How does Buy to Let END!

[sancho panza]

3 hours ago, With a crooked smile said:

Contacted by HSBC today (I have a current account, joint account and ISA with them).

Relaxing lending on BTL. Info below:

HSBC is increasing its maximum mortgage term to 40 years for buy to let, purchase, remortgaging and additional borrowing.

Second homes will no longer be limited to 30 years and can now be considered up to 40 years but residential applications on interest only products will remain capped at a 25-year maximum term. This will include part and part interest-only mortgages as well.

Interesting they're capping IO.Makes a lot of sense really.

There are some otehr markets with lifetime mortgages,switzerland is oneI think.

If I was HSBC I'd be doing the same to derisk the asset base especailly with regard to people who are solid from a risk perspective

I think the bigger abnks wil end up with much bigger marekts shares in 5/6 years time when theyve swallowed up the BS's excludign perhaos one or two.

[With a crooked smile]

3 minutes ago, sancho panza said:

There are some otehr markets with lifetime mortgages,switzerland is oneI think.

I think generally we are quite unaware of what other countries do. For example Sweden limits the maximum LTV that you can get for a bank for a mortgage.... But getting a top up massive unsecured loan on top to buy the house is "normal" ( this is according to a software developer I know, he's bought houses everywhere he's lived (Brighton, Sweden and Dallas, but not sold any of them when he's moved on.).

Edited August 30, 2023 by With a crooked smile

[spygirl]

Landlords want the media to stop using the term ‘landlord’

https://www.property118.com/landlords-want-the-media-to-stop-using-the-term-landlord/

The MFB survey reveals that most of the buy to let community (59%) would rather not be called ‘landlords’ in the media, as they feel it is a dated and derogatory term.

Some parts of the US media, such as NBC, have already stopped using the word ‘landlord’ after complaints from the buy-to-let sector.

In the UK, however, the term is still widely used and often associated with negative stories.

The MFB survey also asked the BTL community what they would like to be called instead of ‘landlords’.

The most popular option was ‘Small Housing Providers’ (43%), followed by ‘Landlords’ (36%) and other alternatives such as ‘Rental Accommodation Provider’ (7%).

I prefer the term - insolvent.

[One percent]

7 minutes ago, spygirl said:

Landlords want the media to stop using the term ‘landlord’

https://www.property118.com/landlords-want-the-media-to-stop-using-the-term-landlord/

The MFB survey reveals that most of the buy to let community (59%) would rather not be called ‘landlords’ in the media, as they feel it is a dated and derogatory term.

Some parts of the US media, such as NBC, have already stopped using the word ‘landlord’ after complaints from the buy-to-let sector.

In the UK, however, the term is still widely used and often associated with negative stories.

The MFB survey also asked the BTL community what they would like to be called instead of ‘landlords’.

The most popular option was ‘Small Housing Providers’ (43%), followed by ‘Landlords’ (36%) and other alternatives such as ‘Rental Accommodation Provider’ (7%).

I prefer the term - insolvent.

I prefer the term, ‘parasite’.  

[spygirl]

https://www.property118.com/generation-rent-appeals-to-mortgage-lenders-not-to-evict-tenants/comment-page-3/#comments

In a bid to safeguard tenants facing potential homelessness when a landlord falls into BTL mortgage arrears, one tenants’ rights group is urging mortgage lenders to uphold their ‘moral obligation’ not to evict tenants.

The call comes from Generation Rent and its chief executive, Ben Twomey, has written an open letter to the chief executives of four major mortgage providers.

In it, he urges them not to evict renters from properties owned by landlords who are struggling with defaulted mortgages.

The appeal comes as a response to the growing number of repossessions of landlords by lenders – a trend that looks set to grow in the coming months.

[spygirl]

2 million BTL mortgages currently active in the UK

There are around 2 million BTL mortgages currently active in the UK, according to UK Finance, but landlords are finding themselves in a tight financial position.

Comments are fun.

It would be a risky strategy for the lender.

If I was the borrower I would be asking for:

1. compensation for any interest and charges incurred during the tenancy,
2. compensation for damage/wear and tear to the property during the tenancy, and
3. compensation for any other reduction in market value during the period they decided to rent it to the tenants.

