The Great Taking - book, interviews, discussion, what next?

[Heart's Ease]

As first highlighted on the credit deflation thread, the 'The Great Taking' book by David Rogers Webb is being picked up by finance/macro podcasts. A thread to gather relevant information.

Link to free pdf below:

https://thegreattaking.com/

_----------------------------

 

AI summary of the book:

Financial crises are deliberately caused

– Velocity of Money Collapses Prior to Crises: The velocity of money, which measures how often a unit of currency circulates in the economy, collapsed prior to major financial crises like the Great Depression. This suggests the crises are predictable and avoidable.

– Central Banks Tighten Conditions Despite Weakness: In the lead up to financial panics, central banks like the Federal Reserve tightened conditions and allowed banks to fail, despite having power to provide liquidity and avert runs on banks. This deliberate policy worsened crises. 

– Disinformation Campaigns Confuse Public: Government statistics were deliberately corrupted and false narratives promoted in the media to hide economic weakness, fuel bubbles, and confuse the public prior to engineered crashes.

Securities Ownership Has Been Undermined 

– Dematerialization Enables Confiscation: The process of eliminating paper stock certificates, advocated by the CIA in the 1960s, enabled pooling of securities and weakened investor protections. This allowed client assets to be taken by creditors.

– Security Entitlement Replaces Ownership: Legal reforms like changes to the Uniform Commercial Code replaced ownership of securities with weakened “security entitlements” that provide little property rights protection in insolvency.

– Collateral Plundered via CSDs and ICSDs: Central Securities Depositories and International Central Securities Depositories were developed to increase mobility of collateral into the derivatives complex for plunder during crises.

All Assets Will Be Confiscated and Citizens Enslaved

– Bank Holidays Allow Selective Closures: As during the Great Depression, upcoming “bank holidays” will selectively close banks and confiscate deposits, eliminating resistance and funneling assets to elites.

– Derivatives System Concentrates Risks: The enormous derivatives complex concentrates systemic risk in undercapitalized clearinghouses and banks designed to collapse, triggering bail-ins that seize client assets.

– Central Bank Digital Currencies Impose Total Control: The elimination of cash and imposition of digital currencies will allow unelected central banks to monitor all transactions and engineer conditions that can forcibly divest all property.

Those are the key themes and concepts I gathered from my reading of The Great Taking. Let me know if you would like me to elaborate on any part of the summary further.

Prologue

• The author has worked in finance and investing for many years and came to realize that major economic crises are intentionally caused by a secretive group of powerful people who control central banks and the financial system. Their aim is to consolidate power and control humanity through orchestrated economic turmoil and deprivation.
• The plan involves dematerializing securities so they exist only digitally, eliminating personal ownership rights. This allows assets to be seized easily in a crisis. Legal constructs like “security entitlements” have removed property rights globally.
• Collapse in monetary velocity, like in the 1930s depression, signals the end of a debt cycle. This collapse is again underway, likely motivating the “Great Reset” plan for a new global economic system benefiting the few. The author aims to explain the hidden machinations leading to another “Great Taking” of public wealth.

1. Introduction

• Velocity of money has collapsed, just as before major crises in the early 1900s and 1930s. Today’s velocity is lower than during the Great Depression.
• When money printing fails to create growth, velocity drops. The Fed has created epic bubbles disconnected from the real economy. Velocity won’t recover, presaging an unavoidable depression and “Great Taking” of collateral.

1. Dematerialization

• Eliminating paper securities in favor of digital “book-entry” systems was a key first step, orchestrated globally by central bankers and governments. This allowed easy confiscation of securities.

III. Security Entitlement

• Securities no longer confer ownership rights. The public has only weak contractual claims that offer no protection in insolvency. meanwhile, laws affirm certain “protected” creditors can seize assets instantly.
• Legal changes have eliminated centuries of property rights. Publicly owned securities are encumbered for derivatives speculation. Trillions in losses will allow mass seizure of collateral.

