Property crash, just maybe it really is different this time

[GTM]

10 hours ago, Herby said:

I'm hoping this happens because I put an offer in on a house a couple of days ago and it got refused because of there were 97 viewings. in Hampshire. I'm pissed off because I'm a single buyer competing against couples. I'm still going over offers. I want to move out of rented. I can't see this impacting the market for at least 7 months. Certainly respect that a lot of people here are in their own places, or are comfortable in their current mortgage situations, and God (or whatever non-denominational deity or belief system 😂🤷🏼‍♂️) speed to them. 

 

I'm amazed you've found anything worth getting into a bidding war over. I'm mostly seeing complete shit.

[haroldshand]

31 minutes ago, GTM said:

I'm amazed you've found anything worth getting into a bidding war over. I'm mostly seeing complete shit.

I have been sitting on my hands with a decent cash pot for several years now and it was shit then, I seem to be in a minority where I just refuse to throw my money away on garbage, maybe people have a different mind set when it's debt/mortgage they are using

[Noallegiance]

1 hour ago, haroldshand said:

maybe people have a different mind set when it's debt/mortgage they are using

This. 

And the expectation that next year it'll have another £150k on the price tag to swap for something better.

For the mean time, they're on 'the ladder' innit!

[GTM]

3 hours ago, haroldshand said:

I have been sitting on my hands with a decent cash pot for several years now and it was shit then, I seem to be in a minority where I just refuse to throw my money away on garbage, maybe people have a different mind set when it's debt/mortgage they are using

I didn't spend the last decade saving and worrying about how my money was invested just to throw it away by handing it over to somebody who just happened to buy a house.

Luckily I don't have any ties to where I'm living now after the kids finish school. So if things are still mad I can buy where they aren't quite so mad. If the kids have their heads screwed on they can take advantage of their dual nationality. Max out their student loans for University then fuck off on graduation.

If the UK has decided to fuck over their parents then the moral and sensible thing for the kids to do is to fuck over the UK.

[haroldshand]

28 minutes ago, GTM said:

I didn't spend the last decade saving and worrying about how my money was invested just to throw it away by handing it over to somebody who just happened to buy a house.

Luckily I don't have any ties to where I'm living now after the kids finish school. So if things are still mad I can buy where they aren't quite so mad. If the kids have their heads screwed on they can take advantage of their dual nationality. Max out their student loans for University then fuck off on graduation.

If the UK has decided to fuck over their parents then the moral and sensible thing for the kids to do is to fuck over the UK.

I am in the same boat now and after settling with a £1,500 pound rental figure in my head where I am actually paying £1,300 right now I am living really comfortably. I watching the cost of living crisis from an armchair and though I do love a good complain about certain items rising it is not affecting me in the least and I have loads of disposable income.

Though not entirely the same I think I am in the same kind of position of friends of mine who lease business vehicles where I used to get their arguments in a way where they pay slightly more but then they are flexible and have zero worries there after.

I just believe the British have just gone totally  insane when it comes to buying houses and understanding value, they just  cannot see it anymore, but these things can and do change.  Having said that though I am not going to sit down and start a one man campaign on how wrong and unfair the property market is because it isn't, it is what it is and if it decides to alter course I will be there in a good position ready, posting and bitching every day on like minded websites is no way to live your life.

As things stand I am off to Madeira end of this year and will be spending 50% plus of my time there, maybe even if UK house prices crash I might still remain there.

[HousePriceMania]

1 hour ago, GTM said:

I didn't spend the last decade saving and worrying about how my money was invested just to throw it away by handing it over to somebody who just happened to buy a house.

Luckily I don't have any ties to where I'm living now after the kids finish school. So if things are still mad I can buy where they aren't quite so mad. If the kids have their heads screwed on they can take advantage of their dual nationality. Max out their student loans for University then fuck off on graduation.

If the UK has decided to fuck over their parents then the moral and sensible thing for the kids to do is to fuck over the UK.

The choice is pretty stark for me now, buy a house in the UK with my cash pot or retire and live somewhere sunny and nice and never work again.  That's how silly UK house prices have become.

[VeryMeanReversion]

5 hours ago, haroldshand said:

 I seem to be in a minority where I just refuse to throw my money away on garbage

Maybe you don't actually have any money, you just have currency (garbage).

[haroldshand]

25 minutes ago, HousePriceMania said:

The choice is pretty stark for me now, buy a house in the UK with my cash pot or retire and live somewhere sunny and nice and never work again.  That's how silly UK house prices have become.

