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Credit deflation and the reflation cycle to come (part 5)


spunko

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Just now, Long time lurking said:

Yep and the one they are paddling to is a busted flush because of what made them paddle to it for 

Whats so hard to understand 

The boat people don't understand "leads and lags"! 

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HousePriceMania
8 minutes ago, Loki said:

Surely you want to be as liquid as possible in inflation-protecting assets?

Sure, but buying a House for cash would be 1/5 of our net wealth and would allow us to focus on projecting ourselves further, need somewhere to bury the gold bars, maybe a price worth paying?

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Just now, HousePriceMania said:

Sure, but buying a House for cash would be 1/5 of our net wealth and would allow us to focus on projecting ourselves further, need somewhere to bury the gold bars, maybe a price worth paying?

Fair enough - you have a load more net wealth than me xD

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HousePriceMania
11 minutes ago, Loki said:

Fair enough - you have a load more net wealth than me xD

That's cause I didn't buy a House 😁

Good bye QE.

 

Hello new help scheme...that sounds like QE

 

 

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Long time lurking
1 minute ago, Loki said:

Right I see what you mean.   So taking into account DH forecast and the previous high looks like a multi decade "double top":ph34r:

Fuck knows it`s like the chicken and egg one that's before you take into account of whats happening in the BRICS but it`s the first time ever i`m thinking of jumping in ,i`ll wait until i see which way the £-$ is looking /going 

The fact that central banks everywhere are now buying might be telling the full Kitco video i posted yesterday is a must watch on that one ,but how many are buying just to keep their foreign reserves out of the SWIT system government bonds due to what happened to Russia or do they know something else like BOOM it`s all gone :ph34r:

Either way with inflation the way it`s looking it`s looking like  a good hedge in the medium term 

 

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Long time lurking
7 minutes ago, HousePriceMania said:

That's cause I didn't buy a House 😁

Good bye QE.

 

Hello new help scheme...that sounds like QE

 

 

Is that just a fancy way of saying reverse repo to infinity just like Japan ?

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HousePriceMania
1 minute ago, Long time lurking said:

Is that just a fancy way of saying reverse repo to infinity just like Japan ?

Sounds like that.

 

You can fool some of the People some of the time but you can Fool Americans all of the time 

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Long time lurking
6 minutes ago, HousePriceMania said:

Sounds like that.

 

You can fool some of the People some of the time but you can Fool Americans all of the time 

It`s going to be interesting to see what the $ dose 

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Quick questions for clarification on the whole SVB scenario:

1. The issue appears to be the 'run' on withdrawals AND the fact that they 'parked' their funds in 'safe' Long-term bonds; these being fine if held to maturity, but becoming an issue when customers want their funds now when their value would be lowered/distressed.

I am assuming they bought the LT bonds as the return would have been better when the yield curve wasn't inverted, if this correct?

 

2. Prior to suspension the SVB bonds were trading at distressed rate; Senior=45 cents on the $, Junior=12.5 cents on the $.

In this situation if you are fairly confident that the bank would be saved i.e. by bailing out by the Fed or a buy-out by someone else, would this a) be a good opportunity, and b) be what Howard Marks does as part of Oaktree Capitals approach?

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Long time lurking
3 minutes ago, MrXxxx said:

Quick questions for clarification on the whole SVB scenario:

1. The issue appears to be the 'run' on withdrawals AND the fact that they 'parked' their funds in 'safe' Long-term bonds; these being fine if held to maturity, but becoming an issue when customers want their funds now when their value would be lowered/distressed.

I am assuming they bought the LT bonds as the return would have been better when the yield curve wasn't inverted, if this correct?

 

2. Prior to suspension the SVB bonds were trading at distressed rate; Senior=45 cents on the $, Junior=12.5 cents on the $.

In this situation if you are fairly confident that the bank would be saved i.e. by bailing out by the Fed or a buy-out by someone else, would this a) be a good opportunity, and b) be what Howard Marks does as part of Oaktree Capitals approach?

Ten year bond @ 0.5% held to maturity @ 10% + inflation is why they are 45% discount ? 