1. Harmonization

• Governments and regulators have pushed to expand collateral for derivatives and remove legal uncertainties globally through laws, treaties and linkage of clearing systems.
• Local laws upholding investor ownership have been overridden. EU documents show the objectives are increasing collateral assets and legal certainty for creditors.

1. Collateral Management

• New systems optimize using all securities as collateral. Cross-border sweeps to CCPs are ready for the coming crash. This engineered “demand for collateral” facilitates the Great Taking.

1. Safe Harbor

• Bankruptcy law changes protect derivatives counterparties. This affirmed the 2008 seizures of client assets by creditors like JPMorgan were legally valid, cementing the plot.

VII. Central Clearing Parties

• Undercapitalized CCPs are designed to fail in a crisis. New entities will immediately take collateral, including from segregated accounts. Quotes confirm the CCP construct guarantees this outcome.

VIII. Bank Holiday

• As in 1933, closures will consolidate banking and confiscate deposits. Crossed rivers of deposits into derivatives subsidiaries allow separate failures. CBDC will restore payments under total surveillance.

1. The Great Deflation

• Persistent deflation ensures debts can’t be repaid after the “Everything Bubble” pops, facilitating mass seizure of collateral and dramatic increase in centralized control. This is the plan.

1. Conclusion

• Trillions in losses from centrally engineered bubbles and crisis will allow the Great Taking through predetermined legal and financial mechanisms. But if humanity awakens to the scheme, we can avert this catastrophe.

The key points are that a centralized cabal has deliberately engineered global financial instability as a means to eventually implement mass confiscation of wealth, property and collateral during a controlled economic collapse. This will in turn allow unprecedented control over humanity. But exposure of their plan offers hope that the public can resist this outcome and regain control over the financial system if awareness spreads.

[Heart's Ease]

Here's a collection of the coverage so far: 

^ This is probably the most useful run through.

Also excellent coverage.

^ from 15 minutes in

 

 

 

 

^ and Ivor gets the first on camera interview with the author

[Axeman123]

I haven't read or watched any of that (I know that obviously limits the weight that should be given to my take on it)

That said, I just don't see the need in the modern world, eg: why steal a shareholding when the company profits can just be windfall taxed? I can totally see the (evil) logic of using economic cycles to asset strip the plebs historically though, eg the great depression effectively concentrated US farmland ownership and famously enabled seizure of some PMs. What assets do most people actually have these days though? A leasehold (or in the US condominium) flat, a pension that can be regulated into ESG etc: hardly anything of substance IMO and plenty of routes to shave the value down to almost nothing over time.

@Heart's Ease not meant personally, but the stuff about 

Quote

Central Banks Tighten Conditions Despite Weakness: In the lead up to financial panics, central banks like the Federal Reserve tightened conditions and allowed banks to fail, despite having power to provide liquidity and avert runs on banks. This deliberate policy worsened crises. 

sounds suspiciously like an MMT justification, ie appealing for early QE etc interventions. I actually agree the policy of intervention makes each sucessive crisis worse than the last though. More banks need to fail however IMO, not fewer.

[Heart's Ease]

6 minutes ago, Axeman123 said:

I haven't read or watched any of that (I know that obviously limits the weight that should be given to my take on it)

That said, I just don't see the need in the modern world, eg: why steal a shareholding when the company profits can just be windfall taxed? I can totally see the (evil) logic of using economic cycles to asset strip the plebs historically though, eg the great depression effectively concentrated US farmland ownership and famously enabled seizure of some PMs. What assets do most people actually have these days though? A leasehold (or in the US condominium) flat, a pension that can be regulated into ESG etc: hardly anything of substance IMO and plenty of routes to shave the value down to almost nothing over time.

@Heart's Ease not meant personally, but the stuff about 

sounds suspiciously like an MMT justification, ie appealing for early QE etc interventions. I actually agree the policy of intervention makes each sucessive crisis worse than the last though. More banks need to fail however IMO, not fewer.

Here's my tl;dr from the credit deflation thread.  The link and footnotes in the book check out - and Ivor has interviewed him so he's a real person.