The lender should be actively marketing it for sale, in order to pay down the mortgage facility and cap the borrower's costs

 

It would be up to the lenders to ensure that they had insured against these risks (premium cost added to the borrower's debt of course!). It should be marketed, rather than rented, otherwise the borrower could contend that he has been unfairly prejudiced if the property drops in value between default and eventual sale.

 

 

hahaha the banks have ZERO interest in renters. Not their direct customer!

This foetus knows nothing. Why would any institution anyone want to even talk to GR let alone take their advice???

'Moral obligation' is he for real?

 

2m io btl ... 1m io resi .... lots of people with pants down.

Thing is, mass LL repo is a new thing.

What the gen rent foetus is doing is correct - not that the fuckwits have grasped it.

Ukgov dont want to see 2m households evicted - not the housing.

Equally the banks dont want to eviction 2m households - not that the courts would let them.

The banks will want to talk to 2m renters rather than the 500k - the renters have the votes.

, some process will be thrashed out.

And the LL will pay for it, via thier OO, pension and any other asset.

I like the idea that the bank has to bend over to get the best price for the LL. They have a use, simple, hands off process - out to 3 Charteed EAs, off to auction if nit sold in 3 months.

Some constructive advice for the LL - grease your arsehole with vaseline. You're going to get fucking reamed.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Ash4781b]

https://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/buytolet/article-12473141/amp/Buy-let-hotspots-earn-inflation-beating-income.html

 

“Some lenders are also tightening their affordability rules for landlords, which piles on even more pressure. These rules require landlords to show they can pay a higher mortgage rate and then make a higher income on top of that.

For example, last Wednesday, Santander increased its affordability rate by almost one percentage point, from 7.59 per cent to 8.52 per cent. 

That means that a landlord with a £100,000 buy-to-let mortgage would have to show they have a rental income of £994 a month – up from £885 as a result of the changes. 

Imogen Sporle, managing director at London-based Finanze Property, said: 'Contrary to popular belief landlords do not rub their hands together in glee as they increase their tenant's rent.

'They know this is a difficult time for many and increasing the rent could lose them the tenant altogether.

'But not increasing the rent could render the property unmortgageable, meaning the only option is to evict the tenant and sell up.'

Lewis Shaw, mortgage broker at Mansfield-based Shaw Financial Services, believes that rising interest rates make it impossible to make a profit from buy-to-let in most areas unless you own your investment properties outright or have a lot of equity.

'Unless you've got a 50 per cent deposit, in most parts of the country buy-to-let is dead,' he says.”

Blimey is it that bad? 50% deposit? I hadn’t appreciated some needed to raise rates or the property cannot be re-mortgaged?

It’s like they’ve all be herded into a pen and now it’s either stay and give money to Hmrc and the banks or exit market.

 

[AlfredTheLittle]

24 minutes ago, Ash4781b said:

 

'Unless you've got a 50 per cent deposit, in most parts of the country buy-to-let is dead,' he says.”

 

 

Even if you have a 100% deposit there's no point in BTL if you can get a similar amount or more in interest by just keeping your money in the bank, and if house prices are level or going down rather than rising. Hopefully more and more landlords will try to sell and house prices will keep dropping.

[One percent]

Just now, AlfredTheLittle said:

Even if you have a 100% deposit there's no point in BTL if you can get a similar amount or more in interest by just keeping your money in the bank, and if house prices are level or going down rather than rising. Hopefully more and more landlords will try to sell and house prices will keep dropping.

This is the game changer. Much more lucrative (and no hassle/risk) to have it in the bank   Couple that with a falling market, it’s heading for carnage. 

[Chewing Grass]

27 minutes ago, Ash4781b said:

That means that a landlord with a £100,000 buy-to-let mortgage would have to show they have a rental income of £994 a month – up from £885 as a result of the changes. 

Who the fuck would pay £1000 per month to live in a £100,000 house, or £2000 per month to live in a £200,000 house...

Cheapest terrace near me.

[One percent]

34 minutes ago, Ash4781b said:

https://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/buytolet/article-12473141/amp/Buy-let-hotspots-earn-inflation-beating-income.html

 

“Some lenders are also tightening their affordability rules for landlords, which piles on even more pressure. These rules require landlords to show they can pay a higher mortgage rate and then make a higher income on top of that.