This is the point I have politely tried to get across to you a couple of times now.

But I have to add there is nothing wrong, unfair, overpriced, underpriced or any other negative things people can think of about the housing market, it is what it is and you just have to work with it. It more or less does not piss me off in the slightest though I would like to see things different.

It's all about perspective and you have to wonder the people that recently bought housing on two wages not in the area they would have liked and working their socks off, how happy are they?

I am not going to waste a second of my life complaining on sites such as ToS, I have a good life to get on with regardless of housing costs

[Green Devil]

10 hours ago, haroldshand said:

I have been sitting on my hands with a decent cash pot for several years now and it was shit then, I seem to be in a minority where I just refuse to throw my money away on garbage, maybe people have a different mind set when it's debt/mortgage they are using

Im sure you could buy a place thats what you want. But it would be in the country, not 2 minutes from your job in town. When you get population explosion and competition for the same limited resource naturaly most wont be able to afford it, competition means prices rise. Even with a cash pot, crypto good job top 1% earner etc etc. Thats life thats changed brought about from government policy. The solutions are a) give up your job and move somewhere cheaper (work remote is an option) b) throw the towel in on the uk and emigrate (work remote is an option). 

Seems to be the solution of getting a nice place is to work remote from where prices are affirdable ir put up with what you have innthe town close to work. 

[Wight Flight]

8 hours ago, Green Devil said:

Seems to be the solution of getting a nice place is to work remote from where prices are affirdable ir put up with what you have innthe town close to work. 

Too late for that. The nice places are already full of remote workers and boomers.

[haroldshand]

2 minutes ago, Wight Flight said:

Too late for that. The nice places are already full of remote workers and boomers.

Nothing is getting missed these days, people have their notebooks and pencils out as they work out their savings as to should they move two or even three hours up north and make savings in cheaper areas. All the derelict properties in sought after locations snapped up, sometimes you even wonder have they really made all that much of a saving as prices for these are even high.

I have seen couples where one is living the other side of the country for now as they get their foot on the ladder, single men now living in vans or HMO in stressed conditions.

I am not all that old and even I can remember a time when if your Missus worked you had a huge benefit over other couples looking for housing, I once witnessed an argument where the man whose wife worked in an average job was called a ponce for making his wife work, different times.

[Sugarlips]

17 hours ago, haroldshand said:

I am in the same boat now and after settling with a £1,500 pound rental figure in my head where I am actually paying £1,300 right now I am living really comfortably. I watching the cost of living crisis from an armchair and though I do love a good complain about certain items rising it is not affecting me in the least and I have loads of disposable income.

Though not entirely the same I think I am in the same kind of position of friends of mine who lease business vehicles where I used to get their arguments in a way where they pay slightly more but then they are flexible and have zero worries there after.

I just believe the British have just gone totally  insane when it comes to buying houses and understanding value, they just  cannot see it anymore, but these things can and do change.  Having said that though I am not going to sit down and start a one man campaign on how wrong and unfair the property market is because it isn't, it is what it is and if it decides to alter course I will be there in a good position ready, posting and bitching every day on like minded websites is no way to live your life.

As things stand I am off to Madeira end of this year and will be spending 50% plus of my time there, maybe even if UK house prices crash I might still remain there.

Is there a thread on your Madeira adventures? Have you been before? We are looking for winter sun options after being spoilt by living in the heat for the last 2 decades.

[sancho panza]

23 hours ago, haroldshand said:

I have been sitting on my hands with a decent cash pot for several years now and it was shit then, I seem to be in a minority where I just refuse to throw my money away on garbage, maybe people have a different mind set when it's debt/mortgage they are using

There's not a lot of choice in the buying market.Although even less in rentals but less competition

18 hours ago, haroldshand said:

I am in the same boat now and after settling with a £1,500 pound rental figure in my head where I am actually paying £1,300 right now I am living really comfortably. I watching the cost of living crisis from an armchair and though I do love a good complain about certain items rising it is not affecting me in the least and I have loads of disposable income.

Though not entirely the same I think I am in the same kind of position of friends of mine who lease business vehicles where I used to get their arguments in a way where they pay slightly more but then they are flexible and have zero worries there after.

I just believe the British have just gone totally  insane when it comes to buying houses and understanding value, they just  cannot see it anymore, but these things can and do change.  Having said that though I am not going to sit down and start a one man campaign on how wrong and unfair the property market is because it isn't, it is what it is and if it decides to alter course I will be there in a good position ready, posting and bitching every day on like minded websites is no way to live your life.