"Book prologue

There's a lengthy contextualising prologue which reflects on the fortunes of the author's family (mechanical engineering) against the backdrop of WWI, great depression, post WWII boom, hollowing out of US manufacturing and rise of offshoring. Then into the author being a very successful fund manager who knows his Milton Friedman and his history and who notices things... 

Tl;dr the rest of the book

The collapse in the Velocity of Money is upon us. From history we know this is a very bad thing. When the "everything bubble" pumped up by the Fed pops as a result, we hit the Great Deflation (the inflation we see now is a result of all the money printing but it's deflation all the way).

As the Architects of the Great Reset have worked over decades to remove our property rights, we see everything in the paragraph pasted above top taken from us. We will own nothing and be happy that we have a CBDC to control us at a subsistence level of survival. We must prepare accordingly."

If that doesn't whet your appetite...! 

[Harley]

10 hours ago, Heart's Ease said:

Here's a collection of the coverage so far: 

^ This is probably the most useful run through.

Also excellent coverage.

^ from 15 minutes in

 

 

 

 

^ and Ivor gets the first on camera interview with the author

Ah, my bad.  I thought Parallel Mike, who was on Palisades Radio discussing the book, actually wrote it.  That was not made very clear to me.  A useful clarification for me.

Edited October 3, 2023 by Harley

[Harley]

I mentioned this stuff in regards securities, pensions, etc some years ago.  Even had a related thread.  I also mentioned at the time the whole set up regarding ETFs, funds, depositary receipts, etc.  That is, the risk is much wider (and each more localised, therefore not such "a big deal") than just "them" taking all your stuff.

Edited October 3, 2023 by Harley

[Harley]

9 hours ago, Axeman123 said:

I haven't read or watched any of that (I know that obviously limits the weight that should be given to my take on it)

Yes it does! 

[Harley]

A key point is all this is an issue to some extent regardless whether it's a conspiracy or not.  Cyber attacks, infrastructure failures, companies going bust, failing orgs doing wierd things  etc.

An allied point is not to treat this as a binary event.  In risk analysis you look at the magnitude of an adverse event as well as its probability.  Worse case, it's near game over so even a small probability makes it a serious threat worthy of countermeasures.

[dnb24]

https://jjffh.com/tribute/details/834/William-Dentzer-Jr/obituary.html
 

Bill Dentzer mentioned in the book- died in 2021. His obituary- is eye opening, his death also crosses into the covid thread

[Heart's Ease]

12 hours ago, dnb24 said:

https://jjffh.com/tribute/details/834/William-Dentzer-Jr/obituary.html
 

Bill Dentzer mentioned in the book- died in 2021. His obituary- is eye opening, his death also crosses into the covid thread

CIA, VP Rockefeller, DTC. Thanks for sharing. A v interesting person...

[Heart's Ease]

Ivor on X.

 

[Heart's Ease]

I'm going to try to tease a few of the key things in the book out. An Econ 101 work in progress to help me distill down what's in my head. Will end up being a few posts.

---------------

Exter's Pyramid

Exter's Pyramid is often used to illustrate the risks and size of various asset classes. Exter was an economist and on the Board of Governors of the US Federal Reserve.  (Just learned he was also an advisor to Fed Chair Paul Volcker, so he knew his inflationary onions, so to speak).

In times of crisis Exter posited that the pyramid pancaked down, into the base.  Here's his original pyramid with 3rd World Debt at the top:

The pyramid we are used to seeing today has lost the palm trees and looks more like this:

3rd World Debt has been replaced by Derivatives and Unfunded Government Liabilities.

Derivatives

The author's definition: "Derivatives are financial contracts on everything imaginable and even
unimaginable for most of us. They may be modeled on real things, but
are not the real things themselves." 

Parallel Mike simplifies it even further: "a bet". 

In the book David Rogers Webb talks about how the 2008 crash occurred partly because of the huge appetite for Asset Backed Securities. These pooled together income generating assets of personal and commercial loans (mortgage, car, small business) and once packaged up and sold as a security to investors, the income from the repayments made paid an interest to the security holder.

