 

[spygirl]

Holiday home owners targeted in HMRC crackdown

Tax office launches 20-fold increase in investigations following staycation boom

Charlotte Gifford, SENIOR MONEY REPORTER16 May 2024 • 10:33am

 

 

In some areas of England and Wales, more than one in 10 addresses are holiday lets CREDIT: Manfred Gottschalk/Stone RF

Airbnb owners are being targeted in a tax probe surge following a boom in holiday let investment.

HM Revenue & Customs (HMRC) launched nearly 2,000 holiday let enquiries in 2023-24 – up from 375 the prior year and just 95 the year before that, according to official data.

The figures, obtained by The Telegraph in a freedom of information request, show there was a 20-fold increase in investigations between 2021-22 and 2023-24.

The tax office said it was investigating holiday home investors suspected of failing to declare income following a post-pandemic boom in staycations, while experts warned taxpayers could be caught out by coronavirus easements on tax rules which no longer apply.

It comes after the Government announced a £300m tax raid on short-term rentals, with Chancellor Jeremy Hunt unveiling the abolition of the Furnished Holiday Lettings regime (FHL) in the Budget.

It is part of a wider bid to disincentivise out-of-towners purchasing second homes in holiday hotspots, a rising trend which has been blamed on pricing locals out of the property market.

 

There are around 70,000 holiday homes in the UK, according to the latest Census data. In some areas of England and Wales, more than one in 10 addresses are holiday lets.

David Hollingworth, of L&C Mortgages, a broker, said HMRC had been looking at the sector more closely ever since the pandemic when holiday lets soared in popularity.

“During the lockdown, people wanted the option of getting out of urban areas,” he said. “It also seemed like a good investment because more staycations meant there was more competition which intensified the appeal to property investors who could therefore command a higher income.”

In May 2023, the platform Airbnb was forced to share users’ income data with HMRC so the tax office could identify holiday let owners it suspected had not paid enough tax.

John Hood, of accountancy firm Moore Kingston Smith, said HMRC had been clamping down on owners “taking advantage” of the generous tax breaks on holiday lets.

Currently owners of short-term rentals are able to offset their mortgage interest payments from profits and claim capital gains tax relief on the sale of the property.

Mr Hollingworth said many property investors switched to holiday lets following the loss of mortgage interest tax relief in the buy-to-let sector between 2017 and 2020.

“The holiday let sector was left out of many of the changes that happened in buy-to-let – so for example, you had the ability to offset costs whereas in the standard market you could only get 20pc relief.”

For a property to qualify as an furnished holiday let, it must be commercially let for at least 105 days each year. During the coronavirus lockdowns, HMRC relaxed this condition.

Mr Hood said: “HMRC took the sympathetic view during Covid and lockdown that people understandably migrated to the countryside and the coast to take advantage of their holiday homes.”

After the pandemic, HMRC likely feared that homeowners had become too comfortable and were either using their holiday let as their main residence or failing to let it out for 105 days, Mr Hood added.

“In many cases, owners will not be deliberately seeking to avoid their tax obligations – but this naivety would not stop HMRC seeking to recover any tax lost.”

The abolition of tax breaks on holiday threatens to leave investors nearly £3,000 worse off a year from April, according to calculations by wealth manager Quilter.

Councils will soon be able to double council tax bills for owners of second homes that have been left empty for more than a year, under enhanced powers. These rules are already in place in Scotland.

An HMRC spokesman said: “The short-term property rental market is growing fast and it’s our role to ensure owners pay the right tax, creating a level playing field for all. We have dedicated specific resource to opening enquiries where there is evidence that those renting out holiday lets have not declared income.”

[Wight Flight]

1 hour ago, spygirl said:

Holiday home owners targeted in HMRC crackdown

Tax office launches 20-fold increase in investigations following staycation boom

Charlotte Gifford, SENIOR MONEY REPORTER16 May 2024 • 10:33am

 

 

In some areas of England and Wales, more than one in 10 addresses are holiday lets CREDIT: Manfred Gottschalk/Stone RF

Airbnb owners are being targeted in a tax probe surge following a boom in holiday let investment.

HM Revenue & Customs (HMRC) launched nearly 2,000 holiday let enquiries in 2023-24 – up from 375 the prior year and just 95 the year before that, according to official data.

The figures, obtained by The Telegraph in a freedom of information request, show there was a 20-fold increase in investigations between 2021-22 and 2023-24.

The tax office said it was investigating holiday home investors suspected of failing to declare income following a post-pandemic boom in staycations, while experts warned taxpayers could be caught out by coronavirus easements on tax rules which no longer apply.

It comes after the Government announced a £300m tax raid on short-term rentals, with Chancellor Jeremy Hunt unveiling the abolition of the Furnished Holiday Lettings regime (FHL) in the Budget.

It is part of a wider bid to disincentivise out-of-towners purchasing second homes in holiday hotspots, a rising trend which has been blamed on pricing locals out of the property market.

 

There are around 70,000 holiday homes in the UK, according to the latest Census data. In some areas of England and Wales, more than one in 10 addresses are holiday lets.

David Hollingworth, of L&C Mortgages, a broker, said HMRC had been looking at the sector more closely ever since the pandemic when holiday lets soared in popularity.

“During the lockdown, people wanted the option of getting out of urban areas,” he said. “It also seemed like a good investment because more staycations meant there was more competition which intensified the appeal to property investors who could therefore command a higher income.”

In May 2023, the platform Airbnb was forced to share users’ income data with HMRC so the tax office could identify holiday let owners it suspected had not paid enough tax.

John Hood, of accountancy firm Moore Kingston Smith, said HMRC had been clamping down on owners “taking advantage” of the generous tax breaks on holiday lets.

Currently owners of short-term rentals are able to offset their mortgage interest payments from profits and claim capital gains tax relief on the sale of the property.

Mr Hollingworth said many property investors switched to holiday lets following the loss of mortgage interest tax relief in the buy-to-let sector between 2017 and 2020.

“The holiday let sector was left out of many of the changes that happened in buy-to-let – so for example, you had the ability to offset costs whereas in the standard market you could only get 20pc relief.”

For a property to qualify as an furnished holiday let, it must be commercially let for at least 105 days each year. During the coronavirus lockdowns, HMRC relaxed this condition.

Mr Hood said: “HMRC took the sympathetic view during Covid and lockdown that people understandably migrated to the countryside and the coast to take advantage of their holiday homes.”

After the pandemic, HMRC likely feared that homeowners had become too comfortable and were either using their holiday let as their main residence or failing to let it out for 105 days, Mr Hood added.

“In many cases, owners will not be deliberately seeking to avoid their tax obligations – but this naivety would not stop HMRC seeking to recover any tax lost.”

The abolition of tax breaks on holiday threatens to leave investors nearly £3,000 worse off a year from April, according to calculations by wealth manager Quilter.

Councils will soon be able to double council tax bills for owners of second homes that have been left empty for more than a year, under enhanced powers. These rules are already in place in Scotland.

An HMRC spokesman said: “The short-term property rental market is growing fast and it’s our role to ensure owners pay the right tax, creating a level playing field for all. We have dedicated specific resource to opening enquiries where there is evidence that those renting out holiday lets have not declared income.”

Is there a way of looking at the council tax database to work out if a property is registered as a FHL?

[spygirl]

9 minutes ago, Wight Flight said:

Is there a way of looking at the council tax database to work out if a property is registered as a FHL?

Hmrc rates register.

[One percent]

2 minutes ago, spygirl said:

Hmrc rates register.

An awful lot won’t be registered as business, they will be fhl on the quiet