Property crash, just maybe it really is different this time (Part 3)

[onlyme]

13 hours ago, roundhouse said:

Charlie and his buddie did discuss many other angles too, inc the negative and potential outcomes. 

Btw, appreciate people here making me aware of his podcasts and Best Agent stuff. It's a bit repetitive and sometimes long-winded but some very valuable takeaways.

 

I think his buying advice  in terms of how to approach the offer price submission (written) is top notch. No faff, not going to get into a protracted conter-bidding process and quick resolution one way or another. Throw in a (lowball) price you are happy to go with, if not accepted move on and try elsehwere.

[Frank Hovis]

4 hours ago, onlyme said:

I think his buying advice  in terms of how to approach the offer price submission (written) is top notch. No faff, not going to get into a protracted conter-bidding process and quick resolution one way or another. Throw in a (lowball) price you are happy to go with, if not accepted move on and try elsehwere.

 

That approach is however more suited to people buying up a rental portfolio who can have a dozen offers in the go at any one time.

As they're not intending to live in any of them they gave zero emotional attachment to any of them and are not bothered about all of their lowball offers being rejected.

If however you want one house then you can't be that casual because you would care if you lost it by offering a low price.

[onlyme]

5 minutes ago, Frank Hovis said:

 

That approach is however more suited to people buying up a rental portfolio who can have a dozen offers in the go at any one time.

As they're not intending to live in any of them they gave zero emotional attachment to any of them and are not bothered about all of their lowball offers being rejected.

If however you want one house then you can't be that casual because you would care if you lost it by offering a low price.

For sure there will be the chance you miss out but he does say set the max price you are happy to pay and submit that as full and final offer, they might come back later or if still for sale you could go back later with higher offer having secured additinal funds or change in mortgage terms say.

He also suggests putting in using your max figure to bid on properties outside your expected price range.  if you get lucky and hit on a comitte seller yu might end up something even better than you had ever hoped.

A lot deoends on what sector of the market you are in and locality, there are situations where there really isn;t much to differentiate one huose form another and it may not matter at all, terraced housing for example where theres choice but not really much of a difference from place to place in an area.

[JoeDavola]

EA's are leaning on my parents again saying that the current buyer is wanting a date for completion, trying to put the fear up them what if the buyer finds somewhere else blah blah. Same old same old.

Of course they'd be mad to sell without somewhere to move to; they already know that.

 

[Bobthebuilder]

1 hour ago, JoeDavola said:

EA's are leaning on my parents again saying that the current buyer is wanting a date for completion, trying to put the fear up them what if the buyer finds somewhere else blah blah. Same old same old.

Of course they'd be mad to sell without somewhere to move to; they already know that.

 

As usual the story sounds familiar, your parents will not sell. My father was like this, ended up dying in the same house.

[ste]

2 hours ago, JoeDavola said:

EA's are leaning on my parents again saying that the current buyer is wanting a date for completion, trying to put the fear up them what if the buyer finds somewhere else blah blah. Same old same old.

Of course they'd be mad to sell without somewhere to move to; they already know that.

 

Been watching this unfold over the many months and enjoy these updates. It feels like this is more a hobby of theirs rather than a real intention to move.

Time to start toying with them.... Just tell them to pull themselves up by their bootstraps, stop wasting money on garden centre lunches and they'll be able to stretch to that bungalow in a fancy area in no time.

[leonardratso]

2 hours ago, JoeDavola said:

EA's are leaning on my parents again saying that the current buyer is wanting a date for completion, trying to put the fear up them what if the buyer finds somewhere else blah blah. Same old same old.

Of course they'd be mad to sell without somewhere to move to; they already know that.

 

I hope your parents are just trolling the EA's and wasting their time. Id respect them if they were.

[JoeDavola]

@Bobthebuilder @ste @leonardratso

To their credit they've viewed 3 houses in the last month and made offers on two of them - both outbid. So they are trying, finally.

I think what is interesting about their particular case is that they're taking so long to move and messing the EA about so much, that the EA must be fucking desperate for any houses to sell otherwise they'd have told them to fuck off a long time ago.

Edited February 23 by JoeDavola

[Wight Flight]

3 hours ago, JoeDavola said:

EA's are leaning on my parents again saying that the current buyer is wanting a date for completion, trying to put the fear up them what if the buyer finds somewhere else blah blah. Same old same old.

Of course they'd be mad to sell without somewhere to move to; they already know that.

 

Why don't they sell and rent for a while? They would be cash buyers then.

[JoeDavola]

11 minutes ago, Wight Flight said:

Why don't they sell and rent for a while? They would be cash buyers then.