For example, last Wednesday, Santander increased its affordability rate by almost one percentage point, from 7.59 per cent to 8.52 per cent. 

That means that a landlord with a £100,000 buy-to-let mortgage would have to show they have a rental income of £994 a month – up from £885 as a result of the changes. 

Imogen Sporle, managing director at London-based Finanze Property, said: 'Contrary to popular belief landlords do not rub their hands together in glee as they increase their tenant's rent.

'They know this is a difficult time for many and increasing the rent could lose them the tenant altogether.

'But not increasing the rent could render the property unmortgageable, meaning the only option is to evict the tenant and sell up.'

Lewis Shaw, mortgage broker at Mansfield-based Shaw Financial Services, believes that rising interest rates make it impossible to make a profit from buy-to-let in most areas unless you own your investment properties outright or have a lot of equity.

'Unless you've got a 50 per cent deposit, in most parts of the country buy-to-let is dead,' he says.”

Blimey is it that bad? 50% deposit? I hadn’t appreciated some needed to raise rates or the property cannot be re-mortgaged?

It’s like they’ve all be herded into a pen and now it’s either stay and give money to Hmrc and the banks or exit market.

 

It’s almost as if landlords want to take all the profit whilst wanting the tenants to shoulder all the risk.  Good luck with that as a long term strategy.  

[Wight Flight]

1 hour ago, Chewing Grass said:

Who the fuck would pay £1000 per month to live in a £100,000 house, or £2000 per month to live in a £200,000 house...

Cheapest terrace near me.

Nobody. You can usually get a £400k house for that.

[spygirl]

9 hours ago, Chewing Grass said:

Who the fuck would pay £1000 per month to live in a £100,000 house, or £2000 per month to live in a £200,000 house...

Cheapest terrace near me.

What council pays LHA 1k/m to live in a 100k house?

None.

 

[PETR4]

18 hours ago, spygirl said:

The banks will want to talk to 2m renters rather than the 500k - the renters have the votes.

, some process will be thrashed out.

I think a Government bailout along the line as below will be the route out.

Goverment set ups national social housing company and buys the entire interst only portfolio from the banks and building societies at face value. Banks are bailed and recapitalised and the Landlords lose any equity they have.

The bail out is funded by bond issues.

House prices roughly halve. Mortgage free owners and old money renters not impacted.

National social housing company then rents to the insitu renters and sells the houses back to renters at new lower prices. Banks make money on new loans.

Government gains favour with the large renting voting block, only recent high loan to value buyers take a hit. New first time buyers happy with lower prices.

 

[spygirl]

26 minutes ago, PETR4 said:

I think a Government bailout along the line as below will be the route out.

Goverment set ups national social housing company and buys the entire interst only portfolio from the banks and building societies at face value. Banks are bailed and recapitalised and the Landlords lose any equity they have.

The bail out is funded by bond issues.

House prices roughly halve. Mortgage free owners and old money renters not impacted.

National social housing company then rents to the insitu renters and sells the houses back to renters at new lower prices. Banks make money on new loans.

Government gains favour with the large renting voting block, only recent high loan to value buyers take a hit. New first time buyers happy with lower prices.

 

There will be no bail of of IO BTL.

Most of PRS IO BTL stock is unsuitbale for LHAs.

And LHAs are actually private orgs. They would need to buy the houses at amrket rate from the banks.

That aint happening.

Again, there is no bail out.

The baks will take every pennyof assets from LL then take a loss.

There is no sytsmically important UK banks that has a problem with IO BTL, which is mainyl concreated in fuckwits like Nationwider and smaller BS.

If the banks n BS cannot take the hit then theyll bust.

 

 

[spygirl]

Beyond comedy and into the surreal now

https://www.property118.com/landlords-leaving-in-droves-due-to-tax-policies/

An industry body is urging all politicians to have an urgent re-think on tax policy for landlords.

The Association of Inventory Clerks claims the recent tax rule changes are a major reason why landlords are leaving the private rented rector.

The industry body argues that landlords are being treated unfairly over current tax arrangements. In England and Northern Ireland, at the point of purchase, landlords must pay an extra 3% of Stamp Duty Land Tax on any buy-to-let

https://theaiic.co.uk/about-us/

About the Association of Independent Inventory Clerks

Since the AIIC was established in 1996 its aim has been to ensure that every landlord, tenant and agent in the UK is aware of the importance of the inventory process and the benefits of employing an independent, professional independent inventory clerk.