As things stand I am off to Madeira end of this year and will be spending 50% plus of my time there, maybe even if UK house prices crash I might still remain there.

That's the key thing.We're lucky have substantial investemtns in areas like oil,gold/telecoms.Cost of living crisis isn't hurting me like it is some of my younger colleagues who are band 3/4 NHS.

As ever tho,it's this UK obssession with buying ahosue at the opportunity cost of everything else.People have loads of options ie save into some long oil invesmetns( a price that's only going higher and higher) or head abraod.

We rent admittedly a tthe nicer end around here.Its a lovely hosue and if needed ,could pay the rent with the income of half the hosues value in some of our oil holdings.Mrs P used to be a confirmed 'why aren't we buying a hosue' sort until she saw what we could rent and the freedom to hedge the oil price like we do.On top of that,big bill looming for our LL in the roof,poss £50k-£75k ina year or two.Not our problem.

In all honesty,I was chatting with her indoors last week and was saying if we could get long term rentals that we liked I'd likely never buy unless they were significantly better value.

I used to get wound upabout it but now I realsie that if more people were buying oil stocks,I wouldn't be in as cheap as we are.And I really enjoy the security we have from knowing if we lsot our jobs we could survive.

As for our young people,they haven't had the free education/opportunity to save as we did-I'm 51.I can understand their anger.

[Noallegiance]

1 hour ago, sancho panza said:

That's the key thing.We're lucky have substantial investemtns in areas like oil,gold/telecoms.

Not luck.

Choice.

If you didn't put you there, who did?

[HousePriceMania]

5% mortgage rates by December I said

 

https://moneyfacts.co.uk/news/mortgages/nearly-every-equity-release-lender-hikes-rates-in-2022/

 

With the exception of OneFamily, every lender in the space has raised the cost of its lifetime mortgages since 2022 began. The average rate now stands at 4.33%, the highest seen this year, and notably higher than the record low average of 3.86% seen in March 2021. This is also an increase from the start of the year, when the average rate was 4.10%.

 

 

I wonder when all the low IR teaser deals will end.

[Wight Flight]

2 hours ago, sancho panza said:

In all honesty,I was chatting with her indoors last week and was saying if we could get long term rentals that we liked I'd likely never buy unless they were significantly better value.

That's the tricky bit.

[haroldshand]

23 hours ago, VeryMeanReversion said:

Maybe you don't actually have any money, you just have currency (garbage).

I said cash but I have my money spread all over(just 5-10% in cash), one thing in particular but not going through that again on here

[haroldshand]

6 hours ago, Sugarlips said:

Is there a thread on your Madeira adventures? Have you been before? We are looking for winter sun options after being spoilt by living in the heat for the last 2 decades.

You don't really get winter sun in Madeira, but far warmer than UK, been there and Portugal many times, loads of unspoken little gems and doesn't get half the tourists it deserves, thank goodness.

If I was going to do a blog it would just be on my smallholding.. watch me get kicked to death by a goat or something

[AWW]

On 31/03/2022 at 17:34, HousePriceMania said:

The choice is pretty stark for me now, buy a house in the UK with my cash pot or retire and live somewhere sunny and nice and never work again.  That's how silly UK house prices have become.

Similar for me, albeit I'm nowhere near retirement age. As things stand, I could lose my job and maintain my current standard of living for 5+ years. Or I could buy a nice house in my OK area of north London (which would require roughly £250k deposit and result in a £70k stamp duty charge) and leave myself with less than a year's living expenses and no money to invest in other assets. Easy decision to make.

Edited April 2, 2022 by AWW

[Boon]

Some trending stuff on Mumsnet:

https://www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/4520278-To-have-cried-in-asda

https://www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/4520282-To-think-rent-is-so-bloody-unfair

https://www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/4520185-Are-we-taking-bets-yet-on-when-mass-civil-unrest-will-begin-re-Cost-of-living

It seems mad that it is happening now, a lot of the price increases have yet to really bite.

[spygirl]

11 hours ago, Boon said:

Some trending stuff on Mumsnet:

https://www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/4520278-To-have-cried-in-asda

https://www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/4520282-To-think-rent-is-so-bloody-unfair

https://www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/4520185-Are-we-taking-bets-yet-on-when-mass-civil-unrest-will-begin-re-Cost-of-living

It seems mad that it is happening now, a lot of the price increases have yet to really bite.