They couldn't cope with not owning a place at their age, and I agree this isn't something they should be doing.

They'd be paing a grand a month easy in rent to live anywhere they'd be prepared to live and prices could keep on rising with them paying a grand in rent and sitting in cash.

So whilst being a cash buyer might make it easier for them to compete in this mental market, it's not worth the risk IMO.

[Bobthebuilder]

15 minutes ago, JoeDavola said:

They couldn't cope with not owning a place at their age, and I agree this isn't something they should be doing.

They'd be paing a grand a month easy in rent to live anywhere they'd be prepared to live and prices could keep on rising with them paying a grand in rent and sitting in cash.

So whilst being a cash buyer might make it easier for them to compete in this mental market, it's not worth the risk IMO.

If you ever lose your job Joe, become an estate agent you would be great at it.;)

 

[Wight Flight]

52 minutes ago, JoeDavola said:

They couldn't cope with not owning a place at their age, and I agree this isn't something they should be doing.

They'd be paing a grand a month easy in rent to live anywhere they'd be prepared to live and prices could keep on rising with them paying a grand in rent and sitting in cash.

So whilst being a cash buyer might make it easier for them to compete in this mental market, it's not worth the risk IMO.

But the interest on their cash would cover most of the rent. 

they are crap at finding somewhere to buy when they have their own buyer lined up. It seems like a sensible option to me.

[sancho panza]

I love the temrinology.

you ogtta laugh,even the usual pumpers are saying this is insane....

https://uk.finance.yahoo.com/news/first-time-buyers-offered-sub-140000338.html

High street lenders will begin offering sub-1pc mortgage rates from next week to those buying a new build property.

The new scheme, which some brokers have dubbed “the biggest innovation in the mortgage market since Help to Buy”, sees developers foot a portion of the interest rate bill in the first two or five years of the loan. But experts warn that first-time buyers who use the scheme face a steep jump in repayments when the term comes to an end.

Currently, the average interest rate on a two-year fix is 5.74pc, according to data firm Moneyfacts. This means borrowers moving off a sub-1pc rate could therefore face as much as a four-fold increase in their mortgage interest rate after just two years.

To secure a 0.99pc rate for two years, buyers need a 40pc deposit. A 25pc deposit will get you a 1.83pc rate, and a 10pc deposit a 3.78pc rate. Five-year rates start from 2.95pc.

Santander has also announced that from next week it will be offering 95pc mortgages to those who are buying new build properties. Currently, it only lends up to 85pc on new builds.

Edited February 23 by sancho panza

[Loki]

7 minutes ago, sancho panza said:

a 0.99pc rate for two years, buyers need a 40pc deposit. A 25pc deposit will get you a 1.83pc rate, and a 10pc deposit a 3.78pc rate. Five-year rates start from 2.95pc

With all the full details you've given there it looks more like...bait

[roundhouse]

15 hours ago, Wight Flight said:

Very unlikely.

 

I don't know, not looked into it. But here there are 1 bed flats/houselets coming on around £100K area. If renting at £750+ a month, and trapped as unable to save a 5-10% deposit, wouldn't the 1% deposit scheme come across as worth doing, to the renter? Again no idea how interest would increase monthly repayments.

That said, I think Charlie + bud were thinking more London renters, and 2 people buying together, not singletons. 
 

[sancho panza]

46 minutes ago, Loki said:

With all the full details you've given there it looks more like...bait

the lenders arent daft loki.they knownthey'll be on the hook unless they lay off the risk.even an intial 5 yr fix civered by the gvot eaves them deep in the hole.

contrary to what people think the lenders know whats coming.HSBC depsite whetever the adverst sya is still hard to get a 90% LTV mrotgage off.

unless the govt gurantees a bigger peice of the pie i suspect they'll be no lending t this elvel

[sancho panza]

 

https://www.countypress.co.uk/news/24140963.isle-wight-care-home-ventnor-hmo/

Isle of Wight care home in Ventnor could be HMO

Bluebell House, on Mitchell Avenue, Ventnor, has been closed since November 2022.

In a letter recently submitted to the Isle of Wight Council, Gail Falloon-Phillips, director of In Safe Hands Home Care, which operated Bluebell House, said the building is not fit for purpose as a care home, due to an untenable situation with a shortage of care personnel and a lack of funding.

 

She said the property was on the market but there had been a 'discouraging response'.

Now, Terraform Development has put forward new proposals to the Island's planning authority.

Each bedroom would have a sink and 16 rooms could have ensuite toilets.

Residents would share six bathrooms and one shower room, as well as three kitchen and dining areas and three lounge areas.

Flats on the top floor of the building, previously used as accommodation for managers and owners, will be opened up, and included as part of the HMO.

[JoeDavola]

8 hours ago, Wight Flight said:

But the interest on their cash would cover most of the rent. 

they are crap at finding somewhere to buy when they have their own buyer lined up. It seems like a sensible option to me.

Yes the interest would cover the rent.

Its still never going to happen. I'm not exaggerating when I say that the stress of moving to a rental would most likely kill my mother.

Their last house move involved a 6 month stint renting a small house while they figured out where they were going to buy. I've never seen my mother so miserable; I've seen her going through cancer and bereavements and the most miserable I saw her was when she thought she'd gone from owning a nice house to being a dirty renter of a smaller and not so nice house.

She claims that her hair fell out with the stress of renting...guess that explains what happened on top of my fucking head over the last 12 years

Edited February 24 by JoeDavola

[No One]

13 hours ago, sancho panza said:

I love the temrinology.

you ogtta laugh,even the usual pumpers are saying this is insane....

https://uk.finance.yahoo.com/news/first-time-buyers-offered-sub-140000338.html

High street lenders will begin offering sub-1pc mortgage rates from next week to those buying a new build property.

The new scheme, which some brokers have dubbed “the biggest innovation in the mortgage market since Help to Buy”, sees developers foot a portion of the interest rate bill in the first two or five years of the loan. But experts warn that first-time buyers who use the scheme face a steep jump in repayments when the term comes to an end.

Currently, the average interest rate on a two-year fix is 5.74pc, according to data firm Moneyfacts. This means borrowers moving off a sub-1pc rate could therefore face as much as a four-fold increase in their mortgage interest rate after just two years.

To secure a 0.99pc rate for two years, buyers need a 40pc deposit. A 25pc deposit will get you a 1.83pc rate, and a 10pc deposit a 3.78pc rate. Five-year rates start from 2.95pc.

Santander has also announced that from next week it will be offering 95pc mortgages to those who are buying new build properties. Currently, it only lends up to 85pc on new builds.

Nearly fell off my chair, then I took the time to read through it and I'm not worried anymore. 

Requirements:

40% deposit. So a 60LTV. Not many can afford that even with BOMAD. 

 

5 hours ago, JoeDavola said:

Yes the interest would cover the rent.

Its still never going to happen. I'm not exaggerating when I say that the stress of moving to a rental would most likely kill my mother.

Their last house move involved a 6 month stint renting a small house while they figured out where they were going to buy. I've never seen my mother so miserable; I've seen her going through cancer and bereavements and the most miserable I saw her was when she thought she'd gone from owning a nice house to being a dirty renter of a smaller and not so nice house.

She claims that her hair fell out with the stress of renting...guess that explains what happened on top of my fucking head over the last 12 years

explains why I'm bald then

[Kendo]

27 minutes ago, No One said:

Nearly fell off my chair, then I took the time to read through it and I'm not worried anymore. 

Requirements:

40% deposit. So a 60LTV. Not many can afford that even with BOMAD. 

Well, yes, to get the biggest discount but you still get a discount on smaller deposits. A little worrying that this, plus 99% mortgages, plus interest rate cuts (or at least expectations they’re coming), plus maybe short-term falling inflation, plus pent-up demand all combines to rising sentiment and another short-term spike in prices. 
 

This new-build scheme feels like it’s come right out of the blue. Usually you hear of these schemes well ahead of them being implemented, like the 99% mortgages, where there have been several articles over the past six months or so. Maybe I missed the previous publicity but this has come as a surprise to me.

[Cosmic]

6 hours ago, JoeDavola said:

Yes the interest would cover the rent.

Its still never going to happen. I'm not exaggerating when I say that the stress of moving to a rental would most likely kill my mother.

Their last house move involved a 6 month stint renting a small house while they figured out where they were going to buy. I've never seen my mother so miserable; I've seen her going through cancer and bereavements and the most miserable I saw her was when she thought she'd gone from owning a nice house to being a dirty renter of a smaller and not so nice house.

She claims that her hair fell out with the stress of renting...guess that explains what happened on top of my fucking head over the last 12 years

The fucking state of it. No offense.

[onlyme]

14 hours ago, roundhouse said:

I don't know, not looked into it. But here there are 1 bed flats/houselets coming on around £100K area. If renting at £750+ a month, and trapped as unable to save a 5-10% deposit, wouldn't the 1% deposit scheme come across as worth doing, to the renter? Again no idea how interest would increase monthly repayments.

That said, I think Charlie + bud were thinking more London renters, and 2 people buying together, not singletons. 
 

Still cheaper in London to get a mortgage on a starter flat / maisonette in a lot of areas so not just finances or ability to get a mortagage (rents did rise for a while and still a significant jobs pull). PLenty of renters must be makign a call between potenital money saved on rent vs potential falls the next few years. There's an argument that the differntial between rents and mortgage cost should be much tighter in London - the risk factor in terms of job loss/resulting collapse of finances and loss of home and default is nowhere near as bad as it can be outside of London.

In London If you have a particular skillset chances are if you are commited enough you will find a replacement job to cover your costs - the tansport netwwork helps, it might be one heck of a slog but once in striking distance of Lodnon you can get around even without your own transport (the centre at least). Elsewhere in the country, particularly if you have a narrow skillset the job that you have with a local employer might be the only one in the area that needs those skills - well and truly scrwed if you lose your job under those circumstances.

I think the 2 people vs singletons argument could be made pretty much eually for London and anywhere else,

[spygirl]

It's hard out there, for old people in big houses with lots of equity...

I read these sorts of article and go - You've make x00k but are griping about pay xk stamp duty, even though you are going to save several in running costs ffs.

https://amp.theguardian.com/money/2024/feb/24/it-makes-moving-pointless-why-stamp-duty-is-the-biggest-downside-to-downsizing

What’s standing in the way of downsizing for Gail, 58, from Manchester – who is self-employed and lives with her partner in a five-bed house she would like to swap for a smaller home? “Simply the cost of stamp duty. We live in an expensive area, so downsizing will cost us a lot in stamp duty, far more than we would save by having lower bills.”

You do know SD is only  paid fir a buy? 0% up to 250k?

Stamp duty would be “a huge amount of money,” says Gail, who bought the current family home with her partner for £1.25m in 2012 with the proceeds of a previous sale.

The property has gone up in value since – as has the kind of homes they would move to in the first stage of downsizing.

“We don’t need a five-bed house for the two of us and would like to sell, make use of this capital and buy a smaller four-bedroom house for the interim, because our kids are in their 20s and both renting, so we’d need rooms for them,” she says. “But we paid £60,000 in stamp duty when we bought this house, and it would cost us a fortune again to move to a smaller home in this area.”

Err, One, you don't downsizing size in stages ffs.

Two, going from a 5br to a 4br isn't downsizing. It's trading houses ffs.

“Second homes and Airbnbs have taken a fair number of these off the market,” she says, before pointing to another issue: “A lot of smaller local properties that were available not so long ago have now been converted into very large dwellings, so not only is the price now well beyond our reach, but they are far too big.”

I genuinely don't understand that. Tardis developments???

I like this one

Helen, 55, from Bath, lives in a six-bed end-of-terrace house and has been racking her brains about how to use this asset to best support her family. “I would like to move to a smaller home in the next three years to release some equity for travel and improved quality of life,” she says. “My three children are all adults now and hard workers, but I just can’t see when they will be able to earn enough or save enough to buy their own home, and if they rely on rental housing, they will never be secure

“I find myself now considering how to convert my house into three extremely compact flats so my children are at least housed, however imperfectly.”

 

Selling the house and using the proceeds to help her children get on the property ladder feels risky, Helen says, as she still has to pay off about half of the house’s £600,000 value, and she will be relying on the proceeds of the eventual sale in retirement. “Even for a very small flat, my children would each need a deposit of around £30,000. If I sold the house and gave them this money each, I’d lose about a third of my equity, and be forced to buy in another town.

“I’m trying to have this house [meet] multiple different needs. Homes were meant to be homes, not an asset class – but now they are, and this is my only asset.”

I wish they'd put in when they bought the house and when.

This screams IO mortgage ffs.

I'd assume she bought 20y ago. Tge 300k owed is what she paid plus a lot of remortgaging.

And she wants the 300k for a pension. However if she owes 300k still then what tge fuck is tge daft cow going to buy another house with?

Why convert to flats?

Let the kids stay rent free and save up 30k. It'll only take a hard worker 3y 

 

 

[spygirl]

22 hours ago, Frank Hovis said:

 

That approach is however more suited to people buying up a rental portfolio who can have a dozen offers in the go at any one time.

As they're not intending to live in any of them they gave zero emotional attachment to any of them and are not bothered about all of their lowball offers being rejected.

If however you want one house then you can't be that casual because you would care if you lost it by offering a low price.

Again, I'm sure Charlie is in London.

There's probably a lot of house coming up for sale in a small radius.

It won't work in rural  n villages- yet.

 

[Chewing Grass]

Remember the £1.1 Million Chicken Shed from Part 2, its been reduced 10%.

Closeup on old listing.