Death Of London

[Frank Hovis]

6 minutes ago, spygirl said:

England’s office space shrinks by millions of square feet

Workspace declined 2% last year

 

That's rather an attention-grabbing headline compared to the contents.

[The Generation Game]

Alexander from The Duran was saying yesterday that, to all intents and purposes, London is back to normal now. Can anyone in Cockneystan either confirm or deny?

https://youtu.be/krK_Vs2m3Dk&t=45s

 

[Ash4781b]

4 hours ago, spygirl said:

England’s office space shrinks by millions of square feet

Workspace declined 2% last year as construction stalled and developers adapted to flexible working

 

https://www.ft.com/content/8c231f78-82c4-4028-91c4-e091b8c4a3f9

The amount of office space in England has plunged by millions of square feet during the pandemic and is expected to continue falling, with workplaces languishing empty and questions about the future of work unresolved. The contraction is part of a big shake-up of English offices, which developers are under pressure to make more flexible and greener in response to shifting work patterns and a rising tide of environmental regulation. The amount of office space in England fell 2 per cent in the 12 months to March 31 last year, according to data from the Valuation Office Agency, part of HM Revenue & Customs. That represents a fall of more than 18m sq ft in the period — roughly 35 times the floorspace in the Gherkin office building in the City of London, or almost 15 times that in 22 Bishopsgate, the largest office building completed in the capital during the pandemic.

 

They are worried about the loss on business rates revenue.  Could be quite a problem. Aww just turn the offices into residential social houses. Clad them aswell.

[Ash4781b]

1 hour ago, The Generation Game said:

Alexander from The Duran was saying yesterday that, to all intents and purposes, London is back to normal now. Can anyone in Cockneystan either confirm or deny?

https://youtu.be/krK_Vs2m3Dk&t=45s

 

How much for a pint of beer up in London ? £8 ?

[Errol]

5 hours ago, The Generation Game said:

Alexander from The Duran was saying yesterday that, to all intents and purposes, London is back to normal now. Can anyone in Cockneystan either confirm or deny?

https://youtu.be/krK_Vs2m3Dk&t=45s

 

Absolutely is not. The City was mostly empty up to the latest wfh order. 

Most people in London are wfh at least 50% of the week so there is no practical way it can ever go back to what it was.

[Yadda yadda yadda]

5 hours ago, The Generation Game said:

Alexander from The Duran was saying yesterday that, to all intents and purposes, London is back to normal now. Can anyone in Cockneystan either confirm or deny?

https://youtu.be/krK_Vs2m3Dk&t=45s

 

Depends on what you're looking at. Pubs, restaurants and most cultural stuff is more or less normal. As far as I can see shopping is normal, except for people wearing masks. Office attendance is well down. Commuting in the rush hour is well down. Tourism is well down. Car use might actually be up as people avoid public transport.

I would phrase it like this. People have the option of living fairly normally, if they want to.

[Bien Pensant]

12 hours ago, The Generation Game said:

Alexander from The Duran was saying yesterday that, to all intents and purposes, London is back to normal now. Can anyone in Cockneystan either confirm or deny?

https://youtu.be/krK_Vs2m3Dk&t=45s

If you want to check the health of an organism the first place to look at is its blood - the arteries of London are its transport network, principally the Tube, practically everyone uses it every day so it's a direct way to measure the 'vitality' of the city.

Here is a link to the data that TfL releases on journey numbers. The latest set is November so doesn't really reflect the Moronic scariant (although Londoners don't seem to be panicking over it from what I can see).

Essentially, in November 2019 there were 113.3m Tube journeys, the following November it was down to just 33.7m but by this November it was back up to 73.7m. So, a good bit quieter than usual but far from dead.

[Option5]

6 minutes ago, Bien Pensant said:

If you want to check the health of an organism the first place to look at is its blood - the arteries of London are its transport network, principally the Tube, practically everyone uses it every day so it's a direct way to measure the 'vitality' of the city.

Here is a link to the data that TfL releases on journey numbers. The latest set is November so doesn't really reflect the Moronic scariant (although Londoners don't seem to be panicking over it from what I can see).

Essentially, in November 2019 there were 113.3m Tube journeys, the following November it was down to just 33.7m but by this November it was back up to 73.7m. So, a good bit quieter than usual but far from dead.