This worked fine for the good stuff, but the lower grade bundles made up of loans to the unemployed and liar loans/Northern Rock style 125% mortgages to anyone who could fog a mirror were harder for the issuers to sell.  Enter Credit Default Obligations which sliced and diced the different tranches of ABSs on the basis of higher risk=higher reward.  

In 2008, when the underlying mortgages started to default, the value of the CDOs plummeted. The contagion led to the collapse of several banks and financial institutions. See The Big Short.

The current derivatives market is big.  A rough estimate (The Bank of International Settlements (BIS) 2021) puts the gross market value of all derivatives at $12.4bn. Total notional amount $600bn. 

Unfunded Government Liabilities 

For the UK the most recent ones figures I can find on the unfunded Government Liabilities are:

"At the end of 2018, accrued-to-date gross pension liabilities of UK pension providers in respect of employment-related (workplace) pensions and state pensions are estimated to have been £8.9 trillion, compared with £7.6 trillion at the end of 2015¹. The liabilities of UK pension providers are also the entitlements of households in the UK and abroad.

In 2018, pension liabilities of central and local government comprised:

• £4.8 trillion of state pension entitlements (224% of 2018 gross domestic product (GDP))
• unfunded defined benefit workplace pension entitlements for public sector employees estimated at £1.2 trillion (55% of GDP)
• funded defined benefit workplace pension entitlements for public sector employees worth £413 billion (19% of GDP)"

https://www.ons.gov.uk/economy/nationalaccounts/uksectoraccounts/articles/pensionsinthenationalaccountsafullerpictureoftheuksfundedandunfundedpensionobligations/2018

USA unfunded liabilities (social security and Medicare) according to the US Debt clock: $194 trillion. 

https://www.usdebtclock.org/

One last figure for this post - IMF projected global GDP for 2023 is $105 trillion.

[Harley]

Anyone signed up to any of Parallel Mike's offerings  I'm tempted. My issue is £5 a month here and £2 a month there, etc soon adds up.  I've started to listen to the free bits of his podcasts to get a feel.

Edited October 7, 2023 by Harley

[Heart's Ease]

6 minutes ago, Harley said:

Anyone signed up to any of Parallel Mike's offerings  I'm tempted. My issue is £5 a month here and £2 a month there, etc soon adds up.  I've started to listen to the free bits of his podcasts to get a feel.

I'm working my way through his free podcasts then I've seen a yearly one off £99? I look at what I'm given for free by some of these guys and think of the £££'s I've spent on book and DVDs over the years...I'll probably splurge next year. His content is right up my street.

[Harley]

25 minutes ago, Heart's Ease said:

..... His content is right up my street.

I'm hoping it's more than the groundhog day we are faced with most of the time.  Poking all this shite with a stick, using up our energies on this rather than setting about the far harder task of actually doing something significant about it.  I am hopeful.  Meanwhile, most seem content (using all sorts of gymnastics) to suffer this shite with the comfort of just knowing they were right. 

Edited October 7, 2023 by Harley

[Jay]

3 hours ago, Harley said:

I'm hoping it's more than the groundhog day we are faced with most of the time.  Poking all this shite with a stick, using up our energies on this rather than setting about the far harder task of actually doing something significant about it.  I am hopeful.  Meanwhile, most seem content (using all sorts of gymnastics) to suffer this shite with the comfort of just knowing they were right. 

Interesting…it is clear that you are a practical man with training and further being involved in the community..I admire that you help with the church..

It is quite difficult to accept that the structure we have been living in is eventually going to cause us great damage..times change and it sometimes is difficult to see the change if it happens slowly..I still am not convinced about it but have made plans..diversification and a plane ticket..

thinking of a collapse in lifestyle and living standards is something we have not endured for a very long time..but I really appreciate all the views and advice in this area just in case it does happen..

[Harley]

1 hour ago, Jay said:

Interesting…it is clear that you are a practical man with training and further being involved in the community..I admire that you help with the church..

It is quite difficult to accept that the structure we have been living in is eventually going to cause us great damage..times change and it sometimes is difficult to see the change if it happens slowly..I still am not convinced about it but have made plans..diversification and a plane ticket..

thinking of a collapse in lifestyle and living standards is something we have not endured for a very long time..but I really appreciate all the views and advice in this area just in case it does happen..