What i can`t figure out is why they never sold them in the revers repos the FED have done i thought this was the whole purpose of those auctions which have amounted to Trillions in the last six months 

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1 hour ago, Long time lurking said:

Look at what the exchange rates were in 2010ish ? $1.70 -£ from the lows we seen recently almost parity ,just think what that means to gold prices if it went that way and you bought at todays exchange rate ,you would be looking at $2500+ just to break even 

Edit i should add on a buying oz for oz scale 

Not following.

If I bought an Oz today for £1552 ( $1867 @ 1.21USD to the pound) and the dollar fell to 1.70 USD to the pound but gold didn't budge, that would be equivalent to £1098/oz (and a nightmare loss!). However if gold simultaneously went to $2638/oz I would still get my £1552 back @1.70 USD to the pound.

If gold instead went to $3000 USD/oz, and the dollar fell to 1.50USD to the pound at the same time (DH numbers for illustration) that would be £2000/oz. It is a fair point that much of the move would just be dollar devaluation. Most people expect gold to move inversely to the dollar.

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11 minutes ago, Long time lurking said:

Is that just a fancy way of saying reverse repo to infinity just like Japan ?

Discount window is repo, not reverse repo - repo is I borrow cash from Fed, reverse repo is I lend cash to Fed.

I would like to see more detail on this before concluding anything - the tweet implies the bank repo's the bond, pays 4.75% rate to borrow the cash if prime credit (5.25% if secondary credit), Fed lends amount at par (100) rather than discounted MTM value (say 70).

What is not explained is the 'with no losses'. This would imply repo will roll over indefinitely until maturity of bond, bank gets par back and pays Fed back. Net cost to bank is yield on bond (say 2%) minus the repo rate on notional for the period remaining till maturity.

Globex doesn't open for another 45min I think so only have spread betters for how mkt is expected to react to this.

image.thumb.png.7f30ed287a381802ee96d35132c537e2.png

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12 minutes ago, MrXxxx said:

Quick questions for clarification on the whole SVB scenario:

1. The issue appears to be the 'run' on withdrawals AND the fact that they 'parked' their funds in 'safe' Long-term bonds; these being fine if held to maturity, but becoming an issue when customers want their funds now when their value would be lowered/distressed.

I am assuming they bought the LT bonds as the return would have been better when the yield curve wasn't inverted, if this correct?

 

2. Prior to suspension the SVB bonds were trading at distressed rate; Senior=45 cents on the $, Junior=12.5 cents on the $.

In this situation if you are fairly confident that the bank would be saved i.e. by bailing out by the Fed or a buy-out by someone else, would this a) be a good opportunity, and b) be what Howard Marks does as part of Oaktree Capitals approach?

1, The treasury bonds are to lower the risk profile of their assets, in theory, but weren't hedged in turn to protect against the rise in interest rates. This was effectively a bet on a pivot by the Federal Reserve. When it didn't play out in time, the VC community forced the bank run to force the Fed's hand.

2. This is called distressed asset investing, and Oaktree are an active player in that field. You can see Bill Ackman calling for bondholders to be bailed out, but equity holders to suffer their losses. It may be considered a good opportunity if you're confident Yellen's Treasury will bail out the queer communist ESG lobby, which seems plausible to me.

https://www.oaktreecapital.com/insights/insight-commentary/market-commentary/global-opportunity-knocks-the-evolution-of-distressed-investing

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Long time lurking
2 minutes ago, Axeman123 said:

f I bought an Oz today for £1552 ( $1867 @ 1.21USD to the pound) and the dollar fell to 1.70 USD to the pound but gold didn't budge, that would be equivalent to £1098/oz (and a nightmare loss!). However if gold simultaneously went to $2638/oz I would still get my £1552 back @1.70 USD to the pound.

That`s what i mean as gold is priced in $ on the international market  when the $ goes down gold don`t always go up to reflect/keep parity with  the price in other currencies  

What i was trying to highlight (very badly) is buying gold in a currency it`s not priced in is as much currency speculation as it is a price speculation basically buying now is buying close to the very top in pound terms especially so as the £ is miles away from it`s average exchange rate and gold is off its highs 

 

 

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Long time lurking
27 minutes ago, moneyscam said:

Discount window is repo, not reverse repo - repo is I borrow cash from Fed, reverse repo is I lend cash to Fed.