Same as 'credit crunch'

Load of daft useless lefties spinnign the news.

Credit crunch was biggest recession and the destruction of UK banking sector by Browns cretinous credit bybbl3e.

Cost of living crisis - ifs the unfixed Browns TCs/Labour migration policy causing huge UKGOV spend.

Fix -

- NO access to benefits by migrants.

- No access to free public services - NHS, school -for migrants.

- UC requires 38h for people with kids over 11.

- Housing benefit capped at 600/m.

EXPLAINED: Why Switzerland has escaped the global spike in costs of living

Across the globe, inflation has hit its highest rate for decades in several countries, whereas Switzerland has been largely spared. Why?

https://www.thelocal.com/20220401/explained-how-has-switzerland-escaped-hikes-in-the-cost-of-living/

In March 2022, Switzerland recorded an inflation rate of 2.4 percent. While this is no doubt concerning by Swiss historical standards and is the highest level for a decade, it pales in comparison with inflation rates elsewhere. 

Spain’s rate of 9.8 percent inflation is the highest for 37 years. 

Germany is currently struggling under an inflation rate of 7.3 percent, which is the highest since reunification. 

Denmark has seen an increase of 4.2 percent, while in the US, inflation is currently at 7.9 percent.

[haroldshand]

17 hours ago, AWW said:

Similar for me, albeit I'm nowhere near retirement age. As things stand, I could lose my job and maintain my current standard of living for 5+ years. Or I could buy a nice house in my OK area of north London (which would require roughly £250k deposit and result in a £70k stamp duty charge) and leave myself with less than a year's living expenses and no money to invest in other assets. Easy decision to make.

My first house at 22  and the second house  after was pretty full on effort wise for several years and then things eased, that I can justify on the life work balance scales. These days I am watching couples on two wages taking on shitholes for first homes with decades of struggling  decades ahead, that's not worth it in my thinking.

We all need a roof over ahead and for most of us there is no quick fixes, but if it totally robs you of life then fuck that

[haroldshand]

4 hours ago, spygirl said:

Same as 'credit crunch'

Load of daft useless lefties spinnign the news.

Credit crunch was biggest recession and the destruction of UK banking sector by Browns cretinous credit bybbl3e.

Cost of living crisis - ifs the unfixed Browns TCs/Labour migration policy causing huge UKGOV spend.

Fix -

- NO access to benefits by migrants.

- No access to free public services - NHS, school -for migrants.

- UC requires 38h for people with kids over 11.

- Housing benefit capped at 600/m.

EXPLAINED: Why Switzerland has escaped the global spike in costs of living

Across the globe, inflation has hit its highest rate for decades in several countries, whereas Switzerland has been largely spared. Why?

https://www.thelocal.com/20220401/explained-how-has-switzerland-escaped-hikes-in-the-cost-of-living/

In March 2022, Switzerland recorded an inflation rate of 2.4 percent. While this is no doubt concerning by Swiss historical standards and is the highest level for a decade, it pales in comparison with inflation rates elsewhere. 

Spain’s rate of 9.8 percent inflation is the highest for 37 years. 

Germany is currently struggling under an inflation rate of 7.3 percent, which is the highest since reunification. 

Denmark has seen an increase of 4.2 percent, while in the US, inflation is currently at 7.9 percent.

I lot of these "struggling mothers" seem to be girls who had kid/s while on welfare and outside a strong relationship and more often no relationship at all who seem shocked that life is tough for them and "nobody is helping them".

It has just become so ingrained in society now

[Axeman123]

18 hours ago, Boon said:

Some trending stuff on Mumsnet:

https://www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/4520278-To-have-cried-in-asda

https://www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/4520282-To-think-rent-is-so-bloody-unfair

https://www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/4520185-Are-we-taking-bets-yet-on-when-mass-civil-unrest-will-begin-re-Cost-of-living

It seems mad that it is happening now, a lot of the price increases have yet to really bite.

Since MN postings are pretty much quoted verbatim by newspapers, and cited as evidence by charities, I would be extremely suspicious of any concerted narrative that emerges there - especially when it dovetails nicely with varoius do-gooder talking points etc.

How very cynical of me etc.

[HousePriceMania]

Asking prices still powering ahead while supply stays very low but slightly increasing

 

 

Scotland stil showing a fall from peak prices last year, everywhere else pretty much up 3% mom, up12% yoy with supply up 5% mom but supply down 30-50% from peak.

 

So much for rising mortgage rates stopping price rises.  The UK housing bubble is out of control.