Yes, at the worser end of the curve.  I'd stress there is a plethora of possibilities, no binary this or that, so any defense needs to be broad and proportionate.  A risk adjusted (expected probabilistic) approach.  People have been trained to think binary, mainly out of necessity (e.g. to cope with apparent (not always real) complexity) and because tbh it's the lazy, low IQ, way out.  We each need to nurture our personal Overton Windows and life experiences help here.  Regardless getting off the couch is hard for us all and we'd rather play mind games than do that.  Like the yapper in the warm pub versus the fecked guy on the hill looking down on the apparent sweetness of it all.  Hard times, judiciously chosen or not, make hard men.

PS:  Likely no more than my training, gained in the multiple diverse roles I've had in my life.  And I help the church not because I go but because it's valued by the community and in doing so I'm showing I value the community.

Edited October 7, 2023 by Harley

[wherebee]

15 hours ago, Harley said:

I'm hoping it's more than the groundhog day we are faced with most of the time.  Poking all this shite with a stick, using up our energies on this rather than setting about the far harder task of actually doing something significant about it.  I am hopeful.  Meanwhile, most seem content (using all sorts of gymnastics) to suffer this shite with the comfort of just knowing they were right. 

I know what you mean, but here in Australia the ground is not yet fertile for change of the type needed.  I could bang my head against a wall now and result in nothing.  I'd rather help subtly those already inside pushing for change, and then (my guess is 25-6-7 when jab damage is blown open), actively start lobbying/standing for political positions.

I'm on an official local body here, have been for some time.  I'd say 40% of the members are still died in the wool open borders/trans/jab/ukraine fanatics.  As they come to terms with reality, they'll be open to change - not now.  Note, it's down from higher 3 years ago; for example I know the Chairman has jab damage which others don't know about - he deffo sees me as trustworthy now.

Yes, we 'suffer this shite' but sometimes you have no choice. What would you rather be - the bloke opposed to Nazism who gets arrested and executed in 1941, or the new non nazi burgermeister in 1946 who rebuilds your town and sets up 50 years of peace and prosperity?

[Harley]

1 hour ago, wherebee said:

I know what you mean, but here in Australia the ground is not yet fertile for change of the type needed.  I could bang my head against a wall now and result in nothing.  I'd rather help subtly those already inside pushing for change, and then (my guess is 25-6-7 when jab damage is blown open), actively start lobbying/standing for political positions.

I'm on an official local body here, have been for some time.  I'd say 40% of the members are still died in the wool open borders/trans/jab/ukraine fanatics.  As they come to terms with reality, they'll be open to change - not now.  Note, it's down from higher 3 years ago; for example I know the Chairman has jab damage which others don't know about - he deffo sees me as trustworthy now.

Yes, we 'suffer this shite' but sometimes you have no choice. What would you rather be - the bloke opposed to Nazism who gets arrested and executed in 1941, or the new non nazi burgermeister in 1946 who rebuilds your town and sets up 50 years of peace and prosperity?

I meant doing something and talking about things to personally to protect your assets, etc rather than just just be stuck on posting the same old stuff, etc. 

Most folk seemed stuck on the problem (endlessly and only focussing on that) rather than moving on to the (harder) solutions.

I thought that was clear, Parallel Mike seems to be about doing stuff for yourself, not being some sort of campaigner as you describe.

I'm happy to stay grey until the time.  I have no desire to be a hero and collect more medals.

I know all about Australia 'cause I watched Alone Australia.  Although my assessment improved somewhat after watching Alone UK!

Edited October 8, 2023 by Harley

[wherebee]

13 minutes ago, Harley said:

I meant doing something and talking about things to personally to protect your assets, etc rather than just just be stuck on posting the same old stuff, etc. 

Most folk seemed stuck on the problem (endlessly and only focussing on that) rather than moving on to the (harder) solutions.

I thought that was clear, Parallel Mike seems to be about doing stuff for yourself, not being some sort of campaigner as you describe.