Revers repo is the FED buys back bonds already issued ,that`s what i thought they were offering to do buy back long dated low coupon rate bonds for face value 

Edit there looks to be two types 

https://www.newyorkfed.org/markets/rrp_faq

Edited by Long time lurking
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2 minutes ago, Long time lurking said:

buying gold in a currency it`s not priced in is as much currency speculation as it is a price speculation

I can't argue with that. Ultimately it depends on where one sees gold and the dollar going from here. The SVB situation (as a mere symptom of rates reaching a systemically unsustainable level, and hence peaking) seems key.

If a twitter thread I read the other day is accurate the Fed legally can't do any of the bailout techniques from the 2008 era anymore. There is talk of a "discount window" mechanism to lend against the treasuries at par, and enable the bank to buy ~5% yielding ones with the money. This would be technically legal and solve the impacted banks immediate problem, by enabling it to pay higher deposit rates and retain customers. It would be a bailout in all but name IMO, and markets will likely move accordingly. $100 billion dollars (random guess) of printed money running out to buy Treasuries at market rate would bring yields down too, but then whack-a-mole starts as other banks struggle to match the interest on deposits and face their own runs. The Fed may be talking tough, but this looks like a bailout.

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Gold is priced in whatever you want it to be priced in - USD, GBP, EUR, potatoes, cars, blowjobs

Gold futures/paper...yeah that's USD only

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HousePriceMania
13 minutes ago, Axeman123 said:

I can't argue with that. Ultimately it depends on where one sees gold and the dollar going from here. The SVB situation (as a mere symptom of rates reaching a systemically unsustainable level, and hence peaking) seems key.

If a twitter thread I read the other day is accurate the Fed legally can't do any of the bailout techniques from the 2008 era anymore. There is talk of a "discount window" mechanism to lend against the treasuries at par, and enable the bank to buy ~5% yielding ones with the money. This would be technically legal and solve the impacted banks immediate problem, by enabling it to pay higher deposit rates and retain customers. It would be a bailout in all but name IMO, and markets will likely move accordingly. $100 billion dollars (random guess) of printed money running out to buy Treasuries at market rate would bring yields down too, but then whack-a-mole starts as other banks struggle to match the interest on deposits and face their own runs. The Fed may be talking tough, but this looks like a bailout.

Total fucking banking scam.

 

The system is broken and more moral Hazard bailouts ain't gonna fix it 

 

 

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Long time lurking
6 minutes ago, Loki said:

Gold is priced in whatever you want it to be priced in - USD, GBP, EUR, potatoes, cars, blowjobs

Gold futures/paper...yeah that's USD only

It`s listed as $ everything else is converted at the dollar rate of exchange at the time of purchase whether its blow jobs or £`s 

Take the all time high $ price at that point in time the £ price was what it is today yet the $ price was $200 more than  todays as the exchange rate was $1.30 odd to the £ the stronger the £ vs $ the cheaper it gets in £`s 

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One percent
2 minutes ago, HousePriceMania said:

Total fucking banking scam.

 

The system is broken and more moral Hazard bailouts ain't gonna fix it 

 

 

There was talk of linking money back to gold. I’m guessing that they took one look at the abyss and decided to back away from that. 

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3 minutes ago, Long time lurking said:

Revers repo is the FED buys back bonds already issued ,that`s what i thought they were offering to do buy back long dated low coupon rate bonds for face value 

That is what the Fed is doing but via a repo, not a reverse repo. 

It would help if you actually understood the terms you are using.

Quote

A reverse repurchase agreement (known as reverse repo or RRP) is a transaction in which the New York Fed under the authorization and direction of the Federal Open Market Committee sells a security to an eligible counterparty with an agreement to repurchase that same security at a specified price at a specific time in the future. For these transactions, eligible securities are U.S. Treasury instruments, federal agency debt and the mortgage-backed securities issued or fully guaranteed by federal agencies.
For more information, see https://www.newyorkfed.org/markets/rrp_faq.html

https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/RRPONTSYD

Quote

A repurchase agreement (known as repo or RP) is a transaction in which the New York Fed under the authorization and direction of the Federal Open Maker Committee buys a security from an eligible counterparty under an agreement to resell that security in the future. For these transactions, eligible securities are U.S. Treasury instruments, federal agency debt and the mortgage-backed securities issued or fully guaranteed by federal agencies.

https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/RPONTSYD

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