The AIIC ensures that proper information and training is available for all members to provide the best possible service.

[Chewing Grass]

2 minutes ago, spygirl said:

Beyond comedy and into the surreal now

https://www.property118.com/landlords-leaving-in-droves-due-to-tax-policies/

An industry body is urging all politicians to have an urgent re-think on tax policy for landlords.

The Association of Inventory Clerks claims the recent tax rule changes are a major reason why landlords are leaving the private rented rector.

The industry body argues that landlords are being treated unfairly over current tax arrangements. In England and Northern Ireland, at the point of purchase, landlords must pay an extra 3% of Stamp Duty Land Tax on any buy-to-let

I assume its this lot of self-serving, parasitic, wankers.

Established 1996 - Subscriptions Please

https://theaiic.co.uk/

[spygirl]

https://www.thenationalnews.com/world/uk-news/2023/09/04/london-landlords-nearing-crisis-point-amid-remortgage-crunch/

Landlords who plan to remortgage fixed-term loans face monthly payment increases of up to 80 per cent.

New data from Dashly, which monitors more than £100 billion ($126 billion) of mortgages, shows that landlords in London renewing their mortgages this autumn and next spring will be an average £6,384 worse off each year.

Based on a sample of 1,000 buy-to-let mortgages that expire between the end of September and the end of April next year, Dashly calculates, assuming that the best deal is acquired, the average monthly mortgage payment for London landlords is likely to rise from £662 to £1,194.

[spygirl]

But they won't remortgage. Tghy can't.

They wont have rental cover.

Theyll get even mire reamed on the Svr.

 

[One percent]

7 minutes ago, spygirl said:

https://www.thenationalnews.com/world/uk-news/2023/09/04/london-landlords-nearing-crisis-point-amid-remortgage-crunch/

Landlords who plan to remortgage fixed-term loans face monthly payment increases of up to 80 per cent.

New data from Dashly, which monitors more than £100 billion ($126 billion) of mortgages, shows that landlords in London renewing their mortgages this autumn and next spring will be an average £6,384 worse off each year.

Based on a sample of 1,000 buy-to-let mortgages that expire between the end of September and the end of April next year, Dashly calculates, assuming that the best deal is acquired, the average monthly mortgage payment for London landlords is likely to rise from £662 to £1,194.

Can’t they just put the rent up?   

[onlyme]

 

The rate at which BTL loans are being paid off is pretty meagre and the trend rate is falling.

 

https://www.ft.com/content/4a533f2a-0303-417c-a868-593ddcdf76cf

Outstanding BTL mortgages are falling as landlords pay off their debt or sell

Number of outstanding UK buy-to-let mortgages (mn)

 

 

 

[AWW]

On 30/08/2023 at 15:46, With a crooked smile said:

Contacted by HSBC today (I have a current account, joint account and ISA with them).

Relaxing lending on BTL. Info below:

HSBC is increasing its maximum mortgage term to 40 years for buy to let, purchase, remortgaging and additional borrowing.

Second homes will no longer be limited to 30 years and can now be considered up to 40 years but residential applications on interest only products will remain capped at a 25-year maximum term. This will include part and part interest-only mortgages as well.

What's the maximum age for a 40 year term though? Must be 30, no?

[With a crooked smile]

2 minutes ago, AWW said:

What's the maximum age for a 40 year term though? Must be 30, no?

I wondered that to? 

[AWW]

2 minutes ago, With a crooked smile said:

I wondered that to? 

Whatever it is, I imagine the age will be one at which most are struggling to save for their own house, never mind getting into BTL.

Seems a bizarre concept but what do I know. HSBC obviously see a market for it.

[With a crooked smile]

2 minutes ago, AWW said:

Whatever it is, I imagine the age will be one at which most are struggling to save for their own house, never mind getting into BTL.

Seems a bizarre concept but what do I know. HSBC obviously see a market for it.

I know BTL mortgage max age varies by lender. For most mainstream lenders its 70 to 85 max. There are some that don't care. Handlesbanken have told me no max age for them.