I'm happy to stay grey until the time.  I have no desire to be a hero and collect more medals.

I know all about Australia 'cause I watched Alone Australia.  Although my assessment improved somewhat after watching Alone UK!

Ah, I see.

 

I think I've done about all I can given my resources.  Have invested in the house so it is as energy neutral as possible, avoiding the need for heating/cooling as much as possible.  Additional space for the kids to stay in as long as they want.  Planted food and herb supplies which are now coming into maturity (the pear tree this year is covered in blossoms like an explosion).  Developed networks in local community as much as possible.  Diversified the family income to multiple sources, not just one employer.  Investment assets are in companies around the world to minimise currency/seizure risks.  No debt, of any type; completely free on that front.  Still have a little bit of money overseas in other Banks.  Having multiple free bank accounts across aussie banks in case one closes us out. etc etc.

The only next leg up would be a larger smallholding further out, but the wife and kids wouldn't go for that (plus we'd lose 50k at least on any move due to costs).  Ideally, I'd like 2-3 million to have 2-3 acres here or in NZ, and a million in the Bank/buried under the water tank.

[Harley]

15 minutes ago, wherebee said:

Ah, I see.

 

I think I've done about all I can given my resources.  Have invested in the house so it is as energy neutral as possible, avoiding the need for heating/cooling as much as possible.  Additional space for the kids to stay in as long as they want.  Planted food and herb supplies which are now coming into maturity (the pear tree this year is covered in blossoms like an explosion).  Developed networks in local community as much as possible.  Diversified the family income to multiple sources, not just one employer.  Investment assets are in companies around the world to minimise currency/seizure risks.  No debt, of any type; completely free on that front.  Still have a little bit of money overseas in other Banks.  Having multiple free bank accounts across aussie banks in case one closes us out. etc etc.

The only next leg up would be a larger smallholding further out, but the wife and kids wouldn't go for that (plus we'd lose 50k at least on any move due to costs).  Ideally, I'd like 2-3 million to have 2-3 acres here or in NZ, and a million in the Bank/buried under the water tank.

Sounds very good and I wish more would discuss such things (although not all!) rather than just go round and round poking at the problem as mentioned.  A healthy balance too - no need to go off the deep end (although nice to game "what if"). 

I was always interested in your snippets about the house, etc.  A great investment, being close to the source, etc.  We've been doing similar - invest to avoid having to spend anything to start with, especially anything out of taxed income. 

Living where you do, plus your expat experiences, must help frame things better for you.

PS:  Careful hiding cash like that.  We did once then moved and are still not sure if we took it, especially when we saw the owner had a new bathroom installed!

Edited October 8, 2023 by Harley

[wherebee]

1 hour ago, Harley said:

Living where you do, plus your expat experiences, must help frame things better for you.

PS:  Careful hiding cash like that.  We did once then moved and are still not sure if we took it, especially when we saw the owner had a new bathroom installed!

ahahah I'm a long way from having the spare moolah to hide, plus I'd like a bigger place to do it, otherwise it's easy to find.

Re the bank accounts, I think that's an easy one anyone can do.  Have half a dozen accounts (as long as free banking) and move money easily as the situations demand.  I just found that one bank here (UBANK) pays 5.00% instant access, as long as you pay 200 bucks in a month.  Easy to move a bit around between the accounts so that is now getting 5% on a lump sum with trickles in each month from another account.  What's not to like?  3% more than any other transactional retail account I could see, and still backed by one of the big 4 aussie banks.

Re the house, it's taken 4 years since we really started to work on it for the new world.  Give you an example -it's been unusually cold here this week, down from 25-28C to daytime 15-16, and as low as 6-8 overnight.  No need for heating though, have burnt the remnants of the hedge I chopped down 3 years ago in the stove, which has heated all the necessary.  Zero cost....

We also have a good routine now of opening the curtains in the front first thing, gets the sun in, etc.  Little things make a big difference to costs.

[Sugarlips]

9 minutes ago, wherebee said:

ahahah I'm a long way from having the spare moolah to hide, plus I'd like a bigger place to do it, otherwise it's easy to find.

Re the bank accounts, I think that's an easy one anyone can do.  Have half a dozen accounts (as long as free banking) and move money easily as the situations demand.  I just found that one bank here (UBANK) pays 5.00% instant access, as long as you pay 200 bucks in a month.  Easy to move a bit around between the accounts so that is now getting 5% on a lump sum with trickles in each month from another account.  What's not to like?  3% more than any other transactional retail account I could see, and still backed by one of the big 4 aussie banks.

Re the house, it's taken 4 years since we really started to work on it for the new world.  Give you an example -it's been unusually cold here this week, down from 25-28C to daytime 15-16, and as low as 6-8 overnight.  No need for heating though, have burnt the remnants of the hedge I chopped down 3 years ago in the stove, which has heated all the necessary.  Zero cost....

We also have a good routine now of opening the curtains in the front first thing, gets the sun in, etc.  Little things make a big difference to costs.

I know these guys are generally discussing securities but how far does this go? Land title rights has a been a bubbling topic in Oz for the last little while but I haven’t drilled into it enough yet.

Given the topic is ownership rights, do you own a paper certificate of title as proof of ownership to your property or is it electronic? 

If you do own the paper title, how confident are you of your legal ownership in this new arrangement that’s being exposed?

Defending the property from intruders (stare or otherwise) is one thing but no longer having legal property ownership is a new ballgame (for me anyway).

 

I ask with a stake in the game. Our country bolthole in the event of shtf scenarios is owned outright in our superfund but I’m pretty sure we’ve only ever been issued a digital title.

[wherebee]

6 minutes ago, Sugarlips said:

I know these guys are generally discussing securities but how far does this go? Land title rights has a been a bubbling topic in Oz for the last little while but I haven’t drilled into it enough yet.

Given the topic is ownership rights, do you own a paper certificate of title as proof of ownership to your property or is it electronic? 

If you do own the paper title, how confident are you of your legal ownership in this new arrangement that’s being exposed?

Defending the property from intruders (stare or otherwise) is one thing but no longer having legal property ownership is a new ballgame (for me anyway).

 

I ask with a stake in the game. Our country bolthole in the event of shtf scenarios is owned outright in our superfund but I’m pretty sure we’ve only ever been issued a digital title.

My deeds are held by ANZ (I only include that so you understand the lingo).  I'm going to ask them for a copy so I can keep it - I suspect that they have an electronic image, with hard copy maybe kept somewhere by Iron Mountain or similar; if all that goes up in smoke/crash.....

Holding the only version of the deed yourself brings some negatives, from memory - although I may have that confused with the UK.

If there was a great reset, perhaps the play would be that unless you have a copy, the assumption may be that the gvt will own and rent to you?  Although given Australians obsession with property, that would be the one thing which might actually cause a revolution.

I can't recall a previous time in history where house and land owned legally was taken without either war/tax seizure, or a dispute over ownership rights which was settled in court).  Even when a government acted like cunts (such as the union after the civil war victory), they still created an ownership transfer document.

[Sugarlips]

1 minute ago, wherebee said:

My deeds are held by ANZ (I only include that so you understand the lingo).  I'm going to ask them for a copy so I can keep it - I suspect that they have an electronic image, with hard copy maybe kept somewhere by Iron Mountain or similar; if all that goes up in smoke/crash.....

Holding the only version of the deed yourself brings some negatives, from memory - although I may have that confused with the UK.

If there was a great reset, perhaps the play would be that unless you have a copy, the assumption may be that the gvt will own and rent to you?  Although given Australians obsession with property, that would be the one thing which might actually cause a revolution.

I can't recall a previous time in history where house and land owned legally was taken without either war/tax seizure, or a dispute over ownership rights which was settled in court).  Even when a government acted like cunts (such as the union after the civil war victory), they still created an ownership transfer document.

Thanks, this seems to talk to what I’m referring to, it’s giving me no comfort though. 

https://bbvlegal.com.au/land-titles-changes-wa/

I’m in WA but I imagine VIC is very similar