Could the relative lack of overseas tourists play a part in the drop?

[Bien Pensant]

1 minute ago, Option5 said:

Could the relative lack of overseas tourists play a part in the drop?

Very probably. If so it suggests that, as far as locals are concerned, it's status quo ante.

Edited January 4, 2022 by Bien Pensant

[spygirl]

Lloyd’s of London considers exit from landmark City building

Pandemic has prompted centuries-old insurance market to rethink office needs

https://www.ft.com/content/86690d99-d218-4865-8be8-c78332b6f919

Lloyd’s is one of the City’s last face-to-face financial markets, with the underwriters sitting at desks called boxes and the brokers lining up to see them, waiting for their turn to discuss cover for everything from apartment blocks to space flights. But since the pandemic hit, the brokers and underwriters have been forced to do business online, leading to questions over the future purpose of the building.

 

[spygirl]

How the UK high street was hit by the pandemic: look up your area Although ‘levelling up’ focuses on the north and Midlands, the worst affected areas have been elsewhere. Try the FT’s postcode tool

https://www.ft.com/content/9348c644-288f-42e7-9f4b-edea8b71be5b

Cant copy the graphic.

Basically London in person shop spend is down 25%. Worst in the UK.

 

Most of all, the geographical difference within England is striking. Many of the areas in the so-called red wall, mostly midsized towns in the former industrial heartlands of the Midlands and north, have outperformed wealthier areas. The worst hit neighbourhoods are concentrated in larger cities, while the south has been more affected than the north.

 

Almost like no natives live in London .....

[MrPin]

2 minutes ago, spygirl said:

Almost like no natives live in London .....

My sister does.

[spygirl]

2 minutes ago, MrPin said:

My sister does.

Sue?

[MrPin]

1 minute ago, spygirl said:

Sue?

Well that's her middle name. She is in Lewisham, and likes it. To me, bit older, I remember Lewisham as being a bit horrible. Times change.

[Stuey]

48 minutes ago, spygirl said:

How the UK high street was hit by the pandemic: look up your area Although ‘levelling up’ focuses on the north and Midlands, the worst affected areas have been elsewhere. Try the FT’s postcode tool

https://www.ft.com/content/9348c644-288f-42e7-9f4b-edea8b71be5b

Cant copy the graphic.

Basically London in person shop spend is down 25%. Worst in the UK.

 

Most of all, the geographical difference within England is striking. Many of the areas in the so-called red wall, mostly midsized towns in the former industrial heartlands of the Midlands and north, have outperformed wealthier areas. The worst hit neighbourhoods are concentrated in larger cities, while the south has been more affected than the north.

 

Almost like no natives live in London .....

I'd not seen Stockton market so busy. People are shopping locally rather than going to the city, that's all. 

[spygirl]

3 minutes ago, Stuey said:

I'd not seen Stockton market so busy. People are shopping locally rather than going to the city, that's all. 

Markets offers a good range f fruit n veg and much cheaper prices than the supermarket.

It make sense to buy fruitnveg from markets or greengrocers - supermarkets are shit n expensive - logistics chain is too long, expensive and clumsy.

Once people stop/reduce driving, then markets make sense.

 

[spygirl]

1 hour ago, MrPin said:

Well that's her middle name. She is in Lewisham, and likes it. To me, bit older, I remember Lewisham as being a bit horrible. Times change.

It will probably revert to being even worse.

 

[Yadda yadda yadda]

1 hour ago, MrPin said:

Well that's her middle name. She is in Lewisham, and likes it. To me, bit older, I remember Lewisham as being a bit horrible. Times change.

They're doing their best to make Lewisham worse. Terrible high rise blocks going up in the centre. I don't actually go near Lewisham town centre so I'm judging on how it looks. Might be ok if you've got a good community around you. Probably very easy to live cheaply using the market. Parts of the wider borough are alright.

[spygirl]

Please come back.

Heres some free stuff

https://www.itv.com/news/2022-01-27/why-you-could-get-a-free-sausage-roll-or-a-coffee-if-you-take-the-train-to-work

It'll only cost you 12k from your after tax and 4h a day of your life.

Oh, you might get stabbed by one of the migrants you are paying 80k/y to live in London.

 

[spygirl]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-60140862

The journey to work is set to be a whole lot more relaxing than before for commuters hopping back on the train.

That at least is the plan: the rail industry is offering free hot drinks, access to a mindfulness app and other perks to lure people back on board.

It's part of a new industry rewards scheme, aimed at reviving passenger numbers which slumped in the pandemic.

Many train operators are also still running reduced timetables due to high levels of staff absence.

They say services will increase in the coming weeks in line with demand.

Independent watchdog Transport Focus said the rewards scheme - which also offers passengers free bacon rolls, audiobooks and music streaming services - was a good idea.

But it added that enticing passengers back meant delivering their priorities, "including punctual and reliable services, enough space on board and improved value for money tickets".

• Trains told to get rid of torrent of 'Tannoy spam'

Last week the government scrapped its work-from-home guidance in England, along with other measures aimed at curbing the pandemic. But so far workers are proving reluctant to return to the daily commute.

On Monday passenger numbers were still only at 53% of pre-pandemic levels, according to the Department for Transport.

Demand for peak-time trains has increased by just 5% since the guidance changed, according to the industry body the Rail Delivery Group.

The industry is betting its online rewards scheme will stoke new enthusiasm, by subtly replacing recollections of crowded commuter journeys with images of a more leisurely experience.

Passengers who log on to backontrack.nationalrail.co.uk/commuter can select rewards from complimentary breakfast food from Greggs, free audiobooks, access to a mindfulness app, and coffees from London-based café chain Pure.

Enhancing experiences

It is the latest attempt to make rail travel more pleasant, with the Department for Transport last week promising that rail operators would get rid of unnecessary announcements to make journeys quieter.

"Taking the train is more than just a journey, it benefits the environment, economy and local businesses," said Jacqueline Starr, chief executive of the Rail Delivery Group.

The range of free offerings would "help enhance customers' on-train and at-destination experiences", she added.

Spencer Craig, boss of the Pure coffee chain, said they had seen their customer base drop by more than 50% while commuters worked from home.

He said they were "delighted" to be part of the rewards platform that might help to tempt them back.

[spygirl]

The train companies and luke warm pasty sellers  seem to think people enjoyed forking out 12k after tax and spending 4h travelling to n from work.

Sack 50% of railway workers.

Reduce the remaining 5% pay by 50%.

 

 

[Snake Plissken]

6 minutes ago, spygirl said:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-60140862

The journey to work is set to be a whole lot more relaxing than before for commuters hopping back on the train.

That at least is the plan: the rail industry is offering free hot drinks, access to a mindfulness app and other perks to lure people back on board.

It's part of a new industry rewards scheme, aimed at reviving passenger numbers which slumped in the pandemic.

Many train operators are also still running reduced timetables due to high levels of staff absence.

They say services will increase in the coming weeks in line with demand.

Independent watchdog Transport Focus said the rewards scheme - which also offers passengers free bacon rolls, audiobooks and music streaming services - was a good idea.

But it added that enticing passengers back meant delivering their priorities, "including punctual and reliable services, enough space on board and improved value for money tickets".

• Trains told to get rid of torrent of 'Tannoy spam'

Last week the government scrapped its work-from-home guidance in England, along with other measures aimed at curbing the pandemic. But so far workers are proving reluctant to return to the daily commute.

On Monday passenger numbers were still only at 53% of pre-pandemic levels, according to the Department for Transport.

Demand for peak-time trains has increased by just 5% since the guidance changed, according to the industry body the Rail Delivery Group.

The industry is betting its online rewards scheme will stoke new enthusiasm, by subtly replacing recollections of crowded commuter journeys with images of a more leisurely experience.

Passengers who log on to backontrack.nationalrail.co.uk/commuter can select rewards from complimentary breakfast food from Greggs, free audiobooks, access to a mindfulness app, and coffees from London-based café chain Pure.

Enhancing experiences

It is the latest attempt to make rail travel more pleasant, with the Department for Transport last week promising that rail operators would get rid of unnecessary announcements to make journeys quieter.

"Taking the train is more than just a journey, it benefits the environment, economy and local businesses," said Jacqueline Starr, chief executive of the Rail Delivery Group.

The range of free offerings would "help enhance customers' on-train and at-destination experiences", she added.

Spencer Craig, boss of the Pure coffee chain, said they had seen their customer base drop by more than 50% while commuters worked from home.

He said they were "delighted" to be part of the rewards platform that might help to tempt them back.

Its getting up at 5am in the pitch black in the winter to start a two hour journey, getting back at 7.30, constantly exhausted that gets you, not the lack of a hot drink.

[Chewing Grass]

1 minute ago, Snake Plissken said:

Its getting up at 5am in the pitch black in the winter to start a two hour journey, getting back at 7.30, constantly exhausted that gets you, not the lack of a hot drink.

Quite, just emphasises what Grade-A-Holes the cosseted ranks of the BBC and Media in general are, this bit was the icing on the cake in that article 'access to a mindfulness app and other perks' to lure people back on board, all aimed at the incidental traveller with a cosy job.

[spygirl]

 

 

[spygirl]

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Comment posted by Colin, today at 10:55Colin

10:55

Maybe they try cutting prices that might work better at getting people back on trains.

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Reply posted by Deltic1961, today at 11:19Deltic1961

11:19

to Colin

"

Maybe they try cutting prices that might work better at getting people back on trains.

"

Deltic1961 replied:

Spot on. It's funny how bars, restaurants, cinemas all do deals to get people back in, but I bought my ticket uesterday and found Scotrail have just put prices up. Rail operators are totally delusional and think people will keep paying through the nose for poor service. Let's see ......

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Comment posted by just a thought, today at 10:55just a thought

10:55

Is it just me? I'd rather they didn't spend a fortune on all these so called 'perks' & used the savings to cut the cost of tickets instead

I can then decide for myself if I want to buy a coffee or audio book with the savings......

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Reply posted by jon, today at 11:36jon

11:36

to just a thought

"

Is it just me? I'd rather they didn't spend a fortune on all these so called 'perks' & used the savings to cut the cost of tickets insteadI can then decide for myself if I want to buy a coffee or audio book with the savings......

"

jon replied:

Yep. Maybe cut all the repetitive tannoy announcements. How can we have mindfulness with “See it ,say it , sorted”

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Comment posted by Ian, today at 11:01Ian

11:01

Lower fares and ability to get a seat are much more important than a free coffee

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Reply posted by Nandiowl, today at 11:31Nandiowl

11:31

to Ian

"

Lower fares and ability to get a seat are much more important than a free coffee

"

Nandiowl replied:

Reducing ticket prices and getting rid of mask mandates will help get people back!!

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Comment posted by bpmkent, today at 11:05bpmkent

11:05

3 things they should prioritise - Capacity, reliability & affordability.

When your train is cancelled and you have to get an alternative, packed, delayed train with an connection on an equally packed delayed train getting home over an hour later than you should (as I used to get when I commuted) then a cup of the cheapest coffee money can buy won't really make up for that.

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Reply posted by Nandiowl, today at 11:44Nandiowl

11:44

to bpmkent

"

3 things they should prioritise - Capacity, reliability & affordability.When your train is cancelled and you have to get an alternative, packed, delayed train with an connection on an equally packed delayed train getting home over an hour later than you should (as I used to get when I commuted) then a cup of the cheapest coffee money can buy won't really make up for that.

"

Nandiowl replied:

The problem is the price of train tickets.

If we really want to reduce the amount of cars on the road, with a knock on effect on emissions, then taking the train needs to be cheaper and more convenient than driving.

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Comment posted by The bald crusader, today at 11:06The bald crusader

11:06

Commute by car/tram including parking <£!0. Same journey by train including parking c.£40. Do you think a "free" coffee is going to tempt me?

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Reply posted by Fratton, today at 12:44Fratton

12:44

to The bald crusader

"

Commute by car/tram including parking <£!0. Same journey by train including parking c.£40. Do you think a "free" coffee is going to tempt me?

"

Fratton replied:

And your car goes door to door.

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Comment posted by Jamie, today at 11:23Jamie

11:23

Journeys are more relaxing if you don't have to make them and can work from home, the genie is out the bottle. Can make coffee at home as well.

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Reply posted by Wilsons Uncle, today at 11:28Wilsons Uncle

11:28

to Jamie

"

Journeys are more relaxing if you don't have to make them and can work from home, the genie is out the bottle. Can make coffee at home as well.

"

Wilsons Uncle replied:

Very true, and ok if you have a progressive employer who supports WFH.
On a tangent a bit, but it's also the perfect opportunity to make good on climate change if the gov and employers were to support home working - thousands of journeys not made every day and tons of CO2 not emitted every day. Still, that's common sense and that just won't do.

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Comment posted by Chester, today at 11:34Chester

11:34

Why don't you just reduce the cost of your frankly outrageous tickets?

No-one cares about Tannoys, minfulness apps, or free coffee.

Put the money into clean, new, efficient trains and cheaper ticketing please. It really is not rocket science.

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Reply posted by keith stephens, today at 12:24keith stephens

12:24

to Chester

"

Why don't you just reduce the cost of your frankly outrageous tickets?No-one cares about Tannoys, minfulness apps, or free coffee. Put the money into clean, new, efficient trains and cheaper ticketing please. It really is not rocket science.

"

keith stephens replied:

The problem is that the train companies have to pay for gold plated pensions for unnecessary staff. We need driverless trains but the unions wont let that happen.

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Comment posted by Jantra, today at 11:20Jantra

11:20

The only thing that would get me back on the trains would be lower prices.
Cardiff to York in two weeks standard class is £352 rtn

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Reply posted by Graham, today at 12:00Graham

12:00

to Jantra

"

The only thing that would get me back on the trains would be lower prices.Cardiff to York in two weeks standard class is £352 rtn

"

Graham replied:

Jantra....not sure when you are leaving Cardiff but on Thursday 10th I see the walk on fare is only £137.20 return for most of the day. That might still seem expensive but its a lot less than you see. Hope this helps.

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Comment posted by kimbers, today at 11:27kimbers

11:27

UK commuters pay more per KM than anywhere else in Europe

The irony is that many of our franchises are owned by state run rail companies.

The UK government pumps £bns into these franchises with subsidies (more than it had to pay to run British Rail!)

Madness, yet people still vote Tory

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Reply posted by TimRothwell, today at 12:04TimRothwell

12:04

to kimbers

"

UK commuters pay more per KM than anywhere else in EuropeThe irony is that many of our franchises are owned by state run rail companies.The UK government pumps £bns into these franchises with subsidies (more than it had to pay to run British Rail!) Madness, yet people still vote Tory

"

TimRothwell replied:

I commuted on British Rail for years. Dreadful service, filthy outdated rolling stock and at the mercy of the trade unions. Interesting that the Labour Government didn't renationalise!

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Comment posted by steve, today at 11:30steve

11:30

What nonsense. People make train journeys to work because they have to. If they do not have to (such as WFH) they will not. The is surely common sense? These "perks" will have absolutely no bearing on whether people will use the train. Who thought this one up? Good grief

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Reply posted by Bambi, today at 12:33Bambi

12:33

to steve

"

What nonsense. People make train journeys to work because they have to. If they do not have to (such as WFH) they will not. The is surely common sense? These "perks" will have absolutely no bearing on whether people will use the train. Who thought this one up? Good grief

"

Bambi replied:

The idiots at the train company who don't realise what hell commuting is.

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Comment posted by SLR, today at 11:31SLR

11:31

It is far too expensive to travel in the standard class at regular times. Cardiff to London should not be any more than £20. It is still cheaper than that to travel by car in petrol/electric. Throw in £10-15 for parking, still miles cheaper than the £87 I have to presently pay travelling off peak for a same day return. Make train travel very cheap & reserve the coffee as enema for your bosses.

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Reply posted by crod, today at 11:41crod

11:41

to SLR

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It is far too expensive to travel in the standard class at regular times. Cardiff to London should not be any more than £20. It is still cheaper than that to travel by car in petrol/electric. Throw in £10-15 for parking, still miles cheaper than the £87 I have to presently pay travelling off peak for a same day return. Make train travel very cheap & reserve the coffee as enema for your bosses.

"

crod replied:

Exactly. I went full EV last year and don't think I'll use trains again. I can't justify the cost for business travel by train v. 4p/ mile rate for electrics ( and I make a 2p/ mile profit on that) and can visit family in Salford for £10 return and Oxford for £20 return compared to £170ish for two of us by train to Oxford.

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Comment posted by return of the jock, today at 11:27return of the jock

11:27

People can get their own breakfast. What commuters want is a seat at a price that isn't extortionate, especially compared to flying

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Reply posted by spiffcorgi, today at 12:00spiffcorgi

12:00

to return of the jock

"

People can get their own breakfast. What commuters want is a seat at a price that isn't extortionate, especially compared to flying

"

spiffcorgi replied:

It's also a HILARIOUS idea that someone travelling long distance would buy a train ticket which costs £120 more than travelling by car in order to save £2 on a coffee.

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Comment posted by frazer, today at 11:18frazer

11:18

Here’s an idea - instead of HS2 which will marginally benefit the minority - invest in high use railway infrastructure and use efficiency savings to drive down prices and increase useage

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Reply posted by What-Ever, today at 11:45What-Ever

11:45

to frazer

"

Here’s an idea - instead of HS2 which will marginally benefit the minority - invest in high use railway infrastructure and use efficiency savings to drive down prices and increase useage

"

What-Ever replied:

Won't work.
The rail services need to be nationalised.
We're being ripped off, plain and simple.

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Comment posted by Truthbetold, today at 11:27Truthbetold

11:27

No excuse for continuing a reduced timetable. I'm traincrew,

I'm telling you there is no staff shortage crisis, nor as there ever been one. The only crisis has been train company made decisions. It was all about saving money by not running service. The perverse thing is this. Many of the services they cut were the most popular.

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Reply posted by One tack, today at 11:33One tack

11:33

to Truthbetold

"

No excuse for continuing a reduced timetable. I'm traincrew, I'm telling you there is no staff shortage crisis, nor as there ever been one. The only crisis has been train company made decisions. It was all about saving money by not running service. The perverse thing is this. Many of the services they cut were the most popular.

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One tack replied:

Trouble is management come from college with an economics degree.
When the need is a railway worker with savvy and experience.

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Comment posted by bunyrab1t, today at 11:27bunyrab1t

11:27

If they really want to "lure commuters back", the most effective thing to do would be to make fares more affordable. Next target, make the things run to schedule.

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Comment posted by Perton66, today at 11:40Perton66

11:40

I travel to work on the train 3 days a week. I just want a seat, some cleanliness , a bit of peace and quiet and a reliable service. No gimmicks thanks

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Reply posted by Bambi, today at 12:40Bambi

12:40

to Perton66

"

I travel to work on the train 3 days a week. I just want a seat, some cleanliness , a bit of peace and quiet and a reliable service. No gimmicks thanks

"

Bambi replied:

We should have 2 tickets one for seated one for unseated. I would choose the latter as I sit on my arse all day I now stand on the train. This means I am less stressed as I do not have to elbow fellow commuters to secure a seat.

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Comment posted by Blue, today at 11:40Blue

11:40

“Hey John, how do we get people back onto our trains?”

“Put money into improving railway quality, working to decrease the number of late trains, and adding extra carriages to overcrowded trains using a small fraction of the money funnelled to the top?”

“…”

“…Put money into giving people free coffee and mindfulness apps, so the problem is with them and not us?”

“PERFECT!”

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Comment posted by Williams, today at 11:36Williams

11:36

Cheaper fares and better service might work better.

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Reply posted by john, today at 11:37john

11:37

to Williams

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Cheaper fares and better service might work better.

"

john replied:

Could not agree more

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Comment posted by Name, today at 11:31Name

11:31

Yes, a free coffee will definitely encourage me to use your slow, dirty, overcrowded, unreliable and hideously expensive trains. Marvellous.

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Comment posted by Strawcat, today at 10:57Strawcat

10:57

Journeys would be more relaxing if they weren't ruined by people speaking loudly on their mobiles or streaming content on speakerphone.

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Reply posted by What-Ever, today at 11:44What-Ever

11:44

to Strawcat

"

Journeys would be more relaxing if they weren't ruined by people speaking loudly on their mobiles or streaming content on speakerphone.

"

What-Ever replied:

Buy a new mercedes and drive yourself, it's cheaper